Interesting. There is state-linked capital, big tech, VC, and foreign/sovereign money.
jqpabc123•10h ago
In other words, it is fairly typical of many Chinese "companies".
What many in the West seem to have trouble grasping is the fact that a "company" in China is not an autonomous economic construct but is instead more deeply intertwined with the state.
A Chinese "company" is a hybrid entity that only exists with the approval of and in cooperation with and in service to the state. Just ask Jack Ma.
Complaining that this doesn't match the way the game is played in the West does nothing to deflect the competition it presents. It is specifically designed to break Western style free market capitalism and AI is a prominent test case.
anovikov•9h ago
Well, everything in non-democratic countries, except (part of) organised crime, exist with the approval and in service of the state. So formal ownership doesn't matter there (this is why Chinese stock market is a joke).
I don't think anyone assumed it to be any different. This is the case in every non-democratic country and this is exactly why capitalism is inseparable with democracy (because there won't be capital when there is no system that ensures that it won't be arbitrarily taken from you, with you thrown into "re-education" camp). Similarly, socialism is inseparable with authoritarianism because give people real voting rights and they will vote socialism out. Hybrid regimes that have been attempted, quickly flipped onto one or the other side - democratic capitalism, or authoritarian socialism - because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management.
jqpabc123•9h ago
because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management.
Is this a fact --- or a hope?
China is a different culture and is carving it's own path --- one that doesn't exactly match any that came before.
The West expected that it would change China. What is actually happening is China is changing the West.
For example, trade with the USA is now controlled by one person. It's hard to get much more authoritarian and anti-capitalistic than this.
greenoracle9•10h ago
jqpabc123•10h ago
What many in the West seem to have trouble grasping is the fact that a "company" in China is not an autonomous economic construct but is instead more deeply intertwined with the state.
A Chinese "company" is a hybrid entity that only exists with the approval of and in cooperation with and in service to the state. Just ask Jack Ma.
Complaining that this doesn't match the way the game is played in the West does nothing to deflect the competition it presents. It is specifically designed to break Western style free market capitalism and AI is a prominent test case.
anovikov•9h ago
I don't think anyone assumed it to be any different. This is the case in every non-democratic country and this is exactly why capitalism is inseparable with democracy (because there won't be capital when there is no system that ensures that it won't be arbitrarily taken from you, with you thrown into "re-education" camp). Similarly, socialism is inseparable with authoritarianism because give people real voting rights and they will vote socialism out. Hybrid regimes that have been attempted, quickly flipped onto one or the other side - democratic capitalism, or authoritarian socialism - because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management.
jqpabc123•9h ago
Is this a fact --- or a hope?
China is a different culture and is carving it's own path --- one that doesn't exactly match any that came before.
The West expected that it would change China. What is actually happening is China is changing the West.
For example, trade with the USA is now controlled by one person. It's hard to get much more authoritarian and anti-capitalistic than this.