frontpage.
newsnewestaskshowjobs

Made with ♥ by @iamnishanth

Open Source @Github

fp.

Open in hackernews

Ask HN: Why hasn't Swift gained wider adoption for backend?

7•grandimam•1y ago

Comments

xp84•1y ago
I would compare to other languages which share a primary trait, namely 'Invented by and backed by big proprietary closed-source-specialist company.'

Take C# for instance: Microsoft has a rich history of being very serious about the enterprise, and was there on the ground floor of the '.com' days with popular server software. MS leveraged knowledge developers had writing Visual Basic with VBS and also Jscript, a JS variant, to popularize ASP, then convinced people to move to C# which let you do both server and desktop with the same knowledge. And all this ran on the Microsoft server OS, a popular product, out of the box.

Let's compare this with Swift. Apple has never, ever been serious about the enterprise, hasn't sold any servers during its whole lifetime, and while I'm sure you can run server side Swift on a real Linux server instead of just a Mac, its relative newness (newer than every popular language but Kotlin) means there would need to be an affirmative reason, a big tangible benefit, to convince anyone to either switch, or to start their whole career/company with Swift without ever learning anything else. Much the opposite in my humble opinion - you have Apple treating developers poorly with their aggressive rent-seeking behavior. I would never want to ditch another language that isn't controlled by one firm, to work on a platform that, though nominally 'OSS,' exists purely for Apple's benefit and is controlled by them.

Server-side Swift has one thing going for it: You can leverage your skills gained making iOS native stuff. Unfortunately, it seems to me that few companies besides indie 'Apple-only' devs even want to use 'iOS Swift' since it's limited to Apple platforms and most companies want cross-platform mobile apps. So the number of people out there who are 'Swift experts' and would find that to be the most compelling server-side environment is utterly dwarfed by people who have that level of mastery of JS, Python, Java, C#, Kotlin, PHP, Ruby, Go, etc. Which is of course a Catch-22, 'nobody uses server-side Swift because it's not popular enough to support a great community.'

To kick off a new project with a Swift backend would be to say "I trust Apple unconditionally, and also I have no intention of ever needing to hire anyone to help with this."

mattmanser•1y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Server
xp84•1y ago
But that was dead by the time Swift came out. I apologize for my poor wording.
john_the_writer•1y ago
I like the last bit. Hiring would be a nightmare. Most serious BE dev (myself included) don't have time to learn a new language that I can only use at a handful (or single company). I want the language I spend the most time with to be something I could take to a recruiter (should I need to).

I worked at a place that worked with Delphi, and for various reasons I had to use it exclusively for a few years. No recruiter would touch me. Not until I got some time with Rails did I have a chance to escape.

As a former mobile dev, I'd also like to add, being an app dev vs BE dev isn't just about the code either.. It's a very different way of looking at problems. The skills might transfer, but they're living in different worlds. The language isn't the only obstacle.

tssva•1y ago
" Apple has never, ever been serious about the enterprise, hasn't sold any servers during its whole lifetime,"

Apple has most definitely sold servers during its lifetime. The Xserve line for example.

xp84•1y ago
Excuse me, I worded it super poorly. I meant Swift's whole lifetime. The Xserve was long dead. I once "sold" XServes (was trained to, but nobody ever bought one from me) at Apple Retail.
benoau•1y ago
Might make sense if you're an app developer but outside of that, even within that TBH, it's pretty niche.
manter•1y ago
Swift is tightly bound to the Apple ecosystem (even though it can run outside of it), both in tooling, the ecosystem, and developer's perceptions.

These things all feed into each other.

If you're in the (vast, vast) majority of Swift developers then you're writing apps for iOS, MacOS, etc. This means outside of that context Swift goes from being a relatively popular language with a strong ecosystem to an incredibly niche one.

One angle where this could gain traction is devs writing a server side backend for their Apple app - but this use case is sliced apart in practice.

- Teams that start off wanting to use the same language for the app and the backend are likely to pick React Native or similar.

- The larger teams that want/need to write their app natively likely have devs that write the apps and devs that write the server code - so the desire the for language to be the same is lower.

- The pool of developers you could hire that have backend experience and swift experience is much much smaller than either of those two factors alone.

On a pure 'is this language good enough for the problem' level - sure, swift could do the job.

But that's also true of almost every other language.

timeon•1y ago
Just my anecdote. I was excited about Swift when it came out. Then I realized that I can't use my own apps on my phone for more than a week. Which, unfortunately, led my to use web technologies. And with that into completely different tech stack for backend/frontend.
frou_dh•1y ago
Because it's a massively competitive space, and being passably good ("Hey guys, the toolchain and these libraries do actually run on Linux. Also we have XYZ Working Group.") is not sufficient to get peoples' attention.
carlhung•1y ago
It is a pretty shit language. I use Swift for living. It has a lot of special keywords, Features, etc. they keep adding new keywords to fix specific issues. it is a distasteful language.

The Transformation of Documents: Repositories Are the New Unit of Knowledge Work

https://blog.sigplan.org/2026/05/15/the-transformation-of-documents-repositories-are-the-new-unit...
1•rbanffy•16s ago•0 comments

Venus Surface Formations Puzzle Planetary Scientists

https://www.universetoday.com/articles/bizarre-venus-surface-formations-puzzle-planetary-scientists
1•rbanffy•48s ago•0 comments

Recent Developments in LLM Architectures: KV Sharing, MHC, Compressed Attention

https://magazine.sebastianraschka.com/p/recent-developments-in-llm-architectures
1•vismit2000•5m ago•0 comments

Wow – these are the AI sources worth paying attention to

https://fav0.com/en/2026-05-16/
1•Justin3go•10m ago•0 comments

Research paper of Atlantic white shark migratory patterns

https://www.int-res.com/abstracts/meps/v580/p1-16
1•realsharkymark•12m ago•1 comments

Someone forked my repo, then submitted a PR written by Claude

https://github.com/dacracot/Klondike3-Simulator/pull/53
2•dacracot•16m ago•1 comments

Math, Bits, Magic, and a Bit of Abnormal C Programming

https://alexeev-dev.bearblog.dev/math-bits-magic-and-a-bit-of-abnormal-c-programming/
1•alexeev-prog•16m ago•1 comments

OpenAI launches ChatGPT for personal finance, will let you connect bank accounts

https://techcrunch.com/2026/05/15/openai-launches-chatgpt-for-personal-finance-will-let-you-conne...
1•mwexler•18m ago•1 comments

Jane Street Interview Simulator

https://janestreet.gg/
1•throwaway2037•19m ago•1 comments

Popular node-IPC NPM package compromised to steal credentials

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/popular-node-ipc-npm-package-compromised-to-steal-...
1•Brajeshwar•22m ago•0 comments

Virtual memory explained as a dialogue between a process and the Linux kernel

https://blog.codingconfessions.com/p/virtual-memory
2•wizerno•23m ago•0 comments

Ask HN: Do you still spend time maintaining Claude.md / AGENTS.md files?

2•david_d8912•24m ago•0 comments

MiniPlasma

https://github.com/Nightmare-Eclipse/MiniPlasma
1•throwaway2027•26m ago•0 comments

Why 'Smart' Products Have Started to Look Like the Dumb Choice

https://www.nytimes.com/2026/05/14/magazine/dumb-phones-tvs-retronym-smart-tech.html
2•reaperducer•27m ago•0 comments

MiniPlasma, a Powerful LPE

https://deadeclipse666.blogspot.com/2026/05/
2•throwaway2027•27m ago•0 comments

Why DKIM Fails and How to Fix Every Type of Alignment Error

https://dmarcguard.io/blog/dkim-alignment-failure-fix/
2•meysamazad•28m ago•0 comments

The world model that every AI godfather is racing to figure out

https://fortune.com/2026/04/23/goldman-sachs-ai-world-model-missing-link/
1•fcpguru•29m ago•2 comments

US Government openly schemes to indict Raúl Castro as prelude to invading Cuba

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2026/05/16/raul-castro-cuba-indictment-trump-invasio...
3•ck2•30m ago•1 comments

Show HN: Layrr – Point Click and Edit any site

https://www.npmjs.com/package/layrr
1•kiranjohns•30m ago•0 comments

What Is JEPA? Joint Embedding Predictive Architecture Framework Prediction

https://medium.com/@tahirbalarabe2/what-is-jepa-085ca776013a
1•fcpguru•31m ago•0 comments

Google sued for firing staff who tried to follow 'Don't be evil' motto (2021)

https://www.theregister.com/on-prem/2021/12/01/google-sued-for-firing-staff-who-claim-they-tried-...
1•gurjeet•34m ago•0 comments

Show HN: League of Early Adopters – Give product feedback, get product feedback

https://sitenote.ai/league-of-early-adopters
1•sarim•37m ago•1 comments

AI Agents Are Tools, Not Replacements

https://derogab.com/2026/05/15/AI-Tools-Not-Replacements/
1•derogab•43m ago•1 comments

My Mom taught me HTML (and the rest was history)

https://ascii-tweezers.bearblog.dev/my-mom-taught-me-html-and-the-rest-was-history/
1•speckx•44m ago•0 comments

Show HN: A chess.com profiler that runs Stockfish in the browser

https://the-law-1.github.io/chess-insights/
1•the_law•45m ago•0 comments

Microsoft Exchange, Windows 11 hacked on second day of Pwn2Own

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/pwn2own-day-two-hackers-demo-microsoft-exchange-wi...
2•Brajeshwar•45m ago•0 comments

Frink – programming language designed to make physical calculations simple

https://frinklang.org/#AboutFrink
1•gurjeet•46m ago•0 comments

Auto-Improving Software

https://twitter.com/ashpreetbedi/status/2053885390717890757
1•gmays•49m ago•0 comments

Bluesky Radio – Hosted by Opus 4.7

https://bskyrad.io/
2•wilted-iris•49m ago•0 comments

Ruby-charts: Generate pie, bar, and line charts from data files

https://github.com/ggerman/ruby-charts
2•thunderbong•50m ago•0 comments