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Opening the AWS European Sovereign Cloud

https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/opening-the-aws-european-sovereign-cloud/
28•notmine1337•3d ago

Comments

esher•3d ago
Dear smart people on HN, what do you make of this? I understand most of you are US based. Is that Amazon getting ready for serious trade war, US/EU?
willmarch•3d ago
It is an attempt to not lose European customers that might be tempted to migrate to Europe-based solutions in the current political climate. In the event of a serious trade war (like you suggested) and/or a real war, it gives some assurances; which is smart based on the threats from the current unpredictable and authoritarian U.S. administration.

But it probably started as a way to comply with EU laws more easily, so it works on multiple levels.

10729287•3d ago
How much can we trust this so-called sovereign cloud? That's a sincere question. I can't think of a more American company than Amazon, and I find it hard to believe that it could be completely independent from its American headquarters.

I really hope that Europe will get its act together rather than relying on this half-hearted solution.

willmarch•3d ago
They claim the "AWS European Sovereign Cloud represents a physically and logically separate cloud infrastructure, with all components located entirely within the EU" and that it operates entirely under German laws, but I think your skepticism is warranted.

I think Europe should push for its own solutions rather than fuel oligarchy/authoritarianism, if they are serious about their own security and preserving liberal values.

timeon•3d ago
Physically separate infrastructure as well as local employees help to some extent. But it is not really sovereign cloud. There is no guarantee that employees would know if some commands are illegal. Plus parent company can fly anyone there if needed.
kingleopold•13m ago
If you think deeply and logically, you will see that those text and even some legal details are just marketing that aims smart people. because in case of war or some serious conflict, they will be obeying the parent company and orders of usa government. see ICJ prosecutors and microsoft, you have real proof live, if you can connect some dots.
nprateem•38m ago
Not at all. Trump applies any leverage he can. "Nice US cloud you've got there... would be a shame if anything happened to it..."
timeon•3d ago
It has already been discussed here a bit: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46640462
yndoendo•1h ago
EU, as a US citizen, go all in and ditch the US as much as you can. Not only will this bring competition, it also means that the US Government cannot grab the balls of Amazon and squeeze the EU market.

I wouldn't trust Amazon with my data if I was an EU citizen. As a US citizen I don't even trust Amazon with my own data. This is why I support de-Google, de-Microsoft, and de-Apple computing.

esher•3d ago
> AWS European Sovereign Cloud is located in the state of Brandenburg, Germany, and is generally available today.

Appears to be in Massen: https://www.lr-online.de/lausitz/finsterwalde/investition-in...

esher•3d ago
Commission launches market investigations on cloud computing services under the Digital Markets Act https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_25_...

> Two market investigations will assess whether Amazon and Microsoft should be designated as gatekeepers for their cloud computing services, Amazon Web Services and Microsoft Azure, under the DMA, in other words whether they act as important gateways between businesses and consumers, despite not meeting the DMA gatekeeper thresholds for size, user number and market position.

whatever1•1h ago
AWS EU reports to amazon.com in the USA. They are legally obligated to provide any data the US government requests.
jeremyjh•1h ago
They can provide any data available to Amazon employees in the US. They can't provide what they do not have.
whatever1•1h ago
Ultimately everyone reports to the CEO. They will just put enough Amazon CEOs to jail, until one grants access.
jeremyjh•1h ago
Yes let's talk about all the billionaire CEOs that get sent to prison.

Anyway, the entire structure and premise of this business is that they cannot do that. A court cannot put a CEO in jail just because partner businesses do not follow his orders. Do you think it is maybe remotely possible, that Amazons lawyers and architects understand this a little bit better than you do?

I'm thinking they checked it out, they checked it out a couple of times.

There are some details in this comment from the other day: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46641592

whatever1•1h ago
MS lawyers could not do it (MS testified in France that they cannot). What make us believe that Amazon lawyers can?
spookie•28m ago
Adding source for this:

Transcribed (not translated): https://www.senat.fr/compte-rendu-commissions/20250609/ce_co...

Video: https://videos.senat.fr/video.5460497_6847c70b82594

Reports by third parties:

https://www.theregister.com/2025/07/25/microsoft_admits_it_c...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/emmawoollacott/2025/07/22/micro...

Edit/note: The main point AWS makes is indeed by whom/where this offering is operated. But, Microsoft stated that even though they made an environment so that the data lives entirely within the EU they may be compelled to transmit the data back.

nprateem•42m ago
> Do you think it is maybe remotely possible, that Amazons lawyers and architects understand this a little bit better than you do?

Or they just want to make lots of money

mschuster91•29m ago
> A court cannot put a CEO in jail just because partner businesses do not follow his orders.

In the US, rule of law does not matter any more in practice. That is the problem. You can't even say it's "rule by mob" - at least the mob had an honor codex, the current administration doesn't give a single flying fuck about anything any more. Might makes right.

SteveNuts•1h ago
On the list of the things I doubt nowadays, an Amazon or Amazon subsidiary CEO going to jail is way up at the top.

They’ll get a national security letter for sure, but no one’s going to jail.

whatever1•57m ago
Likely the first one will immediately fold to avoid jail.

But for context the head of the FED is currently investigated for criminal charges, governors, mayors, judges etc. Why is a CEO of a company so special? Within hours the board can appoint another one.

rapsey•46m ago
You don't get to be the size of amazon and not be completely cooperative with the three letter agencies.
Waterluvian•3m ago
The one thing I’ve learned without it taking a stupid long time is that there’s no more things that are too ridiculous to imagine happening. The American regime is an irrational actor. They’ll do whatever.
scalemaxx•1h ago
How sovereign is a data center owned by a US firm? What does sovereign mean in this context?
jamesblonde•14m ago
it's whitewashing. The US Cloud Act means they can still take the data.
guyinblackshirt•1h ago
If Amazon is down in the US, would this work? The fact that they mention “any Amazon customer can access this” makes me think it’s intermingled / not cleanly separated and isolated from US infrastructure
Lucasoato•1h ago
From what I’m understanding, it won’t be dependent anymore on us-east-1, but this isn’t mentioned explicitly. This is great, especially if you consider that some cut cable in the ocean could literally turn off a big part of the companies in a whole continent.
willglynn•56m ago
AWS has the notion of "partitions", which is a technical boundary encompassing multiple regions. This mostly doesn't come up, but it does poke through in certain implementation details, like how AMI manifests for groups of regions (partitions) need to be encrypted for different public keys. Each partition has a specific region which must be targeted for certain partition-wide actions, such as managing IAM endpoints in other regions.

https://docs.aws.amazon.com/whitepapers/latest/aws-fault-iso...

Normal AWS (`aws`) traces to `us-east-1`. AWS GovCloud (US) (`aws-us-gov`) is distinct, based in `us-gov-west-1`. AWS in China (`aws-cn`) is distinct again, based in `cn-north-1`.

The AWS European Sovereign Cloud is implemented as a distinct partition – `aws-eusc` based in `eusc-de-east-1` – so it has exactly as much in common with normal AWS as AWS GovCloud (US) or AWS in China.

piccirello•36m ago
The docs explicitly describe this cloud's independence from the US.

> The AWS European Sovereign Cloud will be capable of operation without dependency on global AWS systems so that the AWS European Sovereign Cloud will remain viable for operating workloads indefinitely even in the face of exceptional circumstances that could isolate the AWS European Sovereign Cloud from AWS resources located outside the EU, such as catastrophic disruption of transatlantic communications infrastructure or a military or geopolitical crisis threatening the sovereignty of EU member states.

piccirello•33m ago
> We’re gradually transitioning the AWS European Sovereign Cloud to be operated exclusively by EU citizens located in the EU. During this transition period, we will continue to work with a blended team of EU residents and EU citizens located in the EU.

I find it fascinating that the goal is to staff this exclusively with EU citizens, thereby excluding non-citizen residents of the EU.

Ao7bei3s•25m ago
It's similar to FedRAMP systems like AWS GovCloud (US), which can only be accessed by someone who is a US person (US citizen or lawful permanent resident) and on US soil (physically in the US at the time of access).
nickysielicki•18m ago
It's a regulatory requirement:

> Replicating a broadly practiced mitigation mechanism that is established in EU institution and government hiring practices, operational control and access will be restricted to EU citizens located in the EU to ensure that all operators have enduring ties to the EU and to meet the needs of our customers and partners.

- https://www.aboutamazon.eu/news/aws/aws-european-sovereign-c...

CalRobert•18m ago
It's AWS. Would it not still be subject to the CLOUD act? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act

Seems like a lot of work to still have data that can be exfiltrated by the US.

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Opening the AWS European Sovereign Cloud

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