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Bank forced to rehire workers after lying about chatbot productivity, union says

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2025/08/bank-forced-to-rehire-workers-after-lying-about-chatbot-productivity-union-says/
92•ndsipa_pomu•1h ago

Comments

duxup•1h ago
A lot of the linkedIn style "we did X with AI and saved Y" stories seem exceptionally vague and maybe entirely made up.

It makes sense that some companies will be foolish enough to believe and to pull the trigger.

Everyone involved in that decision should be the ones fired. It seems entirely avoidable with some basic testing of the chatbot while still employing these people.

taylodl•1h ago
How many times has a chatbot successfully taken care of a customer support problem you had? I have had success, but the success rate is less than 5%. Maybe even way less than 5%.

Companies need to stop looking at customer support as an expense, but rather as an opportunity to build trust and strengthen your business relationship. They warn against assessing someone when everything is going well for them - the true measure of the person is what they do when things are not going well. It's the same for companies. When your customers are experiencing problems, that's the time to shine! It's not a problem, it's an opportunity.

no_wizard•1h ago
The only time a chatbot worked for me is Amazon's, of all things. It auto approved my return after I answered a few questions.

I haven't had any chatbot outside that be useful to me. I always end up getting to the end of all the prompts only to be told I need to speak to a human or the chatbot going in a circle, in which I have to reach out to a different layer of support.

ryandrake•44m ago
I was about to say the same thing. Amazon pretty much nailed it, at least for simple, straightforward "happy path" returns and refunds. I was actually kind of shocked after the "chatbot" conversation, sitting there thinking "Really, that's it and we're done?" and sure enough the money was refunded!
kjkjadksj•15m ago
Sounds like a downgrade to me considering the previous return flow was to just press the return link and answer one multiple choice question.
duxup•1h ago
I've had bad luck. Most of it very frustrating where the bot obviously doesn't understand anything.

My best luck with a chat bot was ironically only because of HN.

I was to complaining about amazon's chat bot (it would send me in an infinite loop of directions) and someone who worked at Amazon on HN told me that there were multiple chat bots, and they told me the right one use (I had to click a different link on the amazon webpage than I was clicking).

That one worked ... it took some engineer on HN to make me understand how to make it work.

wat10000•57m ago
I bet chatbots are very successful when measuring how much the interaction costs, which seems to be what most companies are measuring when it comes to customer support. The problem is that it's very easy to measure cost (how many person-minutes did it take and what's your hourly cost for support agents, or how much API usage did it take for the bot?) and very hard to measure any outcome the customer actually cares about. Fix this misaligned incentive and the rest will follow naturally, but that requires treating support as a facilitator for the rest of the business rather than as a pure cost center that needs to be minimized.
StevenWaterman•37m ago
I'm currently working on adding a bot to our support chat at TalkJS. And it's great, it has probably a 90% success rate at handling complex queries. But that's because we're throwing money at it. That chat is normally staffed by senior devs, meaning it's not unusual for a single response to cost $10 of labour.

If you approach it as a cost cutting exercise, you end up with crap. If you approach it as a way to make a better experience while you sleep, it's achievable.

turnsout•12m ago
I had an experience recently where the chatbot gathered details about my problem, but then referred me to a knowledgebase article. I just replied "human" and it connected me with a human, but the AI must have given them a detailed summary, because they joined the chat, said "I understand the issue, let me see what I can do," and then two minutes later, said "I went ahead and fixed that for you on the backend."

One way to look at that anecdote is "the AI failed." Another way is "the AI made the human agent about 100% more efficient." I'm pretty sure CS agents don't love gathering basic info.

Illniyar•12m ago
This is mentioned a lot, but it's still true - people on HN are not representative of the majority of users for customer support.

The majority of support tickets are repetitive and answered by a simple formula the representative churns without thinking. Which is likely easily replaceable by chatbots.

darknavi•8m ago
It will be interesting to see how this evolves over time though. As the older generation of folks who generally don't even understand what having an account means on websites exit the customer pool the purpose of support tools could significantly change.
potato3732842•8m ago
>The majority of support tickets are repetitive and answered by a simple formula the representative churns without thinking. Which is likely easily replaceable by chatbots.

I think a large fraction of those repetitive requests are covering up gaps in the customer portal/whatever by doing data entry the customer could be doing.

Like "if you need your address changed call support" type stuff.

sc68cal•1h ago
> Now, CBA has apologized to the fired workers. A spokesperson told Bloomberg that they can choose to come back to their prior roles, seek another position, or leave the firm with an exit payment.

So no real consequences to the Bank for these underhanded tactics, since this just returns everything back to status quo before the layoffs, perhaps with reduced overall headcount as some workers choose not to return and take the exit payment instead, but surely the numbers still worked well enough that they will do it again but be more crafty about it so they don't lose the appeal.

toomuchtodo•25m ago
True, but the union protected its workers from those at the bank. That is the value in the union. In jurisdictions without a union or parity labor policy, these workers would have no recourse for this fraud and the lies.
sc68cal•4m ago
Absolutely! The union did great. My comment is more about, what is stopping the Bank from doing this again? Because there doesn't really seem to be a downside to attempting it. When they lose, they just have to give everyone their job back, but probably end up ahead due to attrition
ranger207•38m ago
""a reduction in call volumes" by 2,000 a week" means people aren't calling in as much. How many problems people have per day is roughly constant, so the only change in how many calls they get is entirely dependent on how much people expect calling in is going to fix their problems. So a reduction in call volume means they're not fixing as many problems which means customers are less satisfied
guywithahat•35m ago
As someone whose family was forced out of the rust belt to escape unions, I just feel bad for the bank. Companies need to be allowed to innovate, forcing them to rehire people when their job is replaced by new innovation is not the way forward or towards higher wages for all
surgical_fire•33m ago
Weird take, considering that according to the text of the article the "innovation" didn't bring any productivity gains.
guywithahat•30m ago
The chatbots did bring productivity gains, the union argued that it wasn't significant enough for them to lay off people. I'm not as familiar with Australian union laws, but companies shouldn't be afraid to innovate like this. Wages don't go up through government force, they go up through innovation and increased efficiency
jurking_hoff•31m ago
Let me rephrase this to be more accurate. It’s good to be able to see through these type of antisocial types.

“Companies need to be allowed to lie to cover their own ass. Taking responsibility for your actions is not the way forward to higher profits for me”

blackguardx•26m ago
I grew up in the rust belt. I've never heard of anyone leaving to "escape unions" but rather there just being not many jobs, lots of historic pollution to deal with, and a poor future economic outlook.

Why were unions specifically to blame for your family leaving?

ranger207•4m ago
I don't think this was "forced" as in "a court told them to rehire them", as it seems the bank agreed to rehire them before the case got to the tribunal. I think this was "forced" as in "their innovations didn't work out as well as they had hoped, so they needed to hire people experienced in the job to make up for the people they had fired, and the only people that matched the description were the people they had fired"
mxhwll•15m ago
Change rarely works, it's the new companies that use AI in these sorts of areas that will show it works and then everyone will follow.

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