Sounds like you know more about it than me.
Can you explain?
I meant the guy had a concrete plan to topple democracy, assassinate other leaders and bring back dictatorship.
People like this should be thrown into prison for the rest of their lives.
I have to say, it is cute to read your faux outrage over this after Bolsonaro made sure the guy with the best chances to defeat him two elections back would be put into prison in a sham trial right before the election... not persecuting a figure as corrupt and power hungry as Bolsonaro would be 100% ethically wrong.
Not saying that Bolsonaro has any moral high ground to stand on, though. He is as corrupt as it gets. But if anything, I'd say that his problems really started when he was already elected and colluded with the Supreme Court to get Lula out of prison in exchange of killing the investigation against his sons.
If the vote was fair, then there may be an excuse of bad advice. He should've known better, but it's possible someone lied to him.
And a third option, he lied knowing well that the vote was fair. I such case this is an attempt to undermine the state and it should be dealt with harshly. It's o E thing if some journalist makes BS claims. It's another if obe if candidates does so.
I genuinely have no idea which of these is true. I know for a fact the claim "we lost because of fraud" has been popularised by Trump and him basically not getting even a slap on the wrist for it. So it gets used everywhere now.
But Trump exerting pressure like this is another level.
Not really a revelation though. The ones with most of the power always leveraged any tool they had at their disposal to have their way and press everyone else into compliance. Sometimes it's carrot, sometimes it's stick. And they always applied rules selectively based not on what but on who. Just like the mafia, carving out special rules and dispensations for themselves.
Interference in other countries' affairs was the name of the game for at least a century. But for a long time now the US has no need to offer the carrot at all seeing how most times they can get anything they want with just the threat of the stick.
In this case not having a visa is probably a blessing in disguise. Better to know you're not wanted before you are detained at the border and "accidentally" extradited directly to a prison's gate.
libertine•2h ago
What's the end game here?
saubeidl•2h ago
msgodel•1h ago
saubeidl•1h ago
Liberal Democracy inevitably leads to corporate capture and then Fascism, as the US is demonstrating beautifully right now.
The ideal form of government is Titoism, with strong repression of regressive forces.
msgodel•1h ago
pqtyw•1h ago
Things like freedom of speech or political organizations which are not subservient to the state?
Of course unrestricted freedom of speech can devolve into whatever has been happening in the US for quite a while but still... don't see how "enlightened totalitarianism" is an answer to that.
ta1243•29m ago
This tends to allow corporations to do all the bad things that states can do, with no checks or balances.
Other countries have a far larger mistrust of corporations and use their voice in the state to attempt to moderate that.
ta1243•31m ago
Does it? Is this a major problem in say Sweden, or Switzerland, or New Zealand?
motorest•1h ago
That sounds an awful lot like victim-blaming.
What's worse is that your blend of comments somehow omits the fact that fascism is not being openly pushed onto people. Instead, fascists frame their intentions as granting them the authority to impose populist policies within the framework of liberal democracies. The problem is that, as Nazi Germany proved, once these fascists are in power they pull a bait-and-switch onto their own supporters.
saubeidl•1h ago
watwut•26m ago
Contemporary fascists pay lit service to it and like to accuse opponents of not being democratic. Tho, to large extend, conservatives lead by Trump are also doing what was known they will do.
madaxe_again•1h ago
The only difference is that these guys are perhaps more brazen about it, as they’ve realised it makes no difference to their electability.