>After filtering out invalid VINs, we narrowed the dataset to roughly ~15 million crashes. (We also removed all drug and alcohol related crashes, since it’s unlikely someone committing insurance fraud would be under the influence.)
Which I immediately found extremely implausible. Seems like the author is very much NOT familiar with the type of people who commit insurance fraud.
In the next paragraph the article links to the FBI website on the fraud ring in Connecticut.
https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/staged-accident-ring
Which says
>After an autumn evening of drinking and using drugs in 2013, a group of friends got into an Audi A6 and drove to the remote Wilderness Road in Norwich, Connecticut. The car slid off the road, hitting a tree.
>Everyone in the car survived, but this seemingly typical crash was no accident.
>Despite their impairment, the driver and passengers had purposely planned the crash to collect the insurance money.
So yeah, don't exclude drug/alcohol related crashes. Also the author should read the first fucking sentence of the stuff they link. It's only six words in!
Yeah. I'm not a fraud expert, but "impaired judgement" is a common effect of alcohol, and "desperation" is a common effect of drug addiction, so it seems weird to assume that people using drugs are committing fraud at a lower rate than the overall population rate.
As a side note, I grew up in Norwich so it's funny to see it mentioned in that report as "remote" because there isn't really anything remote in Norwich. Wilderness Rd, despite its name, does a ring around Mohegan Park, which is an urban-ish park with some trees and a rose garden. You can walk to the rose garden from the high school, which I sometimes did. Anyway.
I guess that might be one explanation?
That said ... yeah those particular VINs do look seriously dodgy to me! If nothing else, then the drivers reporting 5 crashes in a 12 month window probably shouldn't be driving.
I was in the left lane, stopped, signaling to make a left turn, when someone rear ended me because they didn't notice me.
I was stopped at a red light. The octogenarian behind me revved his engine, dropped into drive, and peeled out to rear end me a second time, because he “had places to be”. When I asked for his insurance, he drove off and I had to file a hit-and-run report with the police.
Just saying, sometimes you can be minding your own business and get really unlucky.
Given they have enough data, at some point it's perfectly reasonable to have cars with 5+ crashes per 12 months - just because of chance.
This is exactly why statistics was invented, damnit!
If you have a fraud model, just show the model and the data and the validation - everything else is marketing fluff.
Firstly, there's no account for correlation between the features identified. The article mentions VINs which have several single-vehicle accidents, for example, but someone who has one single-vehicle accident is probably more likely to have another. Switching coverage is another of those potentially-correlated features; if you claim and it bumps your premium, aren't you likely to shop around as a result?
Secondly, there's no attempt to account for the law of large numbers. It's incredibly unlikely that someone has three single vehicle accidents in a year, but because the probability of that is nonzero, we know that with enough vehicles on the road then someone is going to do it.
The article covers itself by acknowledging this, of course, but if you title your blog post "We Found Insurance Fraud in Our Crash Data" then you should actually do that.
But the point being, I really don't have evidence one way or the other. Implying insurance fraud is saying you think a criminal act occurred, and when you say something like that the burden should be on you to provide some evidence to that effect.
Random internet commenters bullshit all the time. But this blog post provides specific data and an unambiguous conclusion that fraud occurred (the title does not hedge, it is "We Found Insurance Fraud in Our Crash Data"), so if you do something like that you need to provide evidence for it. I appreciate the parent commenter for pointing out that, despite all of their data, they didn't really provide much evidence for their conclusion.
When the post actually boils down to "hey if you look at a large dataset then you'll find unusual events in it, now visit our AI startup!" then that irritates me enough to whine about it in the comments.
It's the same reason I don't assume memory bits flipped by solar radiation are the most likely cause of my bugs.
These are not symmetrical claims.
title: "we found insurance fraud in our crash data"
end of post: "Does this prove fraud? Absolutely not."
lmao
I haven't followed this story to know whether she's still driving, but one driver was involved in 7 crashes in 4 years, including two fatalities.
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/crime/2022/06/17/car-cra...
https://fox59.com/news/indycrime/indy-woman-to-serve-3-years...
>Anderson received the maximum sentence by Judge Charles Miller of three years, laid out in the plea agreement.
>Under the plea agreement, Anderson’s license will be suspended for six years, the maximum under a Level 5 felony, and she will also be named a habitual traffic offender, which will suspend her license for 10 years. The license suspensions will run concurrently.
Being involved in multiple accidents could suggest fraud but it could also just be bad driving, maybe someone very young or old.
It’d really help to know the base rates for many of these things: how often do people switch insurance, for example?
1. Drink/drugs impair your judgment, making you more likely to commit fraud if you were on the fence, or the impulsive sort.
2. Drunk drivers get into multiple accidents, but some are able to keep evidence of impairment off the record (buddy on the force or the insurance co, etc.)
3. Drivers doing drugs that aren't detectable on the spot, and clear the body quickly, reducing evidence of drug use in crashes.
4. More people are likely to do drink/drugs at night, so if 1-3 are true, we should expect to see more crashes at night. Likewise for a lack of witnesses (fewer passengers or bystanders).
Most importantly, statistics are completely absent from the article. Does OP have any evidence these numbers wouldn't fit the correct random distribution? I know the point of fraud is to appear natural, but if done well, that means evidence has to be collected by other means, and this kind of analysis is only a weak signal.
And it's not very wise to announce your metrics publicly. All fraudsters can read also.
Uh... I'm not surprised at all that auto insurance fraud, which involves vehicle collisions, might show up in vehicle collision data. This is sensationalist crap.
Yes Fraud is tricky, but a VIN does not equal a person (PII) committing the behavior, and these poor association attempts leave innocent people screwed by insurance companies. What makes this bad analysis annoying, is the constant caveats, if you know VIN associations don't prove fraud then maybe don't build some sort of risk scoring on it, and then try an sell it.
pavel_lishin•4h ago
This is very, very good advice. Dashcams are cheap, and easy to install. Treat yourself - spending $80 on a camera could save you thousands in lawsuits, insurance hikes, costs of a new car, etc.
To me it seems nearly as important as having a smoke detector in your house.
barbazoo•4h ago
ceejayoz•4h ago
badlibrarian•4h ago
But what you're saying ignores the fact that you're not the only turkey on the road.
kurthr•4h ago
If someone backs into you, or slams on their breaks on the freeway without reason you can drive as defensively as you want and still get unlucky. People can cause "accidents" much more effectively than you can avoid one. Careful motorcyclists know that watching the behavior of all the people around them is critical to survival, but they still get into collisions.
If you do try to drive so "defensively" that you can never get into an accident another person tries to cause, then you end up with 7-10 car lengths of separation, and people will regularly cut you off increasing risks. Please don't be that guy stopped 70ft back from the traffic light and stopping on on-ramps.
jandrese•4h ago
pavel_lishin•3h ago
hermitShell•4h ago
When they asked me for insurance I just dragged it out and made friendly conversation(eventually giving the insurance slip). They got increasingly irate and panicked. Maybe because it was only a glancing blow and wouldn’t exceed even a slim deductible.
Anyway, I should probably get a dash cam…
Noumenon72•4h ago
NoMoreNicksLeft•4h ago
steve_adams_86•4h ago
Tireings•4h ago
And you always need to be able to stop your car independently of the other do. You know minimum braking distance?
jstanley•4h ago
Did you try to avoid giving them your insurance details? Why?
What would the dash cam have shown?
Noumenon72•4h ago
ChrisMarshallNY•4h ago
Didn't bother with the rear-facing one.
ok123456•4h ago
stonemetal12•4h ago
jandrese•4h ago
I would also like the ability to turn on the rear camera when moving forward, for those times when the rear view mirror is blocked, especially on vehicles where the backup camera is integrated into the rear view mirror.
umanwizard•4h ago
jandrese•4h ago
ldoughty•4h ago
There are cams that can do a rear view as well from inside the cab, which likely provides enough evidence if you're rear ended.
I only opted for a forward facing dash cam.
In my state, you are 100% at fault for rear ending someone unless you can prove your innocence -- which a dashcam can do assuming the person in front does something shady (like lane change + intentionally slam breaks).
However, do note that dash cams are not going to magically make rear ending the person in front of you somehow that person's fault. Virtually no one seems to leave enough follow distance by default because doing so means someone merged into the space.. and a dash cam doesn't shift the blame for simple rear endings unless it can prove some kind of malice or inattentiveness on the other driver (but even then, inattentiveness of the other driver is not necessarily a legal defense for you not leaving enough room to react.. perhaps if they stopped faster than a car could be expected to break, e.g. hit a concrete wall....) -- of course, laws vary by state
gruez•3h ago
And probably charge you $1000 to install a $100 dashcam.
pavel_lishin•3h ago
pavel_lishin•3h ago
Installation was easy - glue a thing to the windshield & rear windshield, & run the wires to the cigarette lighter USB adapter (which was also included). It was a bit of a pain to tuck the wires into the trim around the doors, but overall, not bad.
But yes, it would have been easier to have a dealership install one for me.
rsync•3h ago
An excellent example of the absolutely awful behavior that can be encountered on the road:
https://www.reddit.com/r/scammers/comments/1g6xcng/attempt_t...