frontpage.
newsnewestaskshowjobs

Made with ♥ by @iamnishanth

Open Source @Github

fp.

Open in hackernews

Algebraic Effects: Another mistake carried through to perfection?

https://kjosib.github.io/Counterpoint/effects.html
29•todsacerdoti•7mo ago

Comments

smitty1e•7mo ago
> sweet careers are made of this, so who am I to disagree? Compile the world; Java Python C. Everybody’s looking for some bug. Some of them want to maintain you. Some of them want to be maintained.

For those missing the reference:

https://youtu.be/qeMFqkcPYcg?si=at-YtggekbPdv7sN

voxl•7mo ago
The desire of the HN community to pull a random person's uninformed opinion about a topic that they, justifiably, wrote for their own interests and amusement and then pontificate about how either stupid or amazing it is will never ceise to confuse me.

Effects on their own are a very active area of research and I would laugh behind a PL researchers back if they claimed it was a solved issue. Between Monads, call-by-push-value, and algebraic effects there is really no clear "how do people actually use this" answer.

But that's not the job of a PL researcher anyway, or a random software engineer for that matter. Sorry to say, the software engineer knows next to nothing about "the right way" to design language features that people want to use or enjoy using. If anything this should be an HCI person with a penchant for PL or vice versa.

eli_gottlieb•7mo ago
>Effects on their own are a very active area of research and I would laugh behind a PL researchers back if they claimed it was a solved issue. Between Monads, call-by-push-value, and algebraic effects there is really no clear "how do people actually use this" answer.

I can actually say that I used algebraic effects in my thesis for the section on semantics of a basic probabilistic programming language. It avoided talking about monads for my committee member who cared and honestly made for an easier implementation.

rednafi•7mo ago
> Sorry to say, the software engineer knows next to nothing about "the right way" to design language features that people want to use or enjoy using.

Sorry to say that many PL researchers live in their ivory tower and know next to nothing about things that people care about. One could say that it's not their job, their job is to write papers and get tenure. The number of FP enthusiasts versus the number of large, useful systems written in those languages is all the proof you need.

My statement is a vast generalization and is equally incorrect as the original one.

voxl•7mo ago
Anyone who uses words like "ivory tower" I know suffers more from jealousy and anti-intellectualiam than anything else. There is a reason Rust is the most loved programming language of modern times and it's not because they ignored the "ivory tower"
chownie•7mo ago
I had to stop and re-read this comment chain because I was sure this was satire
agentultra•7mo ago
There’s a certain amount of hubris to say, “I don’t know anything about this and you’re making a mistake.” It’s off putting and kills the whole rant.

I’ve heard opinions from smart people with lots of experience who say algebraic effects are not worth the squeeze. I’ve also heard some say that we should all be pushing the boundaries: they are the future.

So the matter doesn’t seem to be decided. Now isn’t the time for maxims.

gitroom•7mo ago
Every time I read stuff like this it just makes me laugh, I honestly never know who to listen to in these debates.
rednafi•7mo ago
Research doesn't work like that. I like the idea of separating contract and implementation in algebraic effects. It might pave the way to bring back some sanity to imperative languages and help us write better code, since it's pretty clear that the "real world" doesn't care much about pure functional languages no matter what they bring to the table. Or algebraic effects could be like monads, many like to talk about them while people building real stuff have no clue about it, nor do they care. But we'll never know unless we explore.
lambdas•7mo ago
To which implementation is the author referring, I wonder?

I can’t say I recognise any of these issues from freer, polysemy, nor bluefin.

chriswarbo•6mo ago
The author says the approach they advocate (just using function parameters) is similar to "dependency injection". It looks like in FP/objects-are-a-poor-man's-closures terminology they're talking about Continuation Passing Style (CPS).

AI 'Genesis Mission'

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-025-03890-z
1•wjb3•2m ago•0 comments

Prevalence of Internet gaming disorder in young adults

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306460325003454?
1•wjb3•9m ago•0 comments

Greece is teaching Germany how to get government online

https://www.economist.com/europe/2025/12/04/greece-is-teaching-germany-how-to-get-government-online
1•toomuchtodo•10m ago•1 comments

I Got Hacked – and Traced How Much Money Hacker Made (CVE-2025-66478)

https://twitter.com/duborges/status/1997293892090183772
1•eduardo_borges•14m ago•0 comments

Solar Neighborhoods (In Detroit)

https://detroitmi.gov/government/mayors-office/office-sustainability/energy/solar-neighborhoods
3•rmason•14m ago•2 comments

Mechanical power generation using Earth's ambient radiation

https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.adw6833
2•defrost•14m ago•0 comments

Osher Map Library

https://oshermaps.org/
1•andsoitis•15m ago•0 comments

A procedural macro that generates Rust code at compile-time using AI

https://github.com/germangb/ai-bindgen
1•deverton•15m ago•0 comments

New Device Generates Power by Beaming Heat to Space

https://spectrum.ieee.org/radiative-cooling-power
1•defrost•15m ago•0 comments

Hyperoperations in C++

https://khz.ac/software/hyperop.html
1•glittershark•16m ago•0 comments

Akamai buys Fermyon for WASM-based serverless function

https://devclass.com/2025/12/04/akamai-acquires-fermyon-for-wasm-based-serverless-functions-a-pos...
1•based2•19m ago•0 comments

tritonBLAS: Triton-based Analytical Approach for GEMM Kernel Parameter Selection

https://arxiv.org/abs/2512.04226
1•matt_d•20m ago•0 comments

Chrome browser extension for chatting about private pages with local LLMs

https://github.com/ivoras/llmaboutpage
1•ivoras•23m ago•0 comments

The mechanics of Golden Parachute clauses in the Netflix/Warner merger

https://riskparody.substack.com/p/netflix-just-bought-my-company-what
2•chrislguo•27m ago•1 comments

The significance of Brooker's autocodes in taking the early Manchester machines

https://www.curation.cs.manchester.ac.uk/computer50/www.computer50.org/mark1/gethomas/manchester_...
2•fanf2•27m ago•0 comments

Puzzling Out Elephant Longevity

https://trevorklee.substack.com/p/puzzling-out-elephant-longevity
1•Ariarule•31m ago•0 comments

Applets Are Officially Gone, But Java Is Back In The Browser

https://frequal.com/java/AppletsGoneButJavaInTheBrowserBetterThanEver.html
1•TeaVMFan•33m ago•1 comments

An Architecture for Building Brains from Top to Bottom? – EE Times Podcast

https://www.eetimes.com/podcasts/an-architecture-for-building-brains-from-top-to-bottom/
1•rbanffy•34m ago•0 comments

F-35 Fighter Jet's C++ Coding Standards [pdf]

https://www.stroustrup.com/JSF-AV-rules.pdf
31•birdculture•35m ago•18 comments

The metaverse is cooked, and Wall Street couldn't be happier

https://www.cnn.com/2025/12/04/business/meta-metaverse-stock-nightcap
2•voxadam•35m ago•2 comments

Ask HN: What's your go to for sharing sensitive files with non tech people?

3•privsen•38m ago•3 comments

Tech leaders fill $1T AI bubble, insist it doesn't exist

https://www.theregister.com/2025/12/05/ai_is_not_a_bubble/
1•Bender•42m ago•0 comments

iced 0.14 has been released (Rust GUI library)

https://github.com/iced-rs/iced/releases/tag/0.14.0
13•airstrike•42m ago•5 comments

Proxmox delivers its software-defined datacenter contender and VMware escape

https://www.theregister.com/2025/12/05/proxmox_datacenter_manager_1_stable/
5•Bender•43m ago•0 comments

Show HN: OpenFret – Guitar inventory, AI practice, and a note-detection RPG

https://openfret.com?referral=showhn
2•openfret•50m ago•0 comments

Scala Days 2025: Conference Highlights and Talk Recordings

https://scala-lang.org/blog/2025/11/26/scaladays-2025-review-video-announcement.html
1•based2•50m ago•1 comments

Why the Sanitizer API is just `setHTML()`

https://frederikbraun.de/why-sethtml.html
2•todsacerdoti•51m ago•0 comments

The History of Xerox

https://www.abortretry.fail/p/the-history-of-xerox
2•BirAdam•51m ago•0 comments

Cursor and Claude Opus 4.5 is a game changer

2•seinecle•53m ago•0 comments

Measuring Agents in Production

https://arxiv.org/abs/2512.04123
1•tlarkworthy•55m ago•0 comments