Israel traded in "great Israel " territory several times (including the fringe settler fanatics sitting on it) for peace with its neighbors. Sinai to egypt, litani lands to lebanon, ghaza to hamas. Only to get then attacked by the party it made peace with . (which is legitimized in islam, as mohamed the perfect being made peace contracts and then attacked the unbelievers of mekka with their guard down after a peace treaty ).
So what to do with a permanent hostile neighborhood with which no peace is possible and for which all "we want peace" statements are actually "we want to rearm to than do another islamo supremacist attack". You can make treaties with russia or hamas all you want, but all you get is toilet paper..
Of course the displaced people that have been living there for thousands of years will be aggressive against it.
What is happening in Gaza is not just atrocious, it is an offence to the very concept of humanity.
No one is discussing than Ben-Gurion did use borders as a négociation tool. But Likud’s 1977 platform also exists and the “Yinon plan”.
The main question is how relevant is the concept to Israel current political environment and ambitions.
I have no comment to make about your last paragraph. I fear we have reached the point where history will have to be the judge.
Hamas is a modern creation that has nothing to do with Gaza. Gaza was a refugee camp for the displaced Palestinianas, many who came from towns torched by Jewish paramilitary forces.
To talk about Islam legitimizing attacking nonbelievers is as bigoted a statement as characterizing Judaism by the insane beliefs of the half million settlers who constantly bulldoze Palestinian towns (and act which the West refuses to call it what it is: terrorism and ethnic cleansing).
For the Palestinians and the southern Lebanese who have also been bombed by Israel, or the innocent people who die every day in Gaza, Israel is the “permanent hostile neighbor”. Hamas and Hezbollah didn’t come out of the ether.
KnuthIsGod•3h ago
tzedek tzedek tirdof (justice, justice shall you pursue) "
pfannkuchen•3h ago
nielsbot•3h ago
pfannkuchen•2h ago
stephen_g•2h ago
pfannkuchen•2h ago
Cordiali•1h ago
Tangentially, it also reminds me of a woman's grave that was found in Denmark I think. I can't remember how old the grave was, but something like 3-4000 years. They were able to use isotope analysis of her teeth, hair, stomach contents, etc. to trace her movements.
She was from the area, but in the last year of her life, she'd travelled down to around Switzerland and back. There was a documentary about it, I'll see if I can find it...
pfannkuchen•1h ago
Cordiali•45m ago
I'm personally comfortable with a "probable" or "it's likely that" in my history docos. I'm a lot less comfortable with that standard when it comes to planes, trains, and automobiles.
Cordiali•1h ago
It might've been the 'Haraldskær Woman', I found an article [1] about her which roughly matches my recollections, and is from around the same time I would've seen the documentary. Although she might've only travelled as far as central Germany.
[1]: https://journals.openedition.org/archeosciences/4407
nivertech•2h ago
Gibbon1•2h ago