I'm proud of him, but I'm very glad that he's not doing it anymore. If something happens or if someone panics down in the cave then it's easy to stir up the mud and loose your guideline. It takes just a moment, but when it happens it is super serious and dangerous to everyone in the expedition.
> Isn't the guideline karabinered to your suit
No, there are no lines attached (to minimise the risk of entanglement). In good visibility with pre-laid lines, you'll often not touch the line.In poor visibility you'll gently hold the line. If there isn't a pre-laid line, the lead diver will have a reel which they progressively release, and tie-off at intervals (to any useful protrusion).
https://divingadelaide.com.au/basic-reel-and-guideline-use-f...
"The World's Largest Subterranean Lake Is A Vibrant Scuba Diving Paradise In Missouri"
He was a chill guy but like ... he was just steely af. Can't imagine the nerve it takes to crawl around in those places. Gives me the willies!
For the rank amateur that I was, being able to turn around, orient myself and see a sliver of light ~100ft behind me... yeah, "technically a cavern dive".
I tried to do a "buddy check" w/ him before beginning the dive and he almost pushed me away... the stories of him diving with side-by-side tanks, then pushing each of them through a gap in front of him, one by one, and then wriggling his body through. :insert-shocked-emoji:
Always remember: "Are you a diver, or a dummy?" ...what would a DIVER do? [don't panic, fall back to your training] Good to have that sense of self an security in lots of cases!
Through an accident of fate and the original guide I'd booked getting sick, he was my guide on literally my first dives after getting certified.
He was like: "don't touch my equipment, try not to die, I'll be fine... what are you realistically going to do for me if there's a problem (and there won't be a problem)" ...after I explained that I was just trying to adopt the good habits we were taught in the classes I just took, he chilled out a bit, but still wouldn't let me touch his equipment.
My first open water dive (post certification) was unplanned- a small earthquake closed the cenotes on the second/third day until they could be vetted by "the pros" and make sure everything was safe for tourists again.
Ended up bumping into a shark (aka: "bear in the woods") at ~80ft and my (different) guide went chasing after it to take pictures, so I had to kindof keep up and think to myself: "I probably would stay away from that roughly human-sized shark, but also, I'm supposed to stay within 5-10 feet of my buddy in case he has equipment problems...... I'll just keep him in between me and the shark..."
Good times! :-D
What struck me the most was him saying "calm the f down cowboy, calm the f down or you're going to die", and his face when he said it. I can't imagine the sangfroid required. I also can't imagine the conversation when they both reached the surface.
The Mecca for cave diving is in the Yucatán and surrounding areas and the caves there are exceptionally warm. The surface water can be chilly, coming in around 21c at one of the many cenotes (sinkholes, which are the entry points into the system) as rainwater fills them, but the further into the cave you penetrate you will eventually cross the halocline, at which point deeper = warmer ocean water. It’s quite unintuitive but delightful to warm up after a 2+ hour dive. It’s common for divers to go deeper, pull their wetsuit open a little to fill it with warmer water (24c+) and then rise up back to the planned depth.
Cold cave diving is a very different experience and is usually found in Florida and Europe. Don’t recommend.
I am envious of the speleothems in Yucatán cenotes. Florida's caves are all phreatic, so you don't get any real decoration beyond scalloping. Still fun to dive, just not much to see aside from water, wet rocks, and a line. And not even that if you blow the viz.
Here in lakes Michigan and Superior, diving on wrecks usually brings you below the thermocline to water temps from 0C to 10C ~= 50F. Only on rare inversions or at the surface at the south end of the lakes do water temps get much above 70.
You Florida, Carribean, and Central American divers have it made with your balmy water temperatures!
Are the tanks still 40lbs or has technology finally caught up to them?
(Incidentally exactly 1000 km.)
Technically correct, I guess: it is miles (quite many of them).
block_dagger•5mo ago
krunck•5mo ago
chatmasta•5mo ago
nemomarx•5mo ago
DevelopingElk•5mo ago
roygbiv2•5mo ago
Zenbit_UX•5mo ago
Generally speaking, these are rare events in both sports but one allows much more time for rescues.
outworlder•5mo ago
keepamovin•5mo ago
widforss•5mo ago
The bolting techniques used in caves are fucking terrifying. They work, but they are terrifying.
bwv848•5mo ago
widforss•5mo ago
And also using temporary bolts as the Coeur 8 mm, which is rated for 2 kN before deformation in the worst direction (and the mechanism of those bolts are more akin to a cam, making them squiggle a lot in the hole, which is safe, but scary. My ice axe don't squiggle).
Obviously you use redundant bolts, and there are much lower forces in SRT than in dynamic falls, but I still think it's scary as hell.
ramses0•5mo ago
You're on the surface, generally with a life vest, don't have to worry about running out of air, generally the guides inter-communicate and take you to hot spots of fishes or turtles or whatever... tropical warm water. Biggest difference is access to air rather than having to be "self-sufficient".
southernplaces7•5mo ago
While spelunking, if you become lost or trapped, how long can you live without food (assuming your clothing is reasonably warm enough to protect you from hypothermia) while waiting for rescue? Quite a while, many days even. Most navegable caves have plentiful air and it being toxic isn't too common. Water is also usually present; it might not be clean water, but you won't easily die of dehydration in just a couple days at least.
Now imagine being trapped in a submerged cave, where none of the above applies at all, and you will die in a very specific range of seconds immediately after your extremely limited supply of tank air runs out.
Yep.
Also, silt lifting in submerged caves can reduce visibility down to a total zero in just seconds if you or a partner accidentally upset settled silt deposits with any sort of rapid movement. These can take more hours to clear than you have air to breathe, and in those situations, you'd better hope you have a guide line and absolutely do not let go of it at all.
Spelunking is very dangerous at its more extreme end (being the first to explore unmapped caves, going on multi-day trips into caves prone to flooding or other additional dangers, etc), but even normal cave diving makes it look like a sunday walk in the park.
I've seen many reports of utterly professional, extremely experienced cave divers dying during their descents despite doing everything they could think to do correctly. It can just be that dangerous. In some cases, this happens even in well-mapped underwater caves, and in a grotesque irony, there are many cases of them dying while working retreival operations for the bodies of other cave divers who just recently died in the same cave.
adriand•5mo ago
yreg•5mo ago
I think what happens next, if you get deep enough into the sport, is that you become good at it and you are looking for stronger challenges to overcome yourself again and again. That's how you become a cave diver.
Still there are some special places down in the caves as well. And I think what makes them even more specials for the divers is the feeling of exclusivity that most people would never get to go there.
callahad•5mo ago
It's also really peaceful underground.
Amusingly enough, I can't handle blue-water or wall dives (vertigo), nor wrecks (those aren't supposed to be there!), but caves are no problem. You've got walls, floor, and ceiling as a frame of reference, and everything is nice and cozy. It's like the Earth is giving you a hug.
[0]: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Vortex_Spring_cave...
ramses0•5mo ago
For me it was a BHAG (Big, Hairy, Audacious Goal), and I'm glad it kindof helped change or tighten my trajectory. SCUBA training is designed for you to succeed, and supposedly if you make it past your first 10 dives, you're much less likely to have any severe issues. For danger, each dive is equivalent to walking ~100 miles or biking ~50 miles: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort#Leisure_and_sport
Some of the caverns are basically exactly like that scene from Star Wars where they land the Millenium Falcon in the mouth of the worm on the asteroid. It's pitch black, only your light is beaming around, there's little tiny flecks of "dust" in the absolutely clear water that you're floating in (seriously! it's like rain-water filtered through 50ft of limestone that's mostly undisturbed for centuries). Safe-ish if you're not dumb with a not-dumb buddy/guide, and focus on minimal impact. Take only memories, leave only bubbles.
There's a bit of a "science" component where you can see fossil remnants, or weird little fishies swimming around, and it is absolutely foreign, alien, and peaceful. I've experienced "halocline" (salt water under rain water, https://www.cenotetours.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/haloc... ) and thermocline (a coherent warm water "stream" flowing through regular water), seen turtles, puffer fish, sharks, urchins, octopus, and starfish (not in caves though!).
It's been years since I've done it, and I'd go through training/refresher again if I wanted to get back into it, and I'd really avoid "cave" diving (stupid tourist cavern routes that have 20-50 people per day are totally fine by me). It's a unique experience that supplements the general one (think: rock climbing / bouldering as an adjunct to hiking... "wow, I can do that too!")
nradov•5mo ago
joeguilmette•5mo ago
In sports like skydiving and technical cave/wreck diving people often assume you get an adrenaline rush doing it and that’s what draws people in.
Not the case (for me at least).
Rather, when you get good enough to be competent at these there’s no adrenaline. Adrenaline is when you are operating beyond your skill level. The satisfaction comes from calm, cool, collected execution, with the knowledge and training that allows you to avoid the dangers and do something exceptional with a much lower risk profile than an outsider would assume.
It’s also fun to play with gear (toys).
keepamovin•5mo ago