Do people who live above 8k feet not die of heart disease or do people with heart disease find it too difficult to live above 8k feet so only people without heart disease live above 8k feet?
I live at 7200 feet and I know several people who have moved to lower altitudes because it's "too hard to breath" here.
It's at 8,000 feet.
I remember staying overnight at Estes Park, 7500 feet. I got a headache. I didn't try anything strenuous.
I recall reading about Mt Everest climbs. Even on supplemental oxygen, your brain measurably dies a little. No thanks. People who climb it repeatedly are, in my not-so-humble opinion, idiots.
However people who climb more interesting (for example Gasherbrum IV 8000m, Muztagh Tower 7200m, Thalay Sagar 7000m or Trango Towers 6200m) Mountains (in alpine style) would call people who sit 8 hours a day in front of a screen "idiots" ;)
This is crazy to me as I usually only get 1 acclimation night in before going up. I’m curious how people can find their limits / needs?
He asked me to explain my work on card shuffling, so we traded. He taught me about altitude sickness, for which he was the foremost expert. I then read his books before my own mountaineering, and his advice worked for me.
In a nutshell, where you sleep matters. 7,000' is free, and a conservative pace is to sleep 1,000' feet higher each night. (Good luck finding a Kilimanjaro ascent that climbs that slowly, but have you met anyone who was comfortable at the summit?)
My wife's brother lives at 10,000'. As it happens the last hotel is at 8,500'. One night does the trick for her.
Alas, I don't have much to trade for it except respect.
Wouldn’t be surprised if this were another contributor to less heart disease- so much incentive to get outside and do stuff.
In practice I note not that much difference at about 2500m altitute, where my main residence is. French/Aeropress suffices. 100°C isn't necessary. Even only 90°C suffices.
Similar for good Tea. You destroy that with 100°C. Very good Tea should be brewed at 60 to 70°C for greens, blacks more like 70 to 85. Though the hardness/pH of the used water is equally important for them. For coffee not so much.
/giggle
I once cooked a stew for friends at 8000 ft. I thought I had made a mistake because it tasted so bland. After the trip I had the leftovers at sea level and realized it tasted just fine. It gave me an appreciation for the fragile relationship between location and following recipes. (Humidity also changes taste)
I felt like I was adjusted 90% adjusted about 2 weeks in, like I could walk at a normal speed. My Garmin watch agreed with this adaption. However, trying to mountain bike with the locals was hilarious... even at week 6 I barely started to be able to keep up on climbs. I rode my mountain bike nearly every day, or at minimum took a several mile hike
Near the end I had a bender with some coworkers. I started developing a persistent "altitude" cough after that that never really went away until I got back down to sea level. The cough disappeared in 36 hours. And wow, did I feel like superman when I got back racing my peers.
Did you catch the important point in my story though? I live an active life style at sea level, but man, people living in small towns in the mountains _love_ the outdoors. We were active every day of the week: riding, hiking, climbing, etc. I could definitely see how altitude helps with cardiovascular health, but it's already been proven that leading an active lifestyle is one of the most amazing things you can do for your health and happiness.
Mountains also allow tons of various sports most of the year as you mention and attract such crowds.
Overall, people go in droves to mountains every year, summer and winter, to recharge. And its a different recharge compared to some beach holiday, much more active and I dare to say a more effective one (active vacations simply recharge better mental tiredness of modern living and working).
I live near Geneva, Switzerland and after moving here basically became mountain sports addict. Hiking, ferratas, climbing, a bit of alpinism in non-winter, and skiing / ski touring in winter. For exotic places there is diving to keep a bit of balance. Did also some paragliding too but had a nasty accident last year that almost killed me so stopped that. Rest I continue, and will do till the last moment I can still do them, they make me properly happy like a toddler. I live in best possible place in the world for people like me, 1h drive from home and I am right below Mont Blanc, towering almost 4km higher than Chamonix valley.
One drawback as you mention - higher mountains are basically high altitude deserts, snow and ice everywhere but humidity easily below 5% ie in Himalaya. Many folks trying ie Everest didnt get higher than base camp simply due to being often sick up there, amateurs and pros alike.
Not sure about that. I find them aesthetically pleasing, and probably most people do, but I know at least one person who remains unmoved when looking at mountain scenery. Of course I find that strange, but there it is.
So not sure about the "objectively". Maybe "Mountains are aesthetically pleasing to MOST humans"
That depends on the type of person I think. Plenty of stuff to do at the beach or in the water as well. Surfers (with ambitions) are pretty active people for instance. But sure, on average most people are way more active in the mountains than on the beach and personally I do prefer the mountains.
(And I tried hard moved moving also into the alps, but it did not work out so far, I will rather now move from semi mountain area to a flat area, but not for too long I hope)
I always lose few kgs of muscle on a vacation like that, despite ie full diving suit weighting maybe 40kg. Surfing is very active sport I didn't master yet, but can't imagine doing that around equatorial with that humidity, ie in that Sulawesi sea was 29-30C, air 32-33C day and night and 90-100% humidity.
You have to. There's no activities besides outdoor activity and drinking and almost every other aspect of living in the mountains is more difficult (versus a normal, big city in a more hospitable terrain and climate).
When I lived in the mountains everyone was either there for the activities, or was a drug addicted hospitality worker there because they couldn't find jobs in cities.
Huh, interesting. A friend of mine moved from sea level to ~6000 ft a few years ago. She said it took her a bit of time to get used to running at the new altitude, but eventually felt as comfortable with it as she had down here at sea level. I asked her if running feels easier to her at sea level now, when she comes down the mountain to visit, and she said it doesn't; it's basically the same as it used to be when she lived here.
Maybe the extra 4600ft you went up to made a difference in that, and of course everyone is different, but that's still interesting to me.
For your health sure. But for happiness, only if you actually like sporty activities. I don't, and it feels like a chore. Having to do chores all the time makes me unhappy. I've always hated anything to do with sports.
In think some people get an endorfin hit from it but for me that doesn't do much either. I just feel empty and exhausted after it.
Then I remember Denver was the mile-high city.
I've lived mostly outside cities though so no major pollution. I'd imagine for Delhi folks the pollution must have a big effect on their lungs - but you'd think it would translate to working well for high altitude.
At least, that's what I remember from the film, and the Wikipedia page says "feet."
Also, I don't know if the Rockies have a 25,000-foot mountain (I think the Andes do, though).
Us Americans are kinda awkward about measurement units...
The highest peak in the Andes, is Mount Aconcagua, which is just under 7,000 meters. That’s the highest point in the Western Hemisphere.
In Memphis, I’d probably see 7-10 heart related issues a day, with about 2-3 of them being actual heart attacks. Every single day.
By contrast, in Boulder I saw maybe 1-2 heart attacks a year.
It was absolutely astounding. Now, there could be some confounding variables like income/education/exercise/diet. But like another poster said, high altitude places seem to bring out more activity in us.
Boulder is a small college town of mostly affluent younger people. Memphis is an urban city in a hot climate that is older, poorer, and in the middle of the section of the US that has some of the worst health overall.
Before college, when I had last been to CO, I didn't get any altitude sickness. Post college, I discovered (by blacking out on the slopes at Vail) that I now got bad altitude sickness. It now takes me almost 2 weeks to aclimate, but once I do, boy, is it amazing.
The most fun time was when I flew home to the East Coast after being there 4 months. I felt like absolute Superman. So much energy, barely needed any sleep! I only wish those effects lasted more than 5 days...
Theoretically solar cells designed for more more UV intensity could produce quite a lot more electricity.
I imagine solar panels for space craft are designed with this in mind.
Of course the economics of this, that there’s only a few places where this is useful wouldn’t justify it all.
The biggest issue people don't talk about? Remote high alt places often become unlivable for people when they get elderly due to altitude interference in certain medical conditions, and the general distance away from hospitals.
I miss the mountains so much all the time, and hope to retire back up there.
The hardest part is getting used to cooking at the elevation.
As to comments here about days resting while progressing to higher altitudes, such as in the Himalayas. A day or two will mostly result in adjustments in the water balance of your blood. It takes about 10 days to two weeks for your bone marrow to start producing additional red blood cells to compensate for the lower level of oxygen in the air.
High level altitude sickness is more complex and relates to multiple factors, including fluid balance, the health of one's vasculature and lungs, etc.
It is certainly the case that populations that have lived at high altitudes in the Himalayas or Andes for thousands of years have evolved adaptations that make such living easier.
Millions isn’t that many people :)
I think the highest up I've ever been for any solid amount of time was 10,500 feet, and sure, I could tell the difference, but it wasn't debilitating or anything remotely like that, and I could do moderate-plus physical activity without anything bad happening.
I've also been up to 15,000 feet (Salkantay Pass in Peru) for a very short time, and definitely felt it. A few people in my hiking group had to take some medicine, and one or two availed themselves of camels. But I would also consider this hike a high-exertion activity; they were fine when we took a break for a while and relaxed.
But I'm just not convinced that most (generally healthy!) people need that much acclimation before doing day-to-day tasks, including regular levels of exercise.
rc_kas•4mo ago