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Utah addresses are Cartesian. Google does not grok

1•pesoneto•1h ago
Utah street addressing is Cartesian. The only difference is that instead of using a pre-fix notation of plus-minus to indicate a direction from the origin, the post-fix notation North-South, East-West is used instead.

So here is an actual address, 716 W 630 S, Orem, UT. A person in Utah would expect that incrementing or decrementing either of the numbers in the tuple (-716, -630) would move the point on the map only slightly.

Yes, I am messing up and broke the rules of notation but did this on purpose to force the mind into normal Cartesian thinking. More strictly, I could have said (716W, 930S). But you get what I mean, right?

But try this in maps.google.com. Change the address to (716, 631) and Google says it can't find the address. Change it to (716, 629) and it suggests a bus stop in Salt Lake City. An error of nearly 30 miles.

There is no way to report this misunderstanding to Google.

One could argue Google's approach is correct. Except that, particularly in undeveloped areas associated with a city, people will guess at an approximate address expecting that the hearer will arrive at a location close to what was stated. A bit easier to express that giving latitude and longitude coordinates. But Google takes you to another city?

Comments

uberman•1h ago
Do you mean "Change the address to (716w, 631s)"?
pesoneto•1h ago
Yes, that is what I said in the next sentence. I was playing around, trying to make sure that people think. Like you did!

This problem of street addresses is so deep in the brain that I was making a mistake on purpose to jar the mind of the reader.

pesoneto•23m ago
I also notice that your username is Uber Man. You probably have some stories to tell about navigation and getting lost.
pesoneto•1h ago
After I posted this, I checked the definition of grok to make sure of my usage. Grok is a word invented by Robert Heinlein to describe the experience of a person moving from Mars to Earth and the subtle cultural shocks experienced. This word fits this situation exactly.

I was born in California and moved to Utah as an adult. The addressing system was incomprehensible at first. In Los Angeles when I was young, my father, a salesman, kept several huge map books in his car. The usage of these was first to look up a street name in an index section and then go to the correct page in the book. Then hunt for the street in the square specified in the index.

There were no such books in Utah. The geography is desert and mostly flat. The Cartesian system mostly works. There are some exceptions particularly as you get close to the mountains. In these cases, one would have to do the California thing. The map you would need used to be in the phone book. So typically you would hunt first for a phone booth.

But this was a long time ago. There are no phone books anymore. And certainly no phone booths. So this is a cultural shift in multiple dimensions.

Salt Lake City is a royal mess. What started out like LA with separate cities have now merged into a contiguous urban area. The origin in cases like this is the county center. So sometimes you can reference the original city coordinates or go with the newer unified system.

But still there is this disconnect in the ways that people think about street addresses. There are deep thought patterns that depend on where you were born.

pesoneto•1h ago
Just to be complete, in case anyone pays attention to this and uses it as a specification in a program, there is one more wrinkle.

The units of distance from the origin can vary. City blocks were typically smaller than county farm parcels. So if you are writing a program, you need to look up the units of distance.

Again, this is a real mess in Salt Lake City where the initial smallish city merged with the farm areas south of the urban center.

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