T-Mobile claimed selling location data without consent is legal–judges disagree

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2025/08/t-mobile-claimed-selling-location-data-without-consent-is-legal-judges-disagree/

116•Bender•1h ago

Comments

ch33zer•1h ago

Look forward to the supreme Court ruling that the FCC is illegal and actually owes carriers money for some reason

TimorousBestie•1h ago

SCOTUS hates the DC Circuit almost as much as it hates the Ninth; this decision is dead on arrival.

guywithahat•1h ago

Gee I wonder what the opinion was of the guy who wrote the headline.

It looks like what's actually happening is they're looking at usage data related to how many people are connected to the tower. I can see why one might think that's different, since you must connect to a tower to use your cell phone, and the data isn't personal usage data like a site might be. It's more along the lines of usage data, like how many people ride the bus, which is data that's shared all the time without explicit permission from every rider first.

nightfly•57m ago

More like selling when and where you got on and off the bus

SilverElfin•1h ago

Is there any way to block this location data sharing? What about other carriers? I always think about denying apps access to this stuff but a carrier tracking me is insane and scary. The linked article makes it seem like ATT and Verizon also do this.

TimorousBestie•1h ago

Probably not. The infrastructure has to know where your cell phone is in order to communicate with it.

Last I checked, the large carriers in the states hoard this information for years.

jacquesm•11m ago

This is not quite true. They have to know roughly where your cell phone is but, helpfully, your cellphone starts the process as soon as you start it up and then it is a courtesy to you that the unit closest to you will handle your call(s) and other traffic because that will save you battery and reduces the amount of power your phone will use which in turn will allow others relatively nearby to use the same slice of the spectrum while you are transmitting. Phased arrays on the mast make this even more precise and further conserve power. But that really is a courtesy: it would all work without that luxury but less efficient and your phone's battery would be empty faster.

The part that really is optional is where the carrier then stores and even sells your location. They are mandated by law with respect to the first and they abuse the technical capabilities of the system for the second. And even if it isn't very precise for a single measurement it is in fact quite precise after you haven't moved for a while.

codedokode•1h ago

Airplane mode.

tantalor•1h ago

Yeah it is quite easy, just take out your phone and follow these steps,

1. Go outside

2. Break the phone in half

3. Toss it in the nearest garbage can

4. Walk away

sugarpimpdorsey•58m ago

Yes you could go full rms and not own one* and ask someone else to borrow theirs.

* does anyone know if this is still true?

lazide•54m ago

Even better - randomly pickpocket someone else’s phone, use it once, then toss it /s

RajT88•23m ago

Asking to borrow someone's phone is a common theft tactic. I wouldn't do it, for fear of someone thinking you're up to no good.

Burners / prepaid SIM's are still a thing.

whatamidoingyo•55m ago

You can purchase a Faraday cage for your phone. Or you can make one.

adrr•35m ago

Carrier tracking isn't precise as GPS tracking via the phone. Its frequently a mile or more off. Banks were using it in lieu of a travel notice to see if the card swipe and phone were in the same city. Thats my experience with it. They moved away though and now try to ping the app(silent push) to get an IP or location data since buying location data from carriers is expensive.

echelon_musk•18m ago

For a long time I've wanted something like Remote Desktop for my phone.

With the idea being that I use a second phone to connect to my main phone over the internet.

This lets the phone number you actually have associated with you stay in the same fixed geographical location.

E.g. all calls are initiated by the primary phone and tunnelled over the internet to the disposable phone.

Lammy•11m ago

Get a Direct Inward Dialing (DID) number and a VoIP host that speaks SIP. Dunno about iOS, but Android has had native SIP support built in since Android 2.3 Gingerbread.

aeon_ai•53m ago

Opt-out links by carrier:

ATT - https://www.att.com/consent/ccpa/dnsatt

T-Mobile: https://www.t-mobile.com/privacy-center --Access the Privacy Dashboard

Adjust the following privacy settings (toggle off as desired), per line/account: - Profiling and automated decisions (on by default) - Fraud and identity theft protection (shares account and usage info) - Sharing certain financial information (payment history, balances, etc.) - Analytics and reporting, Advertising options, and Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information

Verizon - Go to your MyVerizon Navigate to Account > Account Settings > Privacy Settings on the web; or tap the gear icon and choose Manage privacy settings in the app.

Locate the following tracking options: - Custom Experience - Custom Experience Plus - Business & Marketing Insights - CPNI (Customer Proprietary Network Information) and Identity Verification programs -For each, select "Don't Use" or toggle off to opt out

RajT88•28m ago

Just checked my T-Mobile privacy settings. I had most everything turned off, but then I saw a few were turned on (such as my opt-out marketing settings). Opting out of everything took 2 tries to have them all disabled (sludge).

This one was seemingly a new one, and makes the hairs on my neck go up:

Make your choice about profiling and automated decisions.

You can tell us not to use your personal data for certain kinds of "profiling" that we might do in the future. This toggle allows you to opt out of having profiling used for future decisions that produce legal or similarly significant effects about you. We don't use profiling to make these kinds of decisions now. Turning this "OFF" or gray means "opt out of profiling and automated decisions."

pixl97•8m ago

For some reason I cannot turn off the "Alert the Gestapo if I remain too close to an abortion clinic for too long option" on my account, says not available for Texas accounts.

Lammy•40m ago

I did a cross-continent drive last month with my T-Mobile US phone and got a rude awakening of how real-time this is when the “source” area codes of all the spammy phone calls followed me from state to state.

e: I thought I had opted out of everything that was opt-out-able in TMo's privacy settings <https://www.t-mobile.com/privacy-center/dashboard/controls> years ago when I first set up my line/account, but I just checked again and more than half of the settings were enabled. Hate that I have to be in the habit of looking for new settings that default to enabled.

pavel_lishin•14m ago

Weird! 99% of my spam calls come from the same area code as my cellphone number.

xyst•23m ago

What would it take to disrupt the oligopoly of limited carriers in the USA? I feel this type of behavior will continue with minimal repercussions. Maybe a slap on the wrist.

FCC, whether intentional or unintentional, through their controlled access to wireless spectrum has made it near impossible for smaller players to disrupt them.

I know "MVNOs" exist but they just resell the spectrum/network from the big 3 carriers in the USA.

jacquesm•16m ago

A very large amount of capital, a substantial fraction of which you will be wasting on lobbying and financing the parties that managed to get spectrum allocated before you thought of this.