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I refuse to accept a censored Internet. Join Me at FOSDEM 27

https://talkweb.eu/openweb/4558/
97•Tomte•53m ago

Comments

cyanydeez•37m ago
It seems like "censored internet" will be the least of the worries when it comes to agent explosion. Even if your internet is free, how are you going to find it through the slop brigades generating and consuming the same "load bearing" crap. Even if you setup the oracle of the day, and no one stops you, how are you going to filter all the crap out to find it? And how will you afford it when everyone puts up pay gates to deal with the xplosion, leading to only the most valuable aislop being allowed on.
sssilver•25m ago
If crap is indistinguishable from substance, is it truly crap?

If it is distinguishable, can’t the machines do the distinguishing?

pixl97•22m ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandolini%27s_law

>The amount of energy needed to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than that needed to produce it

I can put all kinds of words together that are legitimate uses of language, but that doesn't mean they mean anything or have any ground truth. Determining truth is massively more difficult than saying words.

croes•27m ago
AI will help them to create the perfect cage.

No jailbreak, no exploits

pixl97•11m ago
I mean yes, it is likely there is no other probable outcome.

One of the big problems with the HN rugged individualist types is they think they'll get to have awesome unlimited power at their broke ass individual scale and that somehow people with millions or billions of dollars aren't going to use said power fully to their advantage while crushing anyone that stands in their way.

More so they think that power seeking type people and organizations will not quickly adopt this technology and spend massive amounts of money to entrench their legal position while weakening everyone else's rights.

As much as technology may free us, it seems even more probable that it will put us in the perfect cage as you say, or just completely end us all. There is no universal law that says technology cannot power scale way beyond humans ability to remain chemically stable. If we fly too close to the sun our wings will melt off.

saidnooneever•20m ago
Is there an uncensored intetnet, because i dont think there is. if there is any, it can be turned off because its being routed on the censored net wrapped in encryption.

that being said, that makes me pretty interested in this talk. outside of hacking sattelites and such things and/or infra i really dont see any opportunities to break free of the will of corporations as they can simply pay infra providers to do their bidding.

I dont think software can solve all problems because internet exists essentially as informaiton transported over infrastructure. the software surely helps enable that but its a helper not the actual network.

happy to learn otherwise from anyone here ofc :-)

ThrowawayTestr•6m ago
Do you consider removing illegal content censorship?
pixl97•2m ago
You might be confusing two different things.

Censorship itself doesn't mean right or wrong, good or bad. It's very likely that you would censor your young kids from watching violent videos of real murders and would consider that a good thing, as an example.

Removing 'illegal' content is censorship in your example. If this is a good or bad thing depends on a great many considerations.

pixl97•5m ago
> informaiton transported over infrastructure

Even building your own internet, say over wireless is easily detected and jammed.

About the only thing that could save us (though likely cause so many new problems we won't feel saved) is some kind of more sci-fi technology involving the non-locality of the universe for devices to communicate (not even talking about FTL communication, just different topologies within universal limits).

haunter•15m ago
Most people prefer censored internet as long as it aligns with their political leaning. Maybe that wasn't the case 15 years ago but it's pretty much true nowadays. I myself consider this as a fact.
brador•11m ago
The problem is there are so few uncensored places now that if you do make one you overnight become the sweary nasi/pedo/sexads bar because everything else is closed to them.

Basically Reddit 2018.

ThrowawayTestr•4m ago
It requires a strong-willed webmaster and a board culture that rejects such unfun people.
Dwedit•11m ago
"Censorship" vs "Content moderation". You can't have online discussions without moderation, and that makes moderation some form of censorship. Thus you can't have online discussions without some form of censorship. Only difference is who is doing the censoring.
b33l•5m ago
uh maybe you can't
zzzeek•3m ago
Ok Elon
eviks•4m ago
Of course you can have online discussion without moderation. In the most basic form: you publish on your site, I respond on mine. No moderator involved

And there are plenty of other differences besides "who", for example, "how".

rustyconover•9m ago
FOSDEM is a great conference!

If you ever get the chance to go, please go! Especially if you're an American I recommend it. It is so different than any other conference I've ever been to in the US.

It doesn't have a lot of sales pitches, the technical content is top notch, and overall it is really fun and interesting to see what everybody is talking about and working on.

weinzierl•4m ago
I can only second that! And it is so relaxed, came and go whenever you want. No hassle to get tickets like for Congress. Of course you will queue - a lot, but consider it part of the experience.
aktenlage•3m ago
It's not black and white though. There's a scale from "easy to censor without collateral damage" to "need to take the whole nation offline to suppress information flow".

And there is a scale from "trivial to circumvent, if only (you know) you want to" to something like "need to be very tech-savy and use custom hardware"

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