frontpage.
newsnewestaskshowjobs

Made with ♥ by @iamnishanth

Open Source @Github

fp.

Open in hackernews

America Has Become a Digital Narco-State

https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/america-has-become-a-digital-narco
39•rbanffy•1h ago

Comments

BLKNSLVR•1h ago
Want to do something that protects a significant percentage of children? Ban social media for children.

Work out a zero knowledge way to verify age, and implement it. It won't be easy, but it also won't require breaking the rules of mathematics as per most of the governmental requests to 'safely' backdoor encryption.

jeffrallen•15m ago
And shockingly enough, the EU has been investing in this technology for a while. Check out OIDC4VCI, and the selective disclosure protocols that go with it.

The Swiss citizens just approved a system like this.

graemep•12m ago
> Work out a zero knowledge way to verify age, and implement it

is it feasible? is it likely given government's desire for more surveillance?

personally I think the best approach is to empower parents - require ISP's and ISP supplied routers have means to filter, ensure child friendly filtered SIM cards are easily available etc.

prngl•40m ago
I think this is spot on. It’s interesting how rhetoric about “liberty” seems to practically serve oligarchy. I suppose an alternative to bans and regulations is to genuinely pursue the elimination of deprivation, orient our collective capacities towards our collective well-being, and then let people do what they will. Anything short of that seems to be a rather false liberty (and a rather false democracy, while we’re at it).
exasperaited•33m ago
> It’s interesting how rhetoric about “liberty” seems to practically serve oligarchy.

Because the USA confuses liberty and libertarianism.

You can tell this is almost universally the case because even libertarians don't think they need to vote for libertarians to reach libertarian goals. They will get them either way.

sam-cop-vimes•26m ago
And it also prioritises financial success over everything else, stoking the worst tendencies in human beings.
ajuc•31m ago
> It’s interesting how rhetoric about “liberty” seems to practically serve oligarchy.

It's the typical pattern.

If you don't have rules attenuating the runaway feedback loop - some people get a little more initially (talent, money, luck, whatever), then it spirals into A LOT more, which gives them influence over everybody else, which is oligarchy, and that eventually turns into a dictatorship.

The only way to avoid it is to have strong institutions and regulations stopping the feedback loop.

We knew it thousands of years ago, nothing changed. We seem to have to learn this lesson independently in every newly-created domain. It's time for tech sector.

> I suppose an alternative to bans and regulations is to genuinely pursue the elimination of deprivation

How do you propose to do it without bans and regulations?

Octoth0rpe•26m ago
I think we treat the maximization of liberty (in my mind a primary function of government/society, with reasonable limits) as the same goal for both corporations and people, which ultimately is a side effect of treating corporations like people. But these are entirely oppositional goals: Maximizing personal liberty of actual people requires significant binding restrictions on corporations.

In the US we have this overly simplistic narrative of pro-liberty GOP versus anti-liberty DNC which I think badly needs to be separated into pro _personal_ liberty positions (healthcare, including abortion, quality public education), versus anti _corporate_ liberty (environmental regulation, financial transparency, etc).

api•22m ago
There’s different kinds of libertarians, and there’s certainly one kind that is only interested in the freedom to be an asshole.

Note that this kind of “libertarian” also tends to be fine with attacks on women’s reproductive freedom for example, or fine with small local forms of tyranny like the abusive family or community.

andy99•30m ago
> even though heroin harms and often kills those who consume it

I’m going to stop you right there. Basically the whole opioid epidemic is because herion is illegal. We’d have way fewer deaths if we’d provided safe and legal access to it. And also American companies would have the profits instead of terrorists and organized criminals.

leipie•22m ago
The key is to regulate it and offer support to people afflicted by it, not let it room free.
monooso•17m ago
Your comment has very little to do with your chosen quote.

You're arguing that the scale of the opioid problem is a direct result of the associated laws. The quote just states that heroin is harmful to humans.

fragmede•29m ago
How much does the author actually know about a heroin addiction? I mean, I don't have one, but I've talked to people that do, and a lot of the problems with heroin are because we made it illegal and hard to get. If we sold it for a dollar at every gas station we wouldn't have nearlythe same problems with it we do today. And besides no one sells heroin anymore, everyone has moved on to fentanyl.
diego_moita•25m ago
He uses heroin as a metaphor. Do you know metaphors shouldn't be taken in very precise details, right?

> If we sold it for a dollar at every gas station we wouldn't have nearlythe same problems with it we do today.

Go to Portugal. Heroin consumption is legalized there. And it isn't a pretty sight.

tiagod•22m ago
Heroin consumption isn't legalized here, it is decriminalized.

Also, it was MUCH worse when it was a crime.

komali2•20m ago
Well, I will love to go to Portugal someday, but for now I used the internet, and found out that since Portugal decriminalized heroin, its drug usage has fallen below EU average:

https://transformdrugs.org/blog/drug-decriminalisation-in-po...

actionfromafar•15m ago
It's complicated. Portugal had a huge problem before it was made "legal", too. (It's not exactly legal.)

Look at drug overdose deaths for instance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_Portugal

reactordev•23m ago
That’s the addiction talking. Of course they want it, and easy. Once you have it, you’ll forever want it. It’s like that.
exasperaited•15m ago
Widespread heroin addiction might cut military spending but would not be cheaper for health services.

Sure, in its clean form it won't kill you quickly, but it is a horrendously addictive depressant with significant medium-term and severe long-term neurological and physiological effects that would in themselves cause poverty through loss of work even if it was as cheap to buy as it is to produce.

It should remain a decriminalised controlled substance and every effort should be spent trying to stop people ever starting to take it — the Portuguese strategy. Not least because if it's cheap and freely available, many, many people will overdose on it.

andy99•12m ago
This is an unpopular opinion here, I won’t give my theory as to why, but people seem to imagine that drugs being illegal is the main barrier preventing the proletariat from using them and we’d all be rushing to the heroin store the second it became available.
sam-cop-vimes•29m ago
Spot on. There was a lot of sensible stuff in the National Security Strategy document published recently, but the attack on Europe was shocking, even though it is in line with recent events. It is time for Europe to chart its own course and reduce dependence on America as it should on Russia.
actionfromafar•25m ago
It's an incredible own-goal for America. Attack Europe, be soft on Russia and China. Forcing Europe to cut ties and cuddle up to India and China.
sam-cop-vimes•18m ago
I am fairly certain that Russia has some kompromat on Trump and to avoid that being disclosed he is destroying the world as we know it. Just being a misogynist racist doesn't quite explain all of his actions.
ajuc•10m ago
The motivation is irrelevant TBH, what matters is the action.

Maybe Trump just wants USA to be "Russia but Better". Maybe he's imagining himself saving the world from "leftism" or whatever. Maybe he just wants money. Maybe he's being blackmailed.

Doesn't matter. What matters is that he's making the world a much worse place.

tjpnz•6m ago
If the allegations in the Steele Dossier were proven to be factual I couldn't see that changing anything, maybe during his first term but certainly not now. Even if the worst possible scenario were to play out with the Epstein files he must be immune to that by now.
9dev•18m ago
The major headline in response over here in Europe was "the transatlantic relationship is dead now". It’s so confounding, and needlessly destructive.
diego_moita•28m ago
True.

In the US, it isn't just about social media being vicious. It is, more than that, how it became a plutocracy that controls the government and congress.

And is a plague that the rest of the world is just catching up to. It isn't just the European Union that wants to regulate it. India's government, Brazil's supreme court, Australia, ...

I which we could have a global wake-up. The world would be a better place without social media.

sam-cop-vimes•25m ago
The American Dream is all about money. Any society which enshrines money as its holy grail for people is bound to end up where America is today.
reactordev•21m ago
This is true. In the last 50 years it went from family to money. A couple recessions scared people into removing regulations and restrictions and next thing you know our fiat is detached from the gold standard and wheeee
graemep•10m ago
I do not think that is a purely American problem by a long way.

Ultimately these regulations will be twisted to serve the same people. We have seen this with the UK's online safety act, it looks like EU law is going the same way.

neves•22m ago
When we read about historical facts, I am always impressed by how entire societies do terrible things. I always thought it was ignorance or information censorship. Nowadays, I see intelligent people working for these big techs here on Hacker News. They are people I admire and who are very well-informed. I then realize how we are not free from the most terrible moments in history.
sunshine-o•3m ago
I vaguely remember the author is a Nobel Price in Economics so he is supposed to be a intellectual, very wise man paid to warn us of incoming problems and opportunities.

Beyond the clickbait title I am not gonna judge is analysis (he is probably right) but ask the question:

Where were those people 20 years ago? before Meta became a 1.68 trillion business and others became some of the largest companies by marketcap?

Because any room temperature IQ person already figured out a long time ago social media were addictive. No need for a Nobel price. Ironically this is why people get their information from anybody on social media, precisely because they figured out they are not getting any real insight from Paul Krugeman.

fch42•3m ago
Fighting wars (more than one, in fact) to force a country into permitting unrestricted sale of opioids has historical precedent of course. The victim then was China, which tried to enforce their laws on drugs ... to the dislike of English Businessmen with enough pocket money to buy the army.

I for one would prefer to buy wine in a Utah grocery store. Or maybe even just a NYC supermarket. Even if it's wine from Texas, though I know that really stretches the meaning of "wine". And I'd also like to carry the bottle publicly as least as proudly as someone can carry their gun.

(oh how easy it is to trigger libertarian impulses. I'm with Voltaire in that one, say what you want. I'll fight - alongside you for your right to do so, and against you when I disagree ...)