I've been interested in understanding what would make people more amenable to data centers. We kind of need them, though arguably many of the ones being built now are motivated by foolish AI bubble incentives.
Quieter? Lower water use? Lower energy use? Mandatory accessory green spaces? Property taxes that reflect the value being derived relative to inconvenience/pain inflicted on the community? Jobs programs?
I think there's a lot of ideas to mitigate the downsides of data centers. Many of the people who don't want data centers have such proposals that are opposed by different people who don't want data centers.
vrganj•22m ago
Data centers are fundamentally a net negative to the region, value extraction towards the oligarchs.
Why would anyone want them?
The only thing that'd change my mind would be full communal ownership in addition to everything you've said.
thepryz•7m ago
To start, there is a lot of misinformation out there and the NDAs that surround data center construction and operation don't help. People will cite water consumption as a huge problem when modern hyperscalers use substantially less water because they're now using closed loop cooling instead of evaporative cooling. You'll see people cite noise because they saw a video online of a crypto mining grifter who bought a bunch of shipping containers and haphazardly threw together air cooled mining rigs with 80mm fans screaming away. I even saw one video of a woman who claimed data centers gave her diabetes despite the fact that she was obese.
Amazon and other companies already have job training programs because they cannot find enough skilled labor to build and operate their data centers. The number of jobs commonly cited are comically lower than what is common to operate a modern hyperscaler. In my experience, hyperscalers often have at least 100-200 people on site to operate the data center and I've seen more than 1000 people on a site when the data center is under construction.
The real issue, as always, are the local governments and utilities that sellout out the citizens and fail to create and enforce building codes. The governments should be using the demand for data centers to partner with the companies and have them pay to modernize and fix the power grid. They should be using them to help subsidize green energy initiatives among other things and fund other projects to benefit the community.
The inconvenient truth is that the problem with data centers lies with the people in the communities who continue to elect politicians who, time and time again, make decisions counter to the best interests of their community. Data centers just happen to be the latest scapegoat to distract people from corrupt politicians and an community that is not civically engaged enough to hold their politicians accountable.
bastawhiz•36m ago
Quieter? Lower water use? Lower energy use? Mandatory accessory green spaces? Property taxes that reflect the value being derived relative to inconvenience/pain inflicted on the community? Jobs programs?
I think there's a lot of ideas to mitigate the downsides of data centers. Many of the people who don't want data centers have such proposals that are opposed by different people who don't want data centers.
vrganj•22m ago
Why would anyone want them?
The only thing that'd change my mind would be full communal ownership in addition to everything you've said.
thepryz•7m ago
Amazon and other companies already have job training programs because they cannot find enough skilled labor to build and operate their data centers. The number of jobs commonly cited are comically lower than what is common to operate a modern hyperscaler. In my experience, hyperscalers often have at least 100-200 people on site to operate the data center and I've seen more than 1000 people on a site when the data center is under construction.
The real issue, as always, are the local governments and utilities that sellout out the citizens and fail to create and enforce building codes. The governments should be using the demand for data centers to partner with the companies and have them pay to modernize and fix the power grid. They should be using them to help subsidize green energy initiatives among other things and fund other projects to benefit the community.
The inconvenient truth is that the problem with data centers lies with the people in the communities who continue to elect politicians who, time and time again, make decisions counter to the best interests of their community. Data centers just happen to be the latest scapegoat to distract people from corrupt politicians and an community that is not civically engaged enough to hold their politicians accountable.