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The '3.5% rule': How a small minority can change the world (2019)

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190513-it-only-takes-35-of-people-to-change-the-world
68•choult•1h ago

Comments

puppion•52m ago
This rule didn't hold in Israel in the last 3 years. Well over 3.5% went to the streets and the government remains in tact.
stevenwoo•49m ago
So far, if estimates are accurate, neither in Iran with 90 million population, more than five percent turned out.
pedalpete•48m ago
I have no idea how many Iranians have been involved in the protests, but it seems like they're getting past the 3.5% number as well..
smallerize•41m ago
It doesn't work if the opposition is also organized. For example, a March 2003 Gallup poll showed that 5% of the US population had made a public opposition to the Iraq war, but 21% had made a public display to support the war. Small minorities can't go directly against more popular movements.
AnotherGoodName•34m ago
I agree that's what it's saying but it does make the whole statement a bit meaningless.

Essentially the statement is 3.5% succeed unless there's meaningful opposition.

xboxnolifes•8m ago
It's not meaningless, as there is a difference between opposition and status quo.
terminalshort•35m ago
What do you mean by "went to the streets?" If it's just show up at a protest and wave a sign on Saturday and Sunday, and go back to work on Monday, that's not enough. That's not civil resistance. People seriously underestimate the commitment levels necessary to actually matter.
conception•35m ago
Paper says non-violent is ~50/50 vs one in four for violent. So not a sure thing.
stevenwoo•23m ago
So there were 323 events investigated but there's some criteria that should be taken into account for violent resistances that is not - for instance zero of the resistances to the Nazi occupations during World War 2 succeeded by their definition, and off the top of my head only the Yugoslavian resistance really put up a substantial dent in the occupation and still required the Soviet army invasion to kick the Nazis out.
erxam•16m ago
The problem is defining 'non-violent'. Is it just showing up to a protest from 5pm to 6pm with a sign? Is it a general strike that will undoubtedly harm the economy? Is it demonstrating that you could respond to violence effectively and daring them to up the scales?
alephnerd•30m ago
> This rule didn't hold in Israel [...]

It did (ie. Revolutionary thresholds) until 10/7 and Hezbollah's shelling of the north changed the calculus.

There was increased pressure from senior IDF careerists, industry titans, and intelligence alums (oftentimes the 3 were the same) against the government which was about to reach the tip over point, but then 10/7 happened along with the mass evacuation of the North, which led everyone to set aside their differences.

Israel is a small country (same population and size as the Bay Area) so everyone either knows someone or was personally affected by the southern massacre or the northern evacuation.

graemep•50m ago
This is plausible. Non violent groups will often have wider public support (because most people would prefer not to support violence) and if those in power use violence against the non-violent it increases public sympathy for them.
jfengel•50m ago
(2019)
alephnerd•44m ago
Iran proved it wrong (the regime mobilized roughly 1% of the country's population to crack down on protesters) with regards to Single Party Regimes, and knowing people at the Ash Center, they are pessimistic about this as well.
bananasandrice•42m ago
So much from Orwell's Bolshevik State Broacaster.
AnotherGoodName•38m ago
If you have 2+ groups with opposing views, each 3.5%+ it's pretty clear that at least one of the 3.5%+ groups will fail.

Others here note it's really "3.5% if there's no one seriously opposing their objectives" but in my opinion that's a meaningless rule. Of course in those cases non-conflict resolves the issue.

vog•12m ago
This is far from meaningless, because if you are too far below those 3.5%, you'll fail to make a change for the better, despite having a good cause with no real opposition.

Those 3.5% are encouraging for all social movements, who suffer (and/or have friends/family who suffer) from some issue in the system, have perhaps developed a good plan out of it, but think they are too small to make a difference.

mihaic•5m ago
Success doesn't have to mean getting your way, but rather making a meaningful change in your direction. Even opposing groups often can find a way so that both get a better situation. For instance, taxes can overall be lowered while teacher salaries can increase on average at the same time, if excess money is taken from other activities.
tomjakubowski•31m ago
https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dict...
anigbrowl•31m ago
(2019)

Chenoweth has backed off her previous conclusions in recent years, observing that nonviolent protest strategies have dramatically declined in effectiveness as governments have adjusted their tactics of repression and messaging. See eg https://www.harvardmagazine.com/2025/07/erica-chenoweth-demo...

One current example of messaging can be seen in the reflexive dismissal by the current US government and its propagandists of any popular opposition as 'paid protesters'. Large attendance at Democratic political rallies during the 2024 election was dismissed as being paid for by the campaign, any crowd protesting government policy is described as either a rioting or alleged to be financed by George Soros or some other boogeyman of the right. This has been going on for years; the right simply refuses to countenance the possibility of legitimate organic opposition, while also being chronically unable to provide any evidence for their claims.

alephnerd•14m ago
That's a misreading of Chenowith's argument which itself is heavily based on Timur Kuran's Revolutionary Thresholds concept.

The thesis is once mass mobilization of non-violent protesters occurs, it reduces the threshold for elite defection because there are multiple different veto groups within a selectorate, and some may choose to defect because they either view the incumbent as unstable or they disagree with the incumbent's policies.

I also recommend reading Chennowith's discussion paper clearing up the "3.5%" argument. A lot of mass reporting was just sloppy [0]. I have some issues with Chennowith's argument as well, but much of this has been brought up on campus for years.

[0] - https://www.hks.harvard.edu/sites/default/files/2024-05/Eric...

monero-xmr•9m ago
It’s true that large leftist groups fund protests. 100% true. Here’s a recent ABC News report on the No Kings protests https://abc6onyourside.com/news/nation-world/no-kings-protes...

Also they completely stopped once the new anti-ICE thing became popular. Where are all the new organic No Kings protests? Everyone wrote about it in all the major publications and now we forgot(?) and the Tesla dealership protests? No normal person engages in this stuff, it’s hyper activists part of organized groups with real financing

estebank•5m ago
> No normal person engages in this stuff, it’s hyper activists part of organized groups with real financing

I guess I'm not a normal person then. I didn't realize that I was a hyper activist because I drew on some cardboard and that my group of friends was being financed. I better go demand for my Soros-check from them.

awesome_dude•7m ago
"Paid" demonstrators has been an accusation used by governments for several decades.
hrdwdmrbl•26m ago
Hong Kong proved this wrong too...
marcosdumay•25m ago
The world seems to have changed since the events that led to this conclusion (that were mostly way before 2019).

Governments apparently learned how to assimilate protests and burn people down without any apparent violence, but still destroying their causes.

andrepd•15m ago
Occupy Wall Street was a turning point for me. It's staggering how many things today follow directly from the 2008 gfc and its disastrous aftermath.
Animats•5m ago
The primary legacy of Occupy Wall Street is that "the 1%" became a meme. Enough so that policies are still evaluated on how they affect "the 1%" vs the rest of the population. The concentration of wealth in the US became much better known. It did not, however, reduce that concentration of wealth.
WalterBright•11m ago
Individuals can change the world, too. Lee Harvey Oswald, for one. Elon Musk, for another (in a totally different way). And Fritz Haber. Plenty more.
ChrisArchitect•10m ago
(2019)

Some previous discussion:

2024 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40378867

2022 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32458241