This is a kind of conservatism that seems borderline extinct, for reasons that might intersect with the thesis of the article.
Still, I like trying to "steel man" the opposing argument.
Without the use of governmental power that the article describes, would things like segregation, red lining, or extreme marginalization of LGBTQ people have ever ended?
Consider that left-handed people were stigmatized for thousands of years for reasons that seem absurd and ridiculous to almost everyone now. In some cultures being left-handed and failing to "convert" could get you killed. Traditional cultural taboos can be unbelievably sticky. It's probably something humans evolved to do as a survival strategy since some taboos, particularly those involving hygiene or practices for ensuring food supply, have extreme survival value. Abandon a taboo that kept a disease at bay or ensured next year's crops will grow, and you all die. But it's a bias that also allows very irrational pointless and cruel taboos to persist forever.
Now imagine that you are a member of one of these groups. Are you going to read some Hayek and decide that it is more prudent and wise to forego the use of government power to improve your lot? Are peopler really going to do that?
I think one of the reasons that this kind of libertarian conservatism has fallen far out of favor not just in the US but globally is that the answer is no. Whether the sphere is cultural or economic, when people run out of options to improve their lot they are never content to just sit around and wait out of some prudent respect for the balance of power. At some point the desire for action wins and the balance of power is broken.
... and with things like cultural taboos, what other levers are there?
I suppose there are economic ones. If you don't like social conservatism, vote with your dollars. Ultimately this includes moving away from places that are too rigid in their thinking, which ultimately harms these places economically.
But the counter-argument there is: people tend to cling so hard to their cultural taboos that they will endure economic hardship to preserve them. So then what you get are large impoverished regions of the country and sectors of the economy, and that too is recipe for discontent and revolt.
bediger4000•9mo ago
> Ultimately this includes moving away from places that are too rigid
Would the "Great Migration" of African Americans out of the south count as an example?
api•9mo ago
Yes it probably would, as would the contemporary emptying of skilled labor from small towns and more conservative cities.
Chasing jobs is one reason people do this, but fleeing boring repressive and rigid culture is another. The jobs thing is a feedback loop: the more intelligent ambitious young people come to a place, the more it grows. The allure of its openness and liberalism is one of the forces that made California the world’s fourth largest economy.
bediger4000•9mo ago
As example of such places trying to staunch the flow, there's the "Tulsa Remote" program (https://www.tulsaremote.com/) where City of Tulsa offers a $10,000 bonus to people who move there to do a remote job. The page says more than 3,500 remote workers have moved to Tulsa, the program apparently started in November of 2018. That's 6.5 years, so 538 remote workers moved to Tulsa every year. Retention rate would be interesting.
I'm not sue if "Tulsa Remote" is still happening, the "featured blog posts" are all literally lorem ipsum text.
api•9mo ago
Still, I like trying to "steel man" the opposing argument.
Without the use of governmental power that the article describes, would things like segregation, red lining, or extreme marginalization of LGBTQ people have ever ended?
Consider that left-handed people were stigmatized for thousands of years for reasons that seem absurd and ridiculous to almost everyone now. In some cultures being left-handed and failing to "convert" could get you killed. Traditional cultural taboos can be unbelievably sticky. It's probably something humans evolved to do as a survival strategy since some taboos, particularly those involving hygiene or practices for ensuring food supply, have extreme survival value. Abandon a taboo that kept a disease at bay or ensured next year's crops will grow, and you all die. But it's a bias that also allows very irrational pointless and cruel taboos to persist forever.
Now imagine that you are a member of one of these groups. Are you going to read some Hayek and decide that it is more prudent and wise to forego the use of government power to improve your lot? Are peopler really going to do that?
I think one of the reasons that this kind of libertarian conservatism has fallen far out of favor not just in the US but globally is that the answer is no. Whether the sphere is cultural or economic, when people run out of options to improve their lot they are never content to just sit around and wait out of some prudent respect for the balance of power. At some point the desire for action wins and the balance of power is broken.
... and with things like cultural taboos, what other levers are there?
I suppose there are economic ones. If you don't like social conservatism, vote with your dollars. Ultimately this includes moving away from places that are too rigid in their thinking, which ultimately harms these places economically.
But the counter-argument there is: people tend to cling so hard to their cultural taboos that they will endure economic hardship to preserve them. So then what you get are large impoverished regions of the country and sectors of the economy, and that too is recipe for discontent and revolt.
bediger4000•9mo ago
Would the "Great Migration" of African Americans out of the south count as an example?
api•9mo ago
Chasing jobs is one reason people do this, but fleeing boring repressive and rigid culture is another. The jobs thing is a feedback loop: the more intelligent ambitious young people come to a place, the more it grows. The allure of its openness and liberalism is one of the forces that made California the world’s fourth largest economy.
bediger4000•9mo ago
I'm not sue if "Tulsa Remote" is still happening, the "featured blog posts" are all literally lorem ipsum text.