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The Business Case for Vanilla JavaScript

https://lewiscampbell.tech/blog/250430.html
6•LAC-Tech•7mo ago

Comments

copypaper•7mo ago
I would personally never touch a frontend not written with a framework. Sounds like a terrible developer experience--especially with a team. But from reading your article, it sounds like your issue is with React itself. I would recommend you try Svelte, it sounds like what you're looking for. It's as close to vanilla js as you can get with all the benefits of a framework.
LAC-Tech•7mo ago
What benefits of a framework?

I think that's why I wrote this - I almost completely fail to see them.

proc0•7mo ago
I think React caved in to wider adoption pressure to introduce abstractions that are intuitive on the surface level but are costly in terms of large scale complexity.

> It's "declarative" right up until you're debugging stateful hooks, or resorting to useRef, or trying to reason about when a "component" re-renders

Maybe they should have modularized the core library more and have these things be separate, because the core idea of a uniflow pattern with reactivity is good.

I think what happened, at least in frontend, is that the industry pushed away from having engineers do any design or architecting on the frontend. All of these high level patterns have been "outsourced" to frameworks, and the result usually is something that has trouble scaling and adjusting to whatever domain it's in.

LAC-Tech•7mo ago
Maybe they should have modularized the core library more and have these things be separate, because the core idea of a uniflow pattern with reactivity is good.

That's what SolidJS does. IE the signal implementation is completely stand alone. I feel like it's better at doing what react purports to do then react is.

* think what happened, at least in frontend, is that the industry pushed away from having engineers do any design or architecting on the frontend. All of these high level patterns have been "outsourced" to frameworks*

I don't think react patterns are particularly high level, or do they save you from architecture. Whether it's vanilla JS or react, you still have to design.

proc0•7mo ago
Oh I haven't looked at Solidjs yet, interesting will take a look. And yeah you may still need to design your application, but having hooks be something that is out-of-the-box pushes you into certain patterns and needs to be actively ignored to avoid its design influence. I've worked in large codebases where they make almost everything into hooks, and they start getting ridiculous, breaking composability but at the same time giving the illusion that you are making your code more modular.
GianFabien•7mo ago
I write web front-ends for industrial embedded systems. So my experience might differ from business WebApps.

In my experience it requires a longer learning curve for the various frameworks than to simply learn the relevant Web API. My learning is very much JIT and over time I have built up a robust class library that gets my stuff done. When I get stuck ChatGPT suggests fixes that sometimes work and spare me from losing more hair.

LAC-Tech•7mo ago
My experience too - part of what I found is how much about how react worked I'd forgotten. But the browser itself was easier to pick up.

Trolley Problems

https://neal.fun/absurd-trolley-problems/
1•m-hodges•3m ago•0 comments

Can you spot AI videos from real ones? Take our quiz

https://www.npr.org/2025/11/30/nx-s1-5610951/fake-ai-videos-slop-quiz
1•markerz•3m ago•0 comments

The Ethical Computing Initiative

https://aol.codeberg.page/eci/
1•iris-digital•4m ago•1 comments

Own a Graph

https://staysaasy.com/strategy/2025/11/25/own-a-graph.html
1•thisismytest•6m ago•0 comments

Collapse as a measurable structural event: Flexion Collapse Theory

https://zenodo.org/records/17726503
1•flexionU•6m ago•0 comments

Uncle Nerd Runs a Marathon

https://lupyuen.org/articles/marathon
1•lupyuen•7m ago•0 comments

Law changes could soon bring balcony solar to millions across US

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/nov/30/balcony-solar-power-states-laws
1•bookofjoe•8m ago•0 comments

Show HN: Geo / AI SEO Robots.txt Audit Tool

https://ai-robots-txt.franzai.com/#domain=nytimes.com
1•franze•13m ago•0 comments

What I don't like about chains of thoughts

https://samsja.github.io/blogs/cot/blog/
2•jxmorris12•13m ago•0 comments

The Steam Machine's HDMI Port Has a Built-In Identity Crisis

https://www.bgr.com/2034651/steam-machine-hdmi-port-problem/
1•josephcsible•16m ago•1 comments

Cory Booker Weds Alexis Lewis in a Private Ceremony

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/30/style/cory-booker-wedding-alexis-lewis.html
1•whack•16m ago•0 comments

Screencap.me – Screen Recording in the Browser

https://screencap.me/
1•rickcarlino•18m ago•0 comments

Gated Attention for Large Language Models

https://arxiv.org/abs/2505.06708
1•xnhbx•18m ago•0 comments

Canadian mathematician becomes two-time World Champion in Scrabble

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/ottawa-scrabble-champion
2•heresie-dabord•22m ago•0 comments

Funding: The rpki-client project needs your help

https://www.rpki-client.org/funding.html
1•Panino•22m ago•0 comments

I heat my Essex home with a data centre in the shed

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0rpy7envr5o
1•BerislavLopac•24m ago•0 comments

Google CEO says ‘vibe coding’ made software development ‘so much more enjoyable’

https://www.google.com/url?q=https://indianexpress.com/article/technology/tech-news-technology/go...
8•ashishgupta2209•24m ago•10 comments

What Was the First Bookmark?

https://bookmarkstuff.com/blog/2025-11-30-the-first-bookmark
2•devrundown•27m ago•3 comments

People Who Care: A twelve-year-old on personality in tech product design

https://micahblachman.beehiiv.com/p/people-who-care
2•subdomain•27m ago•0 comments

Calculating compressed air requirements: Step-by-step instructions

https://scc-aircompressors.com/en/calculate-compressed-air-requirement/
2•rustoo•30m ago•1 comments

From Zero to GitHub: Starting a New Jj (Jujutsu) Repo

https://www.visualmode.dev/from-zero-to-github-starting-a-new-jj-jujutsu-repo
3•todsacerdoti•32m ago•0 comments

Show HN: Run LLMs locally with WebGPU

https://qwen-web.sdan.io/
1•sdan•33m ago•0 comments

Using Petri nets as a formal language for LLM-assisted development

https://github.com/pflow-xyz/go-pflow
1•orksliver•38m ago•2 comments

GitHub to Codeberg: My Experience

https://eldred.fr/blog/forge-migration/
3•todsacerdoti•41m ago•0 comments

HashJack Indirect Prompt Injection Weaponizes Websites

https://www.infosecurity-magazine.com/news/hashjack-indirect-prompt-injection/
2•nobody9999•43m ago•1 comments

How do we keep apps maintained on Flathub?

https://tim.siosm.fr/blog/2025/11/24/building-better-app-store-flathub/
4•coffeeaddict1•44m ago•0 comments

Interslavic

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interslavic
3•ingve•45m ago•0 comments

Surface Tension

https://iamstelios.com/blog/surface-tension/
1•i8s•46m ago•0 comments

The Thinking Game Film – Google DeepMind Documentary

https://thinkinggamefilm.com
35•ChrisArchitect•46m ago•19 comments

A three-layer memory architecture for long-running agents

1•mvyshnyvetska•47m ago•0 comments