Vote with your dollars (and of course vote with your vote!).
It's also wild to me that some of the best reporting on this administration has been coming from Verge and Wired.
Perhaps that should change.
What we need is people refusing to refuel them or service their aircraft.
Ricardo Prada Vásquez, a Venezuelan man whose family says he was “disappeared” and who wasn’t included on a previously leaked government list of people sent to a notorious mega prison in El Salvador, was included on a private airline’s flight manifest to the country, according to hacked airline data obtained and analyzed by 404 Media."
Those are the first two paragraphs of the story, what do you think is missing that would help your comprehension of the situation?
The problem is that he hasn’t had an opportunity to plead his case.
Good law enforcement officers regularly make honest mistakes. Courts are a safeguard against this.
Imagine that you get caught up in an immigration raid. Maybe you were at a Mexican restaurant. ICE shows up and half the staff quickly sit at tables pretending to be customers. ICE arrests everyone, including you.
Will ICE let you go home to go look for your birth certificate? If your wife hires a lawyer what process will your lawyer use to present your birth certificate to ICE?
Due process and the rule of law protects you from the arbitrary power of the state.
Maybe everyone is calling him a gang member to cover their own asses?
Without a hearing we don’t know.
There is perhaps some “reason” this happened to him that the news doesn’t know yet, but it can’t possibly be a good enough reason to do this. I think it’s unlikely many of these men are violent criminals, but even if they are, the law should be followed and their family and lawyers should know where they are.
MAGA say stuff like “if you want to immigrate here or seek asylum, there’s a process; don’t do it illegally.” The same is true of deportation. While I don’t think it should be a big priority, I would be a lot less angry about deportations if the law and basic human decency was being followed while doing it.
If you are unscrupulous enough to hack someone else’s data, you are not trustworthy enough for me to trust that you haven’t manipulated the data you claim you have hacked.
Seems to me bad actions are just “bad”.
— Terry Pratchett, The Fifth Elephant
Can you say that about the government, media, or activist hackers? I know I can’t.
Who would provide communication and awareness on this specific issue, then? Someone/something specific. Not just "not people I can't trust", that's a negative set.
Maybe a good start is someone who doesn’t break the law to do it?
I mean the issue is caused by a government breaking its own laws, correct? Isn’t that what’s bad? I guess I don’t see how breaking a law to expose someone else breaking a law makes you virtuous and trustworthy.
Because you're only just saying "I don't believe anything because everyone lies" and you can't name a specific person/group/entity that you'd trust, it's just this nebulous and vague "people who don't break the law".
So again, who would you trust to break this story (assuming, for the sake of argument, that the allegations are correct)? Because so far you have "not the media", "not the government" and "not people involved".
Do you agree that a reporter could write a story about a deportee’s name being left off a deportation list and the subsequent government admission that the person was in fact deported without ignoring or perhaps burying the fact that the deported was legally deported after a judge ordered them deported?
Do you agree that a government or government official could provide accurate information the first time when questioned about someone who was detained and deported?
Those are the types of people that I would consider trustworthy. None of that happened here which fans the flames of my skepticism.
So…like I said…who you going to trust? The government, the media, the hackers? All are bad actors here. Ain’t no one here with clean hands…including you by suggesting that due process wasn’t provided when the article you are commenting about actually said that it was.
sherdil2022•9mo ago
EnPissant•9mo ago
It's more accurate to get your worldview from actual history than Hollywood movies.
tombert•9mo ago
Movies are a cultural shorthand.
Yeul•9mo ago
The only difference is that the American elite is now in on it too. For whatever reasons I do not know.
wizzwizz4•9mo ago
dragonwriter•9mo ago
No, it is annews story, and widepsread concerns are often reported on; its not widely reported on because the media is a mix of institutiins which tend to be either in support of the Administration doing it or in fear of being targeted in retaliation for reporting on topics like that.
EnPissant•9mo ago
Here is a list of major news media outlets from Wikipedia[1].
Which of the following do you think either supports the current administration or fears being targeted by it?
ABC News, CBS News, CNN, Fox News Channel, MSNBC, NBC News, The New York Times, USA Today, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, Politico, Bloomberg, Vice News, HBO, HuffPost, TMZ, CNET, NPR, The Hollywood Reporter, Newsweek, The New Yorker, Time , U.S. News & World Report
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_media_in_the_United_State...
sorcerer-mar•9mo ago
Unless you think threats of DOJ investigation, pulling broadcast licenses, or extremely expensive lawsuits don't produce fear? In that case you should let authoritarians know their playbook is out of date. Of course it's not, which is why authoritarians follow such a distinct pattern.
EnPissant•9mo ago
I suspect people will say they are critical of him, but "not enough" or cherry-pick 1 or 2 neutral headlines in a sea of critical ones.
sorcerer-mar•9mo ago
Oh yeah and that they wouldn't publish a cartoon poking fun at the kleptocracy. The artist resigned in protest and went on to win a Pulitzer, which WaPo had no problem taking credit for.
Is it fair to say that Navalny didn't fear Putin because he was actually quite vocal against Putin?
EnPissant•9mo ago
sorcerer-mar•9mo ago
EnPissant•9mo ago
sorcerer-mar•9mo ago
I see. So “in fear of being targeted in retaliation” then?
ZeroGravitas•9mo ago
Literally things that you'd expect to find in an Alan Moore dystopian graphic novel, or as world building background TV headlines in a gritty Robocop described in peppy business as usual terms.
The top one is an alcoholic Fox News host being appointed as an Attorney General to replace a disastrous one that couldn't even get Republican support to be confirmed, a brief summary of his 120 days:
> He represented Jan. 6 defendants before getting the job, punished and demoted their prosecutors when he got it, and launched a series of ideological investigations (wokeness in medical journals, a five-year old Chuck Schumer gaffe) that went nowhere.
alabastervlog•9mo ago
bigbadfeline•9mo ago
They all support it and none of them is afraid of being targeted because... they all support it, albeit in ways that are discernible only to those who can read between the lines.
wizzwizz4•9mo ago
> Notably, 69% of the global population expresses a willingness to contribute 1% of their personal income, 86% endorse pro-climate social norms and 89% demand intensified political action. […] Despite these encouraging statistics, we document that the world is in a state of pluralistic ignorance, wherein individuals around the globe systematically underestimate the willingness of their fellow citizens to act.
The situation is similar in the US: the majority of people don't think the government should be kidnapping citizens from their homes and shipping them off to foreign prisons without trial, but they also think everyone else is okay with it.
"It's a widespread concern" is not a news story, unless and until someone does the research and confirms it. Otherwise, how do the journalists know it's the case? And investigative journalists aren't usually running large-scale population studies.
ZeroGravitas•9mo ago
I'd argue it's fairly directly responsible for the small number who don't support climate action too.
And I think the same applies to governments kidnapping people and ignoring courts who tell them it's illegal.
bborud•9mo ago
When I cancelled my Washington Post subscription I wrote a letter to the editor. The important part of that letter was under what set of circumstances I might start trusting the Washington Post again. I never got a response. Not that I expected one. I’m sure they were inundated with angry letters at the time.
From time to time I write letters. To journalists, to leaders, I even wrote our prime minister once - and got a reply. Sometimes they are letters of support when someone has stuck their neck out and deserves a pat on the back. Or when someone has done good work. Too often they are letters telling people to do their job properly or to behave like adults. A lot of politicians and members of the press need a reminder to behave like adults and do their job these days. To do the demanding part of their job. Not just the part that is easy or that brings in campaign contributions or easy sales.
I never expect people to respond. But sometimes they do. This means I’ve reached people.
01HNNWZ0MV43FF•9mo ago
The purpose of most news companies is to make money by selling ads. Real news would have to come from something that doesn't run ads and makes their money another way
mystified5016•9mo ago
ZeroGravitas•9mo ago
Rupert Murdoch did not buy the Wall Street Journal to help better inform the populace.
_DeadFred_•9mo ago
The government has forgotten it can only do what it does with the consent of the people, and that a small minority could really frustrate things if they truly wanted to.
bonestamp2•9mo ago
pstuart•9mo ago
Because that would demonstrate weakness and accountability. This is a trial run and they have big plans for this.
Note that the courts have blocked this and thus far been ignored.
chneu•9mo ago
sjducb•9mo ago
This is why they’re not trying to fix mistakes. Once you set a precedent of allowing appeals everyone will want one.
Trump is using ICE to create a parallel legal system where people have no rights. This is exactly what early (1933) Nazi Germany was like.
dataflow•9mo ago
I don't actually think the majority of the population believes this could happen to them. Furthermore, a huge portion of the population is very deliberately tuning out what they find to be depressing news. Though I'm not sure you're correct about the lack of widespread concern regardless.
bborud•9mo ago
anigbrowl•9mo ago
~20% are fatalists who think there's nothing you can do about it and just want to keep their head down and out of trouble.
Maybe 20% are naive people who don't get it and another 20% are hand-wringers who don't know what to do about it.
Fewer than 20% are able to comprehend, speak out, and organize against it and it's hard for them to make their voices heard enough to build a coalition that outnumbers the first group.
ndsipa_pomu•9mo ago
From the outside, it looks like there's a few protests, but nothing particularly decisive. To my mind, the next step is rioting, although that will likely lead to martial law being imposed. However, it looks to me like ICE agents are pretty much acting like martial law has been declared.
runjake•9mo ago
And in our current case, causes the Administration to crack down harder. Against rioters. Against illegals and those deemed to be illegals.
antifa•9mo ago
tialaramex•9mo ago
At first this can be quite structured and casual like, I should look for life opportunities abroad. Ooh, I quite like France and this outfit in Brittany are hiring in my field, I will apply and see what happens.
Gradually leaving becomes more urgent, and eventually you should focus just on getting over the border even if you don't have specific plans for where you'll go or what you'll do after that. Countries immediately bordering a fascist state often don't have a lot of patience for refugees, but, hey, at least you're out.
wizzwizz4•9mo ago
Fleeing makes sense for people at most risk of persecution (e.g. trans people, Jews, those who speak out), but many people are prevented from fleeing by their consciences. They have to stay and fight. See e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Resistance#Factions
tialaramex•9mo ago
If your home is on fire, some people will bravely stay and fight the fire, but the instruction we give everybody is to flee, you can get another home, but if you die there's nothing to be done about it, so better flee.
mvdtnz•9mo ago
_DeadFred_•9mo ago
K0balt•9mo ago
verzali•9mo ago
potato3732842•9mo ago
I mean they made a f-ing hollywood movie about it in 1998, it's not like the potential wasn't foreseen.