Pretty exciting. It'll be interesting to know more about the pros/cons of the batteries. Do they have similar lifetimes? Prefer to be kept in 20-80% range like some other chemistries?
_aavaa_•1mo ago
Biggest pros:
- cheaper and ever more abundant inputs
- significantly lower thermal runaway problems
- much higher theoretical kW/kg (but worse kWh/m3)
- much higher cycle life
metalman•1mo ago
-40 to +70°c operating range means that for most locations and uses, the batteries will not need heating or cooling, not sure about ventilation, but if that is also unnessesary
then incorporating the batteries intofull systems becomes much easier for static and mobile uses.
also, as they are cheaper per kw/hr than anything else, there will be an evolution towards higher voltages, especialy for home storage ,off and grid tied, as conductor sizes can be smaller in all components, bringing costs down accross the board, pv, charge controllers, inverters will.all benifit, and if say 240v became standard, then charge contollers, inverters and pv would all run at standard domestic voltage
and be significantly more efficient for round trip energy storage and use.
we are on the cusp of whole lifestyle energy supplys bieng generated on a house roof and stored on site, and/or sold into the grid.
chii•1mo ago
> not sure about ventilation
i assume you'd always need ventilation, because if it is enclosed, the produced heat will just accumulate and go above 70c eventually.
But ventilation is much cheaper than heating/cooling (and can be a passive vent rather than anything active - thus taking zero power to run except for maintenance/replacement).
koverstreet•1mo ago
Where does the higher theoretical kWH/kg come from? That's big news.
_aavaa_•1mo ago
Sorry I had that backwards.
newyankee•1mo ago
I think they can probably win the energy storage game when scaled. I know the voltage range is a serious issue but I am guessing CATL itself might want to divert LFP/ LMFP chemistries to vehicles and use this for energy storage.
People are probably oversimplifying some costs (like 10-20$/kwh material costs) while at the same time underestimating the fact that if it can be delivered internationally at < 60$/kwh in the long run, it is a win for energy storage.
For some reasons I have never seen LFP in storage projects going below 200-300$/kwh all costs considered even though cell/pack costs claim in China have always been 50-60$/kwh
Will Prowse reviewed some. They have a very wide voltage range.
1970-01-01•1mo ago
Sodium-ion batteries are basically the last big stop before solid state tech is in mass production and shipping. We've clearly solved all the technology problems with EVs and it's only 2026!
Rebelgecko•1mo ago
_aavaa_•1mo ago
- cheaper and ever more abundant inputs
- significantly lower thermal runaway problems
- much higher theoretical kW/kg (but worse kWh/m3)
- much higher cycle life
metalman•1mo ago
chii•1mo ago
i assume you'd always need ventilation, because if it is enclosed, the produced heat will just accumulate and go above 70c eventually.
But ventilation is much cheaper than heating/cooling (and can be a passive vent rather than anything active - thus taking zero power to run except for maintenance/replacement).
koverstreet•1mo ago
_aavaa_•1mo ago
newyankee•1mo ago
People are probably oversimplifying some costs (like 10-20$/kwh material costs) while at the same time underestimating the fact that if it can be delivered internationally at < 60$/kwh in the long run, it is a win for energy storage.
For some reasons I have never seen LFP in storage projects going below 200-300$/kwh all costs considered even though cell/pack costs claim in China have always been 50-60$/kwh
thijson•1mo ago
Will Prowse reviewed some. They have a very wide voltage range.