Objection: first observe that much of morality is about “doing the right thing”, where the right thing is hard because it is opposed to selfishness.
Selfishness is the default and the natural impulse. You rarely have to convince people to take the selfish option, unless they are long indoctrinated to be selfless.
The objective reason to act morally is to live in a society where you have a chance to receive civility in return. Common morality, for example “don’t murder”, is about avoiding a continuous escalation of bad actions that are likely to come back to you.
It’s about having a functioning society, rather than a prison where you are constantly looking over your shoulder to avoid being shived by the brother of the guy you murdered.
Isamu•2mo ago
Another way: morality is always in the context of your wants versus society. Society is an objective fact here, as is yourself.
That you want to live your life is a given. In order to avoid bad backlash from society you might objectively choose to adopt some moral behaviors.
Discourse about morality is unnecessarily complicated by historical things that we don’t want to shine a light on, like slavery and the treatment of women. We can’t explain why we have been talking about morality for millennia but haven’t come to the conclusion that our treatment of others matters.
euroderf•2mo ago
> Selfishness is the default and the natural impulse.
Speak for yourself. In everyday matters, defaulting to selfishness really stands out. My 0,02€.
vandal8ind•2mo ago
Biology is self selecting and realizes it's doomed without help of others
Isamu•2mo ago
Selfishness is the default and the natural impulse. You rarely have to convince people to take the selfish option, unless they are long indoctrinated to be selfless.
The objective reason to act morally is to live in a society where you have a chance to receive civility in return. Common morality, for example “don’t murder”, is about avoiding a continuous escalation of bad actions that are likely to come back to you.
It’s about having a functioning society, rather than a prison where you are constantly looking over your shoulder to avoid being shived by the brother of the guy you murdered.
Isamu•2mo ago
That you want to live your life is a given. In order to avoid bad backlash from society you might objectively choose to adopt some moral behaviors.
Discourse about morality is unnecessarily complicated by historical things that we don’t want to shine a light on, like slavery and the treatment of women. We can’t explain why we have been talking about morality for millennia but haven’t come to the conclusion that our treatment of others matters.
euroderf•2mo ago
Speak for yourself. In everyday matters, defaulting to selfishness really stands out. My 0,02€.
vandal8ind•2mo ago
It's selfishness to do the right thing
We're "moral" to ourselves not others