That's a very good feeling. Of course not everything in life has played out exactly how I wanted, and there are always regrets about paths not taken
But ultimately I had an idea what I wanted from life and I mostly have it now
I had to make compromises on a lot of things, but it was worth it to get this far
I don't live in the city that I wanted to settle down in, but I own my own house where I live now
I had to leave family and friends behind in my hometown, but I have met new people and I have a new family where I live now
I don't work in my dream job, but I have built a solid career
I think the past me would be really happy to know what the future held for me, even if it did mean I am not that same person anymore
Edit: This is maybe a bit off topic but I think the recent cultural focus on "identity" (as in, "who am I") has been kind of negative for people
What worked really well for me was not getting wrapped up in "who am I" and instead focusing on "who do I want to be"
I've seen many friends and acquaintances fall off and become miserable because they got mired in their identity (both sexual and otherwise).
Meanwhile I am one of the most successful people I know of from the people I grew up with. Actually, I'm one of the most successful people in my entire country (top 3% based on income, anyways)
Maybe it's a privilege to not have to worry about "who am I", but I really do think "who do I want to be" is just a much better approach. It's something you can actually take action to achieve
But when I was a bit older I knew "I want to do something with computers", because my family had a windows 3.1 computer and I liked to play games on it. Of course at the time I had no idea what anyone even did with computers. I also had no idea that in the future every single job that exists would be "something to do with computers"
I started taking computer classes in high school which got me into programming, because I wanted to make games. This is a pretty common pipeline for Millennial programmers I think
After that I went to a local university and took Computer Science. Luckily I was just dumb enough to stick with it the whole time and get a bachelors. I say dumb enough somewhat ironically. Obviously doing a BSc in Compsci takes a bit of smarts, but I had friends who became convinced they were too smart to bother with a degree, and all of them who dropped out to pursue their own path without the degree are much worse off than I am now
Anyways, after my degree I no longer wanted to work in games. I wanted to work in embedded systems. Turns out there weren't many opportunities to work in embedded systems in my local market so I got into web dev. Like I said, not my dream job, but I'm very good at it and it has been a really successful career.
So I guess to summarize:
Yes I was pretty lucky to somewhat choose a direction when I was young, even if I didn't know more than "work with computers".
However the dream path still wasn't exactly a straightforward arrow from Ninja Turtle to Web Dev. At every single step it felt like I was compromising on my dreams.
Turns out that compromise can be really good though
I didn't grow up to be a Ninja Turtle
Although I may have to make a point of this sometime now, just for kicks
Carl Jung investigated this with his "puer-aeternus" (the child that was promised) and "senex" (old man) archetypes. A really interesting read, if you have time for that. In essence I think he advocated a balance, where one starts at childhood, becomes a cynical grown-up and then re-integrates his childhood fantasies back into his character, but now in a less naive and wiser way.
That's cultural bias right there. It happens only if you tell them to dream impossible big things. If you don't teach children that astronauts exist, they will likely dream to become their teacher or the janitor at school, especially the friendly, nice ones.
I now have red sport-touring bike and a beautiful wife so, mission accomplished?
I was bullied relentlessly in elementary school, I got into fistfights constantly
My family didn't have a ton of money, we were very blue collar. My dad worked his way up to manager at a tool store. I am not some guy who went to an ivy league. I took student loans just to attend a local community college because I could not afford to relocate to a good university even though I had the grades. I just didn't have scholarship tier grades. I wasn't getting a free ride anywhere
I had some privileges, for sure. Having a loving family that supported me is a big one. Having the intelligence and just enough work ethic to be successful in school.
But man, I worked evenings in fast food jobs during high school to afford a car because my family absolutely could not afford to buy me even a clunker
Edit: And I needed this car desperately, because there was no nearby transit I could use to eventually get to college, nevermind getting to other, slightly better part time jobs
Like there's privilege, I acknowledge but maybe dial it back from "extreme privilege"?
Not to minimize but most of your adversity is "normal" almost everyone has had these struggles and they are also easily paved over with money. Also telling how it is all past tense. you described a normal "middle class " childhood through the economic collapse of the 2000s.
I can see why you would get that impression, but what do you want from me here? From my perspective I have worked very hard to get to this place
For context, I started out 15ish years ago making ~28k USD/year as a junior software dev. I suspect this is pretty low for most people on this forum, even as a junior?
Now I make ~98k USD as a senior software dev, 15 years later. I suspect that is much lower than "top 3% of earners in Canada" sounded like? Edit: For context this would 'only' put me in the top 13% of American earners. I suspect many people on this forum do much better than I do, and the top 3% of American earners make my income look like a joke
I don't think I fit the archetype of "rich guy posting online" that you have projected on me. I do really well for myself yes, within my country and within my context, but I'm not exactly the Bezos of Canada.
> most people concerned with identity because it's an everyday struggle to make identity fit reality and most people have way too much to lose to risk rocking the boat
It is way harder to make reality fit your identity than it is to modify your identity to fit reality
> Also telling how it is all past tense. you described a normal "middle class " childhood through the economic collapse of the 2000s
By strict definition it was lower class, not middle class. But yes, lower class in the 90s and 00s was much more comfortable than it is today, you're right about that
Never projected any solid path, took every day as it went and just (rather well) recognized those crucial moments in life where choices are made that massively affect rest of the life. What to study, how hard to study, where to move (or not) after university, partners, if and which job to change, if and where to move further etc. But it was always just focus on now and maybe next step at most.
Anyway the path I ended up taking I wouldn't make up even in my wildest dreams. Surpassed expectations massively of all folks that knew me, be it peers or family. And overall it wasn't hard at all for me, but for others who would like to jump to last (most successful) moves it would be, since they didn't go through all those steps I did before.
Moved between 3 countries within Europe (nobody from my peers did that, max 1 and settle - nothing special on its own, but I came from very settle-asap environment). Increased my salary of Java dev cca 30-40x compared to first full time job with cca same role, ending up in maybe top 0.1% within Europe (I know, not SV, but still), while still just 100% employed (actually 90% now with 50 paid vacation days, what a deal). Living in more beautiful place than I imagined existed, in society I am proud to be part of that never ceases to amaze me (Switzerland). Backpacked the world in remote 3rd countries when most folks I know went for sunbathing at nearest beach. Picked up passions that nobody I knew back home did like climbing, alpinism, diving, ski touring, paragliding and so on.
Started very low, so far ended rather high. But it can all easily come crashing down like house of cards, well aware of that. Had a big paragliding accident last year, both legs broken, still some consequences. Good for yet another perspective alignment. Have properly wonderful small kids, thats main focus now. With kids, they take over life so effectively I don't have time nor even will for such questions. So focusing on now, and maybe next (small, not physical rather financial) move.
Am I person I used to be? Hell no I am completely different person, from core up to the rest, better, more resilient and tolerant, vastly more knowledgeable about people and world, yet always learning (ie this site is amazing for that, there is no topic not worthy learning)
My knee jerk reaction to this was "how can anyone be anything but 'just who they are'". I think I get what you mean though. Many people dream much bigger than what they are actually capable of accomplishing. Maybe that was my real advantage. I've always been pretty grounded, and I've never really dreamed bigger than I could accomplish.
It may be that by not dreaming big I'm not reaching the absolute fullest potential I could, but it also means I accomplish many of the things I set out to do which is also a good feeling
I'm a firm believer in building strong foundations before reaching for the stars, and I guess my path somewhat embodies that
> I guess most people think of who they want to become personality-wise but maybe it's just me
Again I sort of think a lot of this boils down to people not having a good sense of their own capabilities. If your goals and your capabilities aren't aligned, you're very likely to crash out imo
not have to worry about "who am I", but I really do think "who do I want to be" is just a much better approach
> many become miserable because they got mired in their identity sexual and otherwise
I think one factor is that we're always looking for a balance between doing what we want and doing what's right. When they're not the same in someone's conscience, they look for external approval that what they want isn't wrong or bad or harmful, so they can keep doing it. Especially sexually.
There's also virtue signalling as a way to get social credit, which is also usually geared towards getting something that you want, but with it either being not justified or not earned.
Or, as someone much smarter than me once said, "When I think of all I have said, I envy the mute".
When I regret saying something, it's almost always something mean.
5 years ago I thought I was an imbecile, but now I know it for a fact that I am :)
No for real though. It's a cliche but 5-10 years ago I actually thought I knew everything, now I know just how much I don't know
These days, I know less than ever!
I still can be but at some point I recognized that my personality and behavior was driving people away from me and also it made me miserable to be that way. I made a conscious effort to change
Actually, this is somewhat also related to the idea I posted elsewhere in this thread, about being inputs into our own system.
When I wanted to stop being so miserable to be around, I set a goal for myself: "I am going to try to make at least one person smile every day"
I don't think I managed to every day, but it made me take note when I did make people smile. It felt good, partly because I made someone else happy, partly because I was accomplishing the goal I set for myself
I think it was a very key component of becoming a happier person myself
For the first time in my life I have actual regrets. Which is strange and new. But again it's not like what I wanted to have happened changed.
"Any headline that ends in a question mark can be answered by the word no."
Wait, what? Doesn't the Ship of Thesseus apply to our character just as much as to our body? And if so, doesn't that make it a philosophical question, and absolutely not scientific, as character is immaterial?
I might be just a super advanced neural net (like a language model) with self-reflection and so many self-doubts.
I seem to be a conscious entity, and I have access to the physical memory store in my brain, but am "I" actually going to survive falling asleep tonight? Or am "I" like a fire that gets extinguished, with a new one to be lit in my place tomorrow morning, using the same pile of half burnt logs?
The old sci-fi/philosophy teleportation question addresses this with the concept of physically destroying and reconstructing a body, but I don't know if we need near magic tech to elicit the problem.
We turn our conscious selves off for periods of deep sleep every day (or two, or three... but there is a definite limit). Do we really survive this transition?
No, agreed, you’re like a neural net, it’s why they decided to call them “neural”, right? Because they resemble how brains work, correct if wrong.
I’ve wondered same thing. Hoping I haven’t said anything too stupid over the years.
When I was first starting my practice I found Thich Nhat Hanh's translation of the heart sutra [1], Thanissaro Bhikkhu's book on anatman [2], and the four thoughts from ngondro [3] to be the most insightful.
[1] https://plumvillage.org/about/thich-nhat-hanh/letters/thich-... [2] https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/thanissaro/selve... [3] https://www.shambhala.com/videos/mingyur-rinpoche-on-the-fou...
Yes, for sure we are limited by our biology. Someone born crippled will never be an olympic body builder. Someone born stupid will never be a math researcher.
And of course we have a lot of inputs like family, upbringing, schooling, culture, etc which all shape us
However, humans are capable of being inputs into our own system as well. It is not easy, necessarily, but I do strongly believe that we are capable of shaping our own identities as a result of being able to be our own inputs.
We can also choose to relocate, change friend groups, change careers, whatever else we need to do to change our external inputs as well
Of course we are limited by physical reality and limited by things like money and opportunity, our intelligence and aptitude and such, but as long as we can find something within our capabilities, we can shape ourselves into it
For example, I am nearly 40. I have ice skated my whole life but never used to play ice hockey.
I'm never going to play in a pro league, I'm already too old even if I was phenomenal somehow. But it is well within my capability to join a beginner old timers league and play with people my skill level if I want to
These days it's really easy to accumulate synthetic memory material in the form of thousands of photos and videos. My kids are covered that way. The hard part is still having access to them a generation later. At least the sparse material from back then survives as fading photographs in a physical album. Not so sure about the flood of material accumulating on people's phones these days. Mine lives on reliable backups but I figure once I'm gone all that digital data will bit rot like everyone else's.
As for "same person"? Of course not. Both body and mind change over time as you accumulate life experiences, both good and bad. It's a continuum of change. I'd have quite a bit of stuff to tell my 30 year ago self. Don't know if he would listen.
CD-R was thought of that way, but wasn't really stable in the long term at a usable price point.
This might get better in the future though. We seem to be reaching the end of technology's exponential growth phase (famous last words, I know). Perhaps the pace of change will slow and standards will start lasting longer as a result.
These things tell stories that reinforce certain narratives. You think your kids are covered but how? When do take a photo? Which ones do you dump, which ones do you look at later?
It’s a weird uncanny synthetic memory thing when OS AI sorts through photos as well.
Anyways, I don’t think younger me would listen either.
A mind game that I sometimes play: Think of a particularly pleasant "golden glow of nostalgia" memory (or set of photos), and then fill it in with surrounding detail. Not stuff that you remember exactly but context. The boring or even annoying stuff. What if that were recorded too? Why, then browsing around in old recordings would be no more interesting than leading one's current life. Nostalgia, whether in the mind or in recorded media, filters down to the "worth remembering" highlights for a reason.
I have a four year as well and we go on grand adventures in the mountains and all over really. I think about this quote and decide that I’m shaping my kids spirit, their courage, their confidence regardless of if they’ll remember it. Beyond that in the present we experience joy and curiosity and laughter and life! It’s silly to lament childhood amnesia because I dont aim to catalog things and check things off a list but experience a fun and interesting life with my family.
It hurts to change oneself but so glad I am not in the place I was before.
> "And do you know what Nicholas said? I remember it plainly. He said that he doesn't believe that we become different people as we age. No, he says he believes we become _more_ people. We're still the kids we were, but we're also the people who've lived all the different ages since that time. A whole bunch of different people rolled up into one -- that's how Nicholas sees it. And I can't say that I disagree. How else to explain that sometimes I want to run and jump the way I used to -- but can't anymore -- yet at the same time enjoy sitting with a cup of coffee and a newspaper in a way you couldn't have paid me to do as a boy? Well, it's a wonder."
Here's another way this rings true. When I look at my wife, to whom I've been married for 17 years, I don't just see her as she is now. I see her as she has been ever since I've met her. I am married to a 44-year-old and a 24-year-old, and a woman of every age in between.
Are you the same person you used to be as a child? - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33828278 - Dec 2022 (6 comments)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPtopvsxmZY (the main part starts about 5 minutes in, some salty text)
I still struggle with "disappointing" my early 20's self. He might cringe at some things.
I recently was at a Gala for a Rabbi, who wasn't born religious. His secular parents were there, and he thanked them for teaching him to always seek truth and to priories that pursuit. The pursuit itself took him to a different area (they are secular, he found truth in Judaism) but he was still operating on their parameters, just took them to a logical conclusion for himself.
Similarly, I think a 5 year old version of myself would not be too disappointed with the 44 year old version of myself, because to a large extent I then and now share my family's core values.
At the same time, you evolve in response to where you are. So for example I always knew I wanted a family, but I had to "grow up/evolve" to be someone that my someone like my wife would marry, and evolve again was we had 1, 2, and now 3 kids. Am I a different person as a father than as a single guy in NYC? Yeah. Is it a natural evolution - perhaps a richer manifestation what was always potential? Doubly yeah.
The other thing is - we have a lot more room to evolve aspects of ourselves, even as adults. For example I've personally always been very upfront, very intense, very intolerant of fuckups. All these things have ameliorated as I became a father - not because I betrayed some aspect of my personality, but because underlying that intensity was a deep care about the outcome, and with little kids, something different is required to attain the outcomes.
So things you think are "you" - you zoom out and just see as tools, and then realize that other tools are more appropriate to pursue your actual values.
Analogously from fatherhood, being a leader of larger and larger organizations has similar effect. The deep intrinsic set of abilities and behaviors that made me a rockstar engineer IC, is not the same as what makes me successful as a product leader. So as I step into these different roles, I have to figure out what's not working - and to figure out if that's really "intrinsic parts of me" that are in the way, or is there a perspective that lets me change those things while remaining true to myself.
So again thinking back to my 5 year old self, did I have what it takes to be a good father/leader? Obviously not. But I had some value of "not sucking at those things when I become them, and evolving in response" somewhere in there. So when I encountered those things, it wasn't a betrayal of self to evolve.
My oldest kid is almost 5, and I am realizing how much you get to shape some of their values/ideas. For example if I don't let them watch TV/videos, I always say "it's because this stuff doesn't make you smarter. But we watch certain things because they do make you smarter." It's less to win an argument about a particular TV moment but more to create a life long memory "dad always cared that we did things that made us smarter" kind of thing. I am sure my kids will end up in plenty situations I can't possibly anticipate but there's hope that "which one will make me smarter" is one lens they'll use to decide in their own evolution.
throwanem•7h ago