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Court throws out killer's sentence after judge said he loved AI video of victim

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/sentence-vacated-ai-video-dead-victim-rcna601457
43•rbanffy•1h ago

Comments

bhouston•43m ago
The whole thing is messed up.

The video was created by the sister of the victim based on what she imagined he would say.

The video asked for leniency. But the family of the victim formally asked for the maximum sentence. So there is a conflict here between the video made by the family and what the family asked for - I don't understand why the video was made at all.

The maximum sentence to the accused was handed down, against the wishes of the AI video.

So they are throwing out the maximum sentence based on the AI video asking for leniency?

Regardless of this mess, AI videos of victims saying made up things should not be allowed at all.

philipp-gayret•37m ago
> So they are throwing out the maximum sentence based on the AI video asking for leniency?

It says:

> In sum, while the embedded “real” video footage of the victim was permissible, allowing the presentation of the AI video constituted fundamental error. And on this record, the judge’s consideration of the AI video so prejudiced Horcasitas as to render the sentencing procedure fundamentally unfair. Accordingly, we vacate the sentence for manslaughter and remand for resentencing.

Which is more or less; "AI videos of victims saying made up things should not be allowed at all.".

baobabKoodaa•28m ago
Right. All of that makes sense, but you didn't address the directionality: the direction of the AI sentence was "make sentence more lenient", and (according to the person you are replying to) the sentence was the maximum sentence possible. So if we removed the influence of the AI video, the sentence can not increase from what is already the maximum.
horsawlarway•20m ago
You assume the intent of the video was to be listened to and accepted as actual input.

My assumption is roughly the opposite - the intent of the video was to prejudice the jury as far as possible against the accused (he killed a person honorable enough and empathetic enough to suggest a more lenient sentence! To the pit with him!)

It wasn't about the content of the video - it was about the emotional response to an AI generated facsimile of the victim.

klodolph•17m ago
from what I understand, there’s a high standard here, beyond “beyond reasonable doubt”, along the lines of “no appearance of impropriety”
thevillagechief•16m ago
Perhaps the prejudice is that the AI video is a means of manipulation making the victim appear more sympathetic. "This person must be an absolute monster to shoot such a good, kind forgiving guy." That was exceptionally poor judgement on the part of the judge. -Edit: Exactly what the comment above said.
Natsu•5m ago
[delayed]
fsckboy•28m ago
>The video was created by the sister of the victim based on what she imagined he would say

you don't know this, she could have been working based on advice from their attorney as to "how to get the maximum sentence"

apetresc•26m ago
The attorney thinks the best way to get the maximum sentence is to make an AI video of the victim asking for leniency in sentencing?

What kind of 4D chess is this?

qarl•20m ago
Yeah. The people in these comments aren't following the story.
furyofantares•18m ago
Makes the victim more real (to the judge), I guess. And the family are victims too, the ones who continue to suffer, so I guess the 4D chess is demonstrating what the victims lost.

It eventually makes sense to my brain, aside from the AI part of course. If I'm a remarkably forgiving person my family might both appreciate that about me, and not be remarkably forgiving themselves. And they might say look, we lost this remarkable human being, punish the responsible party harshly.

horsawlarway•16m ago
> The attorney thinks the best way to get the maximum sentence is to make an AI video of the victim asking for leniency in sentencing?

Ab-so-fucking-lutely. This paints the victim in the most positive light. And makes killing them seem even worse.

Again, attorneys understand that a lot of times you're looking for an emotional hook, not straight up "facts". This video made the victim seem moral, empathetic, full of forgiveness... as close to freaking jesus as you can get.

And that other person killed them.

Now go sentence that person.

---

Instead imagine the video was of the victim smoking a cigar, laughing, and suggesting that he'd never forgive him and he should be put to death?

---

Which video makes the jury more likely to actually come back with a tougher sentence? The one where he's a bastard, or the one where he's a saint?

neom•20m ago
https://youtu.be/cMs-_8etNts?t=83

1:23 if you wanna watch it, it's uh... quite something.

And the judges reaction to the AI video in court: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr9b1_rintk

dustfinger•15m ago
I suspect the sister did not anticipate the implications of the video. She might have initially created it for herself as a kind of therapy to help her cope, then thought it might help the families case if she showed it. I am just speculating though.
iAMkenough•42m ago
Apparently that judge is an enemy of the White House because he called it “AI” instead of “SI”
bhouston•41m ago
How do Trump even keep track of the enemy list at this point? It may be easier to just white list individuals who are not enemies? Much shorter list.
superxpro12•39m ago
Precisely. and that list is "white republicans"
MajorTakeaway•32m ago
"White" Democrat here, I believe making a list based on skin color is inherently racist.
Shalomboy•27m ago
That's good! However, there are bigger fish to fry here than tsk-tsking HN's commentariat. ICE is making allllllll sorts of lists based on skin color.
SpicyLemonZest•26m ago
I fear you may not understand that engaging in political meta-commentary when you see someone say "AI" helps Trump politicize the term, even if you do so from an anti-Trump perspective. As a veteran of multiple language change wars, all of which I found incredibly obnoxious, the only times I've had to abandon useful old terminology is when some political movement successfully adopted that terminology as a badge.
wavemode•39m ago
Wait let me get this straight. A man is killed in a road rage shooting. His family shows up to sentencing with an AI video of the victim asking for leniency for the shooter. The judge says he loved the video, then gives out the max sentence anyway. Then a court of a appeals vacates the sentence on the grounds that the judge was biased by the video. Huh? Every single one these statements seems extremely illogical.
wat10000•2m ago
What part of this process would you expect to be logical? Everything except the last one is pretty clearly an emotional reaction.
triceratops•38m ago
I read the article but I'm more mystified than when I read the headline. To recap:

A man is killed in a road-rage incident.

The killer gets the maximum sentence for manslaughter (10.5 years).

The appeals court says the judge was influenced by an AI-generated video of the victim and sends the case back for re-sentencing. Fine, ok.

Where it gets weird: The video was made by the victim's sister. In the video, the victim says he believes in forgiveness. However, the family demanded the maximum sentence for the killer.

This strikes me as strange. If they wanted the maximum sentence why did they submit a video about forgiveness? Did I miss something?

sim04ful•32m ago
Not so much perplexing if they considered the AI rendition an accurate representation. It's somewhat quite internally consistent in its own illogical way
baobabKoodaa•27m ago
You mean: the family members personally wanted the maximum sentence, but they wanted the (dead) victim to be able to express that the victim wants leniency?
ab2525•22m ago
Yes exactly that - I parsed it as such.
justonceokay•13m ago
It doesn’t confuse me at all. But maybe that’s just because I come from a family where people disagree as sport
justonceokay
ChrisArchitect•25m ago
Week old story OP;

[dupe] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49944127

ihumanable•16m ago
> He added that he felt the video was “genuine, that his obvious forgiveness of Mr. Horcasitas reflects the character I heard about [Pelkey] today.”

It's an artificial video that is *literally and verifiably* not genuine.

shevy-java•13m ago
AI makes even judges dumber.
pluc•7m ago
Well at least the deepfake asked for leniency and offered forgiveness.

Wake me up when it starts offering narratives, evidence and alibis.

wat10000•4m ago
Why can't the sentence increase? Maybe the judge was so touched by this video that he gave more weight to the family's request for a harsh sentence. Maybe it just enraged him to see the grieving family affected like this. You're applying frictionless-sphere physics to complicated human thoughts.
savanaly•12m ago
So basically it's that they believe the AI video was so off-putting that it sabotaged its own case in the judge's eyes? And that the case for leniency is stronger without the AI video so let the trial run again so the case can be heard without the AI video??
corndoge•2m ago
Agree with your post, but judges sentence, not juries.
•
13m ago
It doesn’t confuse me at all. But maybe that’s just because I come from a family where people disagree and try to undermine each other as sport
triceratops•4m ago
Even if it's accurate it seems counter-productive to the objective, which is to get the maximum possible sentence.

And anyway you can't know for sure what the victim would've wanted in that specific situation; not unless they had a conversation about it previously. For normal slights, I believe in forgiveness too. Deadly violence over a road-rage incident isn't one of them.

bill_joy_fanboy•9m ago
This whole thing is bizarre.

I don't fully understand the details of the case, but if someone were to kill a family member of mine in a fit of road rage, I would be furious if the sentence was a paltry 10.5 years.

Victims or victims' families pleading for leniency always puzzled me. Where is your iron?

deadbabe•5m ago
People are obsessed with granting forgiveness. Some people want to purposefully be victims just so they can forgive someone. Forgiving gives the illusion of control and a moral superiority that some people really crave. It is performative forgiveness. Conveniently, it is difficult to question someone's genuine intentions about forgiveness, and some people have discovered you can also not be the actual victim and still forgive someone for a crime against that victim.

In reality, there should be no forgiveness, only punishments doled out according to the severity of the crime, nothing more. Justice without passion.

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Court throws out killer's sentence after judge said he loved AI video of victim

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/sentence-vacated-ai-video-dead-victim-rcna601457
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