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The Dark Side of the Enlightenment

https://www.newstatesman.com/culture/books/2026/02/the-dark-side-of-the-enlightenment
18•thinkingemote•2h ago

Comments

aleph_minus_one•1h ago
archive.ph: https://archive.ph/wdEuy
slibhb•1h ago
I appreciate Gray calling out the Soviets and others but I think the whole argument is wrong.

The link between Enlightenment values and imperialism/subjugation of Asia/Africa/Americans is far from clear. Enlightenment values aside, conquering people and taking their stuff was just normal at the time. And while imperialism enriched certain people and led to economic growth, it was probably worse from a economic-growth-first perspective (compared to free trade and sovereignty).

Along the same lines, American slavery was highly profitable for some but there is no good argument that it was essential to the US's economic development. Paying workers supports economic growth by increasing productivity and demand.

Over time, this project of attacking the enlightenment/liberalism has started to seem increasingly boring and wrong to me. For one, the vast majority of these critiques rely on Enlightenment values to critique the Enlightenment. So maybe we should be more enlightened! For another, right-wing populism makes liberal capitalism much more attractive.

Waterluvian•1h ago
I don’t have the data to make a rigorous argument but my intuition tells me that slavery quite likely played a considerable role. It just feels difficult to imagine that something they were so deeply invested in for generations wasn’t that important.

I’ve also wondered if the fiction of American exceptionalism is meant to help future generations pretend that the foundation of their success isn’t built upon an incredible horror perpetrated by their ancestors.

luckylion•1h ago
If there was a strong relationship, shouldn't Brazil be much richer, given that a lot of slaves were forced to live & work in Brazil?
slibhb•1h ago
> It just feels difficult to imagine that something they were so deeply invested in for generations wasn’t that important.

Southern culture was about having giant houses, partying, and not laboring. They didn't fight for the economics of it but rather to preserve that way of life.

> I’ve also wondered if the fiction of American exceptionalism is meant to help future generations pretend that the foundation of their success isn’t built upon an incredible horror perpetrated by their ancestors.

American exceptionalism isn't a fiction. It's probably a selection effect due to immmigration.

And the "incredible horror" is very real...but I'm not convinced that it was necessary ("built upon") for American success.

Waterluvian•55m ago
Did the wealth from slavery play an important role in making the U.S. attractive for significant immigration to begin with?
iamnothere•43m ago
Basically every civilization was built upon some form of slavery, and unfortunately slavery still takes place in many parts of the world. This was (and is) evil, yet we can’t seem to eliminate it, only push it under the rug. Often we encourage near-slavery conditions in other countries, but technically the work is “voluntary” so we don’t call it slavery. Do brutal work in the tin mines or you won’t have food for your family, and your only other choice is to join an armed militia/gang. That sort of thing.

Of course in the US we still have prison labor, thanks to the 13th amendment loophole, and under-the-table labor by immigrants, who can accept low pay and terrible conditions or get deported. Louisiana’s Angola prison is literally a former plantation and still basically operates as one.

The great hope of modernity, for those who believe in it, is that machines may finally replace slaves. (China’s “dark factories” are an example of how this could work.) Sadly we may hit planetary limits before we manage to automate the worst work, and in catabolic collapse we will almost certainly return to open slavery.

(To be clear, in no way is this a justification of slavery. It’s an indictment of the human race.)

dist-epoch•1h ago
Indeed, there was wide spread slavery before Enlightenment, white lords enslaving white peasants all over Europe.
accidentallfact•49m ago
I think the reason for it is actually pretty banal. Rationality won. But it didn't win over irrationality, but over superrationality, and we just suffer the horrors of its wrongness.

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