Tesla's German car sales more than halve in October as wider EV sales jump

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/teslas-german-car-sales-more-than-halved-october-2025-11-05/

73•moosedman•3mo ago

Comments

moosedman•3mo ago

I don’t understand how the Tesla fanboys don’t realize how badly he’s torched his consumer base with his politics…

_aavaa_•3mo ago

It’s cause Tesla isn’t a car company, it’s an AI robotics company’s /s

schiffern•3mo ago

This but unironically.

justapassenger•3mo ago

Not releasing any new model in half a decade (let's forget about cybertruck - tesla already did) didn't help either.

schiffern•3mo ago

Nope, bad strategy advice.

Tesla is battery-limited, not demand-limited. Adding models would only add complexity without meaningfully increasing revenue.

It helps to know basic fundamental facts about the company.

BigTTYGothGF•3mo ago

> Tesla is ... not demand-limited

Per the article, this no longer seems to be the case.

schiffern•3mo ago

You fell for the "we didn't say it so technically we didn't lie" clickbait headline, I see.

This article is the same recycled misinformation that's been repeated for years. What's actually happening is that Tesla does regional delivery waves, which results in large month-to-month fluctuations. Nothing new here.

Yes Virginia, the media will distort information to sell eyeballs. Color me shocked!

buellerbueller•3mo ago

YTD-over-YTD, tesla sales are down 30% in EU. That is not explainable by month-to-month variation.

You fell for the "numbers are real" conspiracy.

BigTTYGothGF•3mo ago

From the article:

> The number of Teslas sold in the January-October period dropped 50.4% to 15,595 units, compared with the same period last year.

mjamesaustin•3mo ago

Please explain how a demand limited company is seeing dramatic reductions in its annual sales? They used to be demand-limited. Not today.

schiffern•3mo ago

False premise. The company isn't demand limited, despite the (conspicuously implied and never actually stated) conclusion the headline desperately wanted you to reach.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45827800

I really wish people had any media literacy left. This brand of lying without lying is extremely common in modern media, and also extremely easy to spot once you know what to look for.

afavour•3mo ago

Did you even read the article?

> KBA said Tesla sold 750 cars in Germany in October, down by 53.5% from a year earlier. The number of Teslas sold in the January-October period dropped 50.4% to 15,595 units, compared with the same period last year.

To be clear, you are suggesting that Tesla had no delivery "wave" between January and October? And that is the sign of a healthy company?

tcfhgj•3mo ago

His claim is it's battery limited. I understand that as too little batteries are able to be produced to match the demand?

Permit•3mo ago

Can you (instead of pontificating about media literacy) share evidence that Tesla is currently battery-limited?

mentalfist•3mo ago

Delusional take. Look at sales and/or inventory trends over the past year. The demand is clearly crashing, and for many good reasons

ajross•3mo ago

> Tesla fanboys don’t realize

I don't know who you're addressing. Lots of people, me included, don't like the conspiracy minded politicization of his fortune but still think the cars are pretty great. Seems like a boring opinion that wouldn't be controversial, but we still find ourselves subtweeted anyway.

(Edit: three downvotes and a Godwin's Law reply drop within seconds, as expected. Seriously folks there are 125k people who work for that company, must everything about it be judged entirely on the last twelve months of one guys mania?)

verdverm•3mo ago

The winds have shifted, politics has seeped into everything, consumers are voting with money, most people are rejecting contemporary right-wing policies and politics.

No longer are we going to tolerate the intolerant. If you are willing to look past the moral failings, you are seen as part of the problem and should expect consequences. Social dynamics are at work

> (Edit: three downvotes and a Godwin's Law reply drop within seconds, as expected. Seriously folks there are 125k people who work for that company, must everything about it be judged entirely on the last twelve months of one guys mania?)

It seems the answer is a definitive yes, reflect on why this is.

Also, it's far more than 12 months. He's been manic for far longer, if not his entire life. We just saw the unfiltered version for the last 12 months. Now we know

buellerbueller•3mo ago

>most people are rejecting contemporary right-wing policies and politics.

Hmm...

>No longer are we going to tolerate the intolerant. If you are willing to look past the moral failings, you are seen as part of the problem and should expect consequences. Social dynamics are at work

The woke left forcing ideological conformity loses them a lot of support from the center-left, which turns out is not a winning electoral strategy. At which point one must wonder if the wokeness is just performative and virtue signaling, rather than an attempt to gain actual political power.

verdverm•3mo ago

> The woke left forcing ideological conformity

It's not about forcing conformity, it's about having basic human decency. Right-wingers belittle and dehumanize so many groups and people it's hard to keep track

see also: Paradox of tolerance

> turns out is not a winning electoral strategy

umm, did you look at the election results from yesterday?

#1 economy (i.e. emotionally driven tariffs)

#2 people don't like seeing children and neighbors disappeared by masked thugs (i.e. due-process and rule-of-law)

buellerbueller•3mo ago

>umm, did you look at the election results from yesterday?

>#1 economy (i.e. emotionally driven tariffs)

>#2 people don't like seeing children and neighbors disappeared by masked thugs >(i.e. due-process and rule-of-law)

None of which are the identity politics issues that the woke left forces on people, and expects ideological conformity on.

BolexNOLA•3mo ago

You’re totally right. Rampant government cuts, attacking healthcare subsidies, attacking LGBT Americans, threatening universities, ego-driven tariff policy, and just generally poor economic stewardship, should be the electoral strategy. It sure seems to be working out for republicans.

buellerbueller•3mo ago

>Rampant government cuts, attacking healthcare subsidies, attacking LGBT Americans, threatening universities, ego-driven tariff policy, and just generally poor economic stewardship, should be the electoral strategy. It sure seems to be working out for republicans.

I agree with none of these policies. I also just disagree with the woke left's focus on identity politics, because I see it as a losing battle, electorally. I prefer the left to focus on labor and economic issues, which apply broadly to all, regardless of their identity.

I believe in Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and insofar as it informs my political views, food shelter and jobs are far more important issues than identitarian issues. Solve the basic needs first, and when everyone has a fair piece of our wealthy country's economic pie, I suspect we will find the identity issues are easier to address, with broader support.

BolexNOLA•3mo ago

You keep saying “the woke left’s” identity politics as the Trump administration uses the government to enforce right wing identity politics and stifle free speech. Do you also find that objectionable? Or do you think this is purely a problem on the left?

My guess is the only difference is you agree with conservative identity politics and not liberal identity politics, so one is seen as “natural and normal” and the other seems “manufactured and forced on people.” I could be wrong, but that is generally my experience in these conversations.

buellerbueller•3mo ago

>You keep saying “the woke left’s” identity politics as the Trump administration uses the government to enforce right wing identity politics and stifle free speech. Do you also find that objectionable?

Yes.

> Or do you think this is purely a problem on the left?

I am not a member of the right wing parties, so I have no pull with them. I also think they are less likely to change.

>My guess is the only difference is you agree with conservative identity politics and not liberal identity politics

Your guess is wrong. I think all identity politics are bad politics until we solve basic human needs stuff like feed and house everyone and jobs that pay a living wage for anyone who wants one.

I get it, I don't fit into your preconcieved box, but the boxes are designed by the oligarchy who wants to keep us in separate boxes, so we can't unite.

BolexNOLA•3mo ago

It’s not about a preconceived box. It’s that you keep saying “the woke left” and only “the woke left” despite the fact that it is Republicans controlling all three branches of government right now. It is republicans doing the thing you’re claiming you’re against. Yet (again) it’s all “the woke left, the woke left.” Omissions can be louder than words, and yours are screaming.

Also in my experience, most people who keep grinding their axe against “the woke left” are not as moderate/above party politics as they make themselves out to be.

buellerbueller•3mo ago

Ok dude.

balls187•3mo ago

> must everything about it be judged entirely on the last twelve months of one guys mania?

Yes, unfortunately.

Build a thousand bridges...

saubeidl•3mo ago

There is no apolitical, there never was. To say that you're apolitical is just an implicit endorsement of the status quo, coming from a place of privilege.

FireBeyond•3mo ago

I've yet to meet a person who both says they are "apolitical" and are more liberal in their perspectives.

It's like centerists. It's funny how when you push at them they reveal more and more right-leaning opinions.

Libertarians should, ostensibly, probably have a fairly split voting history, but yet it's always much more right-leaning too.

01100011•3mo ago

Is it really Godwin's Law if the guy literally performed a public Nazi salute?

programable•3mo ago

Not only that, Musk eagerly promoted Tucker Carlson's interview with a Nazi who said the murder of Jews in concentration camps was "humane", and that Winston Churchill was the "chief villain" of WW2.

hiddencost•3mo ago

Idk man he's staked his reputation on eliminating my trans family from America. Get fucked.

breve•3mo ago

> must everything about it be judged entirely on the last twelve months of one guys mania

The standard you walk past is the standard you accept.

ajross•3mo ago

Yeah, but "the standard" in this case is basically "everyone's slightly racist drunk uncle". You or I might disagree with that politics but it's absolutely not "uncommon", at all. In fact there's nothing particularly notable about the guy's opinions at all absent the financial force behind them.

So... are we cancelling the guy for his opinions or engaging in praxis trying to eliminate his ideology's funding? Very different moral calculus, IMHO, and neither seems very well justified (or implemented[1]) by the attitude I'm seeing in these debates.

[1] I mean, downvoting your fellow lefty traveller in a tiff over the car he drives might feel good but it's clearly not having the desired effect of changing Musk's politics. I am not your enemy, basically. Why are you fighting with the guy who's already voting for your candidates?

postflopclarity•3mo ago

if your slightly racist drunk uncle was the richest man in the world and one of the most politically influential oligarchs in US history, sure.

ajross•3mo ago

Right, and I repeat: if this you arguing with drunk uncles, that's not me. If this is you doing praxis and trying to organize, you are aiming at the wrong target by trying to engage with your political allies here on HN.

Mostly, I suspect, you're just angry and wanting to blow off steam. Which is fine! But not likely to make either of us feel better.

breve•3mo ago

I don't see the point in the mental gymnastics to make excuses for Musk.

He's plainly not as you wish him to be. It's much better to simply see him as he is.

This is how he is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smQNNo2a9xc

It's not great.

ajross•3mo ago

Where do you see me making excuses for Musk? I'm saying I'm happy to drive, buy and recommend a Tesla even if the company is run by a drunk uncle because the other 100,000 of them seem like they worked hard to make a good product. You really think Telsa is the only company with drunk uncles at the helm?

Again, the collision of your personal politics with what you want to achieve seems really muddled here. What do you achieve by yelling at me on HN, exactly?

breve•3mo ago

Calling him a drunk uncle is making excuses for him.

ajross•3mo ago

Only if you take as a prior that he's somehow more objectionable than the like 20% of the electorate that I'm painting as "drunk uncles". And he's... not. He's just rich. Musk doesn't say or do anything you can't see on Fox every day. He doesn't spout opinions you can't read expressed right here on HN in every politics thread (in fact he's a pretty pure distillation of the HN self-righteous libertarian jerk, honestly).

And you don't like that. And I don't like that either. But I'm not going to judge him any more severely than I do anyone here. And yeah, I think the cars are pretty great, and the people that make them (to first approximation, none of them are Musk!) deserve to have jobs making successful cars.

At the end of the day you need to share society with people you hate. And some of them make products you need or want. This isn't a winnable fight you're engaging in.

postflopclarity•3mo ago

> Musk doesn't say or do anything you can't see on Fox every day. He doesn't spout opinions you can't read expressed right here on HN in every politics thread

again, he literally threw two Sieg Heils. I don't see that every day.

ajross•3mo ago

That's a pretty strained "literally". Even taking everything at the worst possible interpretation, it's edgelord fuckery. Not something I'd personally support, but absolutely in the "drunk uncle" category of misbehavior.

I think some of the problem is that people aren't exposed to enough drunk uncles to know how awful the electorate can be. Again, we're barely a half century removed from living in a literal[1] segregated society.

But the drunk uncles are out there, and you are doing business with them all the time. Picking fights over cars within your own community of like minded people is a shibboleth/proxy argument that does nothing but hurt your cause.

[1] Literally literal, in this case.

postflopclarity•3mo ago

it's really not strained. did you watch the (many) videos? it is a literally literal Nazi salute, twice.

> taking everything at the worst possible interpretation

wouldn't the "worst possible interpretation" here also equal the simplest possible interpretation, which is that he did two Sieg Heils because he's a Nazi sympathizer?

> you are doing business with them all the time

I'm really not generally in the habit of supporting the business interests of Nazis, no.

just to be clear, if my uncle were a Nazi he would not be welcome in my life, in my home, nor near any of my family. I'm not sure why you're going to so much effort to excuse this behavior.

ajross•3mo ago

> it is a literally literal Nazi salute, twice

It is clearly not, though. It's arguably evocative of one. There is an actual form to the thing, it was a military gyration, and people taught it. You can even read the Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_salute It is static at the end, being held with palm down and arm stretched forward. It does not begin at the heart, as Musk performed, nor swing sideways.

Obviously you don't care about this minutiae, but it's important if you want to hang your argument on "literally a Nazi salute".

What you and I both agree on is that this was intended to evoke the idea. Where we differ is how you want to interpret it. You, I guess, think it means signaling a desire to repeat the holocaust, or something maybe a little less horrifying.

I think it's pretty clear he's wanting to create exactly the argument we're having. To wit, this was a troll, and you fell for it, and now all us lefties look like Ivermectin snorting loons because real people OBVIOUSLY know that Musk isn't a nazi.

breve•3mo ago

Actions have consequences.

Musk chose his actions and now he gets to live the consequences.

There really is no point in trying to excuse or rationalize it.

ajross•3mo ago

Just to extend the thread: nothing you say there engages with my point (which amounts to "Musk is just a routine reactionary right winger like we all deal with every day").

You're just saying you want to hate him because you want to hate him, and by extension I'm not allowed to (there is "no point in") trying to explain my contrary opinion because you disagree with it.

It's not a very HN comment. And I really don't think you're internal moral compass is consistent on this, again citing all the drunk uncles you do business with without shame.

breve•3mo ago

You aren't making any points. You're emotionally trying to rationalize Musk's behaviour. It's not worth your time or effort.

In the end, Tesla is just a car company. You can buy an EV from a company that isn't run by a "drunk uncle". And if you're invested in Tesla, diversify your investments (that's just good financial sense).

Teslas aren't exactly cutting edge anymore. For example, Tesla's charge curve is quite weak compared to other EVs:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cy46Ag0djjk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAky0r8n5sk

ajross•3mo ago

> You aren't making any points.

You replied directly to a comment where I tried to engage substantially and with external links in a discussion about whether or not he was "literally" doing a Nazi salute.

You ignored that part in favor of a "actions have consequences" quip. Then when I called you out you decided to change the subject to something that amounts to "Well Teslas aren't any good anyway!".

To be blunt: that's a taking-your-toys-and-going-home argument, and HN deserves better. The whole point of this interminable subthread is that I'm trying to challenge your assumptions. And it seems like I'm doing it pretty well, given the way you're deflecting. Maybe you'd find it more productive to do some introspection?

breve•3mo ago

> You ignored that part in favor of a "actions have consequences" quip.

It isn't a quip. It's a practical reality.

The brand damage is real. Musk has cost Tesla a lot of sales.

> "Well Teslas aren't any good anyway!".

They aren't that good. Other EVs are indeed better.

postflopclarity•3mo ago

you're supporting the business ventures of a literal Nazi.

I'm generally not a fan of "cancel culture" but in this case I think a boycott is the only ethical choice.

TheAlchemist•3mo ago

It's not only politics, although it certainly didn't help.

Tesla did not release new cars, except for Cybertruck, for how long ? 5 years ? 10 years ?

Their lineup was great initially, and there was 0 competition. Now there is a lot of competition and their lineup did not change at all.

Their car business is dying. That's why they try to be an AI & Robotics company.

Edit: Here is a good link to follow the sales data - for many countries, it's reported daily. https://eu-evs.com/brandCharts/TESLA/ALL_DAILY/QoQ-Chart

yangikan•3mo ago

Does anyone know if Musk's robotics/AI business is under Tesla? What prevents him from launching the robots under a new company? Is there any protection for Tesla investors against these kind of things?

TheAlchemist•3mo ago

Well, if you follow his adventures a bit, it's quite obvious that there is absolutely nothing preventing him from that.

2 years ago, while claiming that Tesla is the leader in AI, he launched a private ... AI company (xAI), for which he took Tesla GPU chips, and now he tries to make Tesla ... invest in said company, at a valuation (>B100$) that could only be compared to something like Dogecoin.

All of this, with your and my retirement money, since the stock is in the S&P.

schiffern•3mo ago

  >Tesla did not release new cars, except for Cybertruck, for how long ? 5 years ? 10 years ?

As stated earlier, this is extremely bad strategy advice.

Tesla is battery-limited, not demand-limited (delivery wave concern trolling from OP's headline aside). Adding models would only add complexity without meaningfully increasing revenue.

It helps to know basic fundamental facts about the company before commenting.

  >Now there is a lot of competition and their lineup did not change at all.

More misinformation. Tesla continuously updates their cars unlike most manufacturers which are stuck in "waterfall" model year refreshes.

See Sandy Munro's excellent breakdowns on the phenomenal pace of innovation at Tesla compared to competitors.

TheAlchemist•3mo ago

Not demand limited ? Yeah sure, CEO once said that they have infinite demand (at the right price /s).

If they are not demand limited, can you explain why they slashed prices, are offering countless promotions which evaporated their margins, and are running the factories at 50% capacity ?

bydo•3mo ago

Why weren't they "battery limited" when they were making more cars?

bigtex•3mo ago

What happened to those 2 million cyber truck reservations? Supposedly had enough demand for 8 years

m463•3mo ago

> their lineup did not change at all.

I think they messed up all models (removing stalks/controls), and took successful and decent looking model y and made it look odd.

preezer•3mo ago

You are absolutely right. I live in Germany. Me and many of my friends considered Tesla as a real alternative, but after his lunacy came to light, none of us will even think of driving one.

Night_Thastus•3mo ago

Aside from politics, their cars have a reputation for poor quality control. Peeling steering wheels, leaking seals, funky air conditioner smells, etc. Then when there are problems you may be waiting months while it sits in a service center. Or the stupid thing may shut off (due to errors or updates) right when you need it.

I would not want to buy one of them for any of those reasons, regardless.

mattmaroon•3mo ago

And they don’t have CarPlay. I was considering one but then I started dating a girl who drives a Model Y. So many little things wrong. Like the vent fan rattles, leather peels, etc. And when you get even a minor ding in the exterior, good luck.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

And their nearest competition Hyundai/Kia have disintegrating reduction gear and exploding inverters.

All cars have issues, but stats favour Tesla all while they are cheapest to repair.

Night_Thastus•3mo ago

Right now the electric car market sucks in the US. I'd honestly recommend people just go hybrid instead. Toyota has been doing it for 18 years now and hasn't had any reliability issues.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

But then you’d drive a car made for an 80 year old.

Night_Thastus•3mo ago

I don't really feel that's a fair analysis of either the brand or hybrids in general and paints in too broad of strokes.

But regardless, If someone really wants a sporty car, they can get a sporty car. The vast majority of car buyers don't really care. They care about things like space, comfort, features, and monthly payment.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

It's not only sportiness. It's also absolutely spartan features / technology that's also got terrible usability, bare minimum comfort level, etc. Reliability is mixed bag too - hybrid batteries clap out pretty quickly and then you got all downsides of ICE maintenance.

The only niche I see remaining for hybrids/phev's is large cars in large countries with bad charging infrastructure (aka US, AU).

Night_Thastus•3mo ago

All the evidence I've seen says hybrid batteries can often outlive the whole car.

Im not sure how hybrid had anything to do with other features or comfort. Features like carplay/aa, heated wheel/seats, ventilated seats, automatic wipers/parking brake/high beams are all independent from drive train. I've never seen a manufacturer reserve them for ICE or electric-only.

themafia•3mo ago

I don't understand why people think only left wing voters would buy a Tesla.

If you think that's true then people aren't buying a quality vehicle they're buying an ideological badge.

If you don't think that's true then people aren't buying them because they're not quality vehicles.

hiddencost•3mo ago

You're confused.

themafia•3mo ago

I am a human, so that's entirely possible, but perhaps you'd like to expand on this point, otherwise, I risk remaining confused.

Let me be clear about my point though, Tesla's are _not_ quality vehicles, and given a choice, consumers with money will not select them. Politics do not enter into this equation outside of Hacker News.

AndrewDucker•3mo ago

1) Left wing people have been more likely to buy an EV because they're seen as better for the environment.

2) Even if he only drives away the left wing half of the population that still halves his customer base.

yongjik•3mo ago

I think you're looking at it from the wrong end.

You're right that most people don't want to buy an ideological badge. They want a quality vehicle. The problem is that Musk turned Tesla into an ideological badge.

Off the top of your head, can you think of a single political remark made by the owners of Audi, Toyota, or Hyundai?

rsynnott•3mo ago

In Europe, even most of the right wing, except the _real_ fringes, get a _little_ uncomfortable about _Nazi salutes_. For, y'know, obvious reasons.

(Tbh, I'm amazed that the right in the US seem willing to give him a pass on that.)

01100011•3mo ago

I'm still seeing quite a few new Teslas in San Diego(arguably a more conservative city by CA standards).

Someone is still giving him money for some reason.

mattmaroon•3mo ago

They understand that he has, they think it’ll blow over.

moosedman•3mo ago

It won't

azakai•3mo ago

Some data on how badly he torched his consumer base: a Yale study says Tesla lost 1.26 million US sales due to Musk's politics.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/cars/news/2025/10/28/tesla-lo...

standardUser•3mo ago

It might help if Tesla would release some new models that aren't obnoxious gimmicks with missing paint jobs.

jstummbillig•3mo ago

Why would you assume that's not the case? Knowing something has gone wrong is different to putting effort into ensuring the general public is aware that you know something has gone wrong.

electric_mayhem•3mo ago

I was all in on Tesla in 2019. Solar, powerwalls, model 3.

Traded the car in a couple months ago. It was ok, as a car, but I hated what it had become synonymous with so it was worth the financial hit to give up a paid off car. Turns out the new Mach-e which replaced it is better in every way.

Might be some fanboys left, but a bunch of folks who might have fallen into that category in the past have been driven away by Musk’s unconscionable activities.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

We are not even in US, but 2 of my Tesla friends turned to support Trump and upgraded to new Model Y. I'd do the same, but I'm broke. I don't support Trump at all, but at least I don't suffer from TDS.

I feel there has been shift or perhaps we were cringe tech bros from the start.

schmidtleonard•3mo ago

> at least I don't suffer from TDS

Trump earns the ire of his political opposition. Framing that ire as delusional is itself delusional.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

Nicely put. But there's ire and there's a very small minority of derangement.

tstrimple•3mo ago

The fanboys buy into the politics. They legitimately believe Musk made Twitter a place for free speech just because they can say racial slurs without repercussions. But happily ignore folks censored for saying such awful things as "cis". Musk fans are hypocrites first and foremost. Just like most right wingers. They demonstrate time and time again that they have zero real values or consistency.

LightBug1•3mo ago

Excellent news. Thanks.

KaiserPro•3mo ago

Part of this is down to musk being an obnoxious prick, but a larger part is down to teslas not actually being innovative, cheap or high quality enough any more.

They look dated, or weird, have patchy customer service, and are not even that long range anymore.

pimeys•3mo ago

They are all over Berlin as rentals, which you can rent from your phone, and pay per kilometer. People can test drive them easily, and they are not super nice cars. We much prefer the Audis, Toyotas, and Volkswagens that are also in the pool.

rstupek•3mo ago

From US sales, Audi can't give away their electric cars. Is it any different in Berlin or are you referring to gas/diesel Audis?

bryanlarsen•3mo ago

The VW group sells 13 different vehicles built on the MEB platform. The id.4 alone sells comparably to the Tesla Y, but if you consider all 13 the same car they are far and away the best selling car in Europe.

Considering all 13 the same might be a stretch, but if you just take the 6 that are the same size as the id.4 you still end up with the same result.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

In 10-20-30 years, which one do you think you'll be able to maintain - obscure VW ID.4.324.7-cz or Tesla Model Y?

_aavaa_•3mo ago

Is this a trick question? I know the Tesla software locks as much as possible to prevent third party repairs.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

Huh? All cars are software locked.

With Tesla at least you can pay $5 per day to use their tools (and you NEED their tools because they are up to date with cars firmware).

I'm sure once cars are EOL'd Tesla will release final version of diagnostics, like they did with Roadster - https://github.com/teslamotors/roadster

gnabgib•3mo ago

All? My 1927 Ford doesn't seem to understand bluetooth

bryanlarsen•3mo ago

The VW, obviously. With most parts shared across 13 models and all models static for at least a year and usually longer. Plus VW has a good history of parts availability.

Tesla on the other hand is famous for both making minor changes to their vehicles pretty much continuously and a bad history of parts availability.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

1M cars over 13 models mean you’ll have no parts at all. 10M identical cars means there’s massive third party supply. Parts are already cheaper than Toyota’s.

rsynnott•3mo ago

Teslas very much aren't identical over models. Remember this? https://www.extremetech.com/cars/314871-tesla-model-y-owners...

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

Moot point over a bracket when car has over 30k total parts.

bryanlarsen•3mo ago

A typical car sells tens of thousands per year and has no problem with parts availability. 1M cars is even easier.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

Rivian and Lucid sells like 15k per quarter and is on verge of bankruptcy.

orwin•3mo ago

I have hosted the models (mostly regression and random forest) WV use to predict missing part availability at their dealership in 2018-2020 (considering sales in the area, average fabrication/delivery time, likeliness of the part having to be replaced, probably others).

I guarantee you that even if I don't like their car, their dealership will very likely have the part you need around the time you need it. It's not the only car-adjacent company that does something like this (Valeo for sure does it too, i worked with them also), but I'm pretty sure it's the only one who has an internal data scientist team working on it.

rsynnott•3mo ago

... What makes you think a VW ID.4 is obscure? I think it's usually the best-selling electric car in Europe. You see way more of those with recent (last few years) registrations in Dublin than Teslas.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

Less than 1M units total sold worldwide or about 10x less.

pimeys•3mo ago

Gas/diesel mostly.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

They are still insanely good value for money. Buying car for its looks is not smart.

Yet (salute + support for ADF party) * touchy german history = auto non-grata.

m463•3mo ago

I think the model s, model 3 or the previous model y look great.

The recent model y looks terrible, like a duck.

And the ergonomics are cheap and dangerous.

Removing turn signal stalks, drive select stalks is dangerous. I like the idea of buttons, but turn signal buttons? buttons on a moving steering wheel? and the rest of the critical controls buried on a touchscreen? inside door handles? ugh.

mvdtnz•3mo ago

> I think the model s, model 3 or the previous model y look great.

They look terrible. They looked terrible when they came out 13, 8 and 5 years ago and they have aged very poorly.

cosmicgadget•3mo ago

I think we will solve this aesthetics dispute with additional, more emphatic, back and forth.

m463•3mo ago

well, sales say apparently not so much forth as the cybertruck.

submeta•3mo ago

Elon promised too much (self driving cars coming next month, this time for real), and the market has realized that after the 25th promise, he‘s not going to deliver.

Also, Elon should have stick to cars and rockets. His venturing into politics, and into media (with buying X) didn’t help him either. He got demystified, and demolished his image of a super focused half-einstein, half-edison. Now more of an half-Trump. And that didn’t help his car sales either.

hiddencost•3mo ago

It wasn't a promise, it was a lie.

dzhiurgis•3mo ago

It self drives in like 6 or 7 countries now.

ceejayoz•3mo ago

Unsupervised?

afavour•3mo ago

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out. Tesla has been way, way overvalued for a very long time. If that starts to change I suspect it'll change very quickly and Musk's status might see a dramatic change.

Iulioh•3mo ago

If Tesla's valuation had to follow earnings it would not even be in the SNP500

BolexNOLA•3mo ago

You could say that about a lot of companies right now to be honest. It’s kind of wild how detached from reality some stocks are. But there’s no denying that Tesla is one of the most egregious examples.

fundatus•3mo ago

Interesting, not only is Tesla 50% down YTD, but it seems like BYD almost caught up with them:

15,595 (Tesla) vs. 15,171 (BYD)

chollida1•3mo ago

> Interesting, not only is Tesla 50% down YTD,

TSLA is not down 50% YTD. Its up this year so far.

Can you show the math that shows it down 50% YTD?

fundatus•3mo ago

I am talking about the numbers in the article (Tesla sales in Germany), not the stock:

> The number of Teslas sold in the January-October period dropped 50.4% to 15,595 units, compared with the same period last year.

senordevnyc•3mo ago

TSLA believers have long since forgotten that these four characters are connected to a company that is ostensibly supposed to be selling cars. It might as well be an NFT to them.

chollida1•3mo ago

OH, ok, glad I asked then:)

Appreciate the explanation.

mk89•3mo ago

It's literally written in the article:

> The number of Teslas sold in the January-October period dropped 50.4% to 15,595 units, compared with the same period last year.

YoY is -50%.

breve•3mo ago

Swasticars don't sell well.

The main problem with Musk's proposed pay deal is that he still gets paid billions even if he continues to fail:

https://www.reuters.com/legal/transactional/musks-record-tes...

Tesla's sales target is now to have sold 20 million cars in total by 2035. That's fewer cars in total in what will then be the 32 year history of the company than Toyota sold in the last two years:

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/05/business/elon-musk-tesla-...

Tesla's target used to be 20 million per year:

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/tesla-...

But Tesla's board doesn't care. They got theirs:

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/13/business/tesla-stock-sale...

https://www.afr.com/technology/life-changing-wealth-stopped-...

yalogin•3mo ago

We know why the decline is happening. However, I am more curious to see how long people's memory will last. Also a little surprised that there isn't a whole lot of decline in the US.

mk89•3mo ago

This is not just German related, apparently. It seems Tesla sales in EU are falling since 2023 [0].

And it seems that until now, Tesla sales in Eu are 30% less than last year [1]

There is more competition, finally.

[0]: https://www.benzinga.com/tech/25/01/43092840/tesla-struggles...

[1]: https://electrek.co/2025/11/03/tesla-tsla-keeps-getting-batt...

ChrisArchitect•3mo ago

[dupe] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45826384

LightBug1•3mo ago

When I think of Tesla, I think Elon Musk sweeping up some garbage on the street while simultaneously taking a dump on it ...

I'll never buy a Tesla. Personally, Musk has delivered generational toxicity to their brand. And he now seeks to be rewarded for that.

The Board is dysfunctional.

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