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Open in hackernews

Show HN: Get your coding agent off ~2019 JavaScript, onto modern web primitives

https://github.com/GoogleChrome/modern-web-guidance
66•paulirish•1h ago
Browsers natively handle a lot of what used to take 50 lines of JS (or a dependency): `CSS.highlights` for text range highlighting without <span>s everywhere, `<dialog>` and showModal() give you backdrops and ideal focus management, `field-sizing` to auto-grow textareas as the user types.. (Something yesterday's ftrain post touched on [0])

Models know about some of these by name, but consistently won't default to using the platform-native solution and instead prefer the incumbent <div>+JS based pattern. We started an effort in Chrome to supplement coding agents with this key domain knowledge and we're shipping our 1.0 today, in collaboration with Firefox, MDN, and Edge.

200+ guides (~1.7MB) of curated, hand-crafted implementation best-practices from web experts, updated as the web evolves. (Open source, obv, so.. we'll welcome your bikeshedding ;) Readable versions here: [1]

I've spent the last 9 months obsessing over how to ship this as an agent skill + (Agentic RAG) CLI without blowing up your context window. (Or cedeing activation mechanics to MCP dynamic tool search). The skill description is minmaxed for activating on relevant frontend tasks. The RAG work I'm pretty proud of… originally a 500mb native stack down to a ~7MB pure-JS package, ~10ms search on your CPU.

We just introduced a deterministic 'legacy-scan' (trained on 30k github repos) to identify old 'n dusted patterns that your agent can modernize. (92% avg precision on held-out repos.)

People make a lot of claims about what coding agents are good/bad at. We wanted receipts, so we invested heavily in eval infra [2] to help us hill-climb, but also to identify when knowledge is common enough we can prune our guides. (Ofc, some of the things we thought AI didn't know turned out to be wrong :) We run codex/claude/agy against 200 tasks without the skill and then with.. In total ~1,700 playwright/AST-based assertions. Agents go from 55% pass unguided to 92% guided.

Try it out:

    DISABLE_TELEMETRY=1 npx modern-web-guidance@latest install
    DISABLE_TELEMETRY=1 npx modern-web-guidance@latest search "animate dialog modal"
    DISABLE_TELEMETRY=1 npx modern-web-guidance@latest legacy-scan ./src
If you spot something wrong or weird, give us a holler!

Longer write-up on the 1.0: https://developer.chrome.com/blog/modern-web-guidance-v1

---

0: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50416456

1: https://developer.chrome.com/docs/modern-web-guidance/guides

2: https://googlechrome.github.io/modern-web-guidance-src/

Comments

phyzix5761•1h ago
"Best Practices" are pretty much dead in the AI era. Pretty soon no one is going to read any of the code AI produces and that's a scary thought.
natorion•1h ago
Best practices are not dead if they result in better user experience. The focus is less on developer ergonomics though - true that.
paulirish•1h ago
IMO maintainability is the next frontier. If we just allow coding agents to accrete 1k-LOC solutions to problems, the codebases run quick away from our ability to maintain _some_ level of understanding.

So I'll take a 1-line CSS solution over 60 lines of ResizeObserver/setTimeout business. But.. best practices for frontend isn't just the code.. it's ensuring quality UX, that keyboard navigability works, that layout doesn't shift on users.

brlewis•49m ago
>Pretty soon no one is going to read any of the code AI produces and that's a scary thought.

This is a misconception. Have your favorite agent summarize this video for you: https://www.youtube.com/live/zcLPGC-tvgk?si=YR68aHlFESD053bh

ozim•33m ago
Ugh it is Uncle Bob, not going to torture AI with this guy.

But the fun part is that all of the proper software engineering practices are aimed at lowering amount of context a developer has to keep in his mind. So it directly applies to agent context. Less verbose code, less tokens to burn, separation of concerns, lower chance agent breaks something unrelated etc.

vik0•32m ago
>>Pretty soon no one is going to read any of the code AI produces and that's a scary thought.

>This is a misconception. Have your favorite agent *summarize this video for you*: https://www.youtube.com/live/zcLPGC-tvgk?si=YR68aHlFESD053bh

I can't tell if you're joking here

brlewis•15m ago
I am not generally against using AI to reduce the amount of information you need to pay attention to, and I was not joking. There are multiple places in that interview with good articulation of the reasons why software fundamentals still matter, and what happens when you don't look at at least some of the AI-generated code.
sublinear•36m ago
The "modern web primitives" are also not even necessarily the "best practice".

Browser-specific implementation gotchas tend to take about a decade to iron out for reasons that never have anything to do with code quality. Users are fickle and so are browser vendors, but that's a different topic.

At the end of the day, there's just no escaping lots of manual testing across device and browser combinations if your goal is a polished result and not just something that "works".

AI has done nothing to make this problem go away. If anything, it's made it worse because people don't even want to look at the code now!

halflife•1h ago
Finally.

This is exactly what I need when I need it. The amount of pull requests I reviewed with a mess of codes that can be switched to 2 lines of modern features made me write such tools myself, only half assed since I have other things to do.

cyanydeez•49m ago
I treat all my code as some kind of stochastic machinery. So atleast one stage, I'd just tell an agent to go through and follow the guide.

But I'd not inject all this fluff into the wheels of the machine because it'd just take the "average" of these practices which would be just as useless.

simonw•45m ago
Distribution suggestion: in addition to the npm packages you have right now, set up GitHub Pages to publish a markdown index document of the skills at https://googlechrome.github.io/modern-web-guidance-src/skill... (currently a 404)

That index page should link to plain markdown versions of all of the documents, and should be designed for search with grep to find the right answers.

That way I don't have to install anything at all - provided my agent has the ability to make HTTP requests I can tell it "Look for tips on https://googlechrome.github.io/modern-web-guidance-src/skill..." and it will fetch the index, then navigate to the most relevant documents - no MCP or npm or installation required at all.

trvz•26m ago
What’s the point of modern Javascript without over complicating things?
kinlan•24m ago
https://developer.chrome.com/docs/modern-web-guidance/guides...

(we could make this clearer though)

paulirish•13m ago
Aye. I like the idea, Simon. The token cost of the index is high enough I wouldn't suggest the technique for regular use but.. agree that for occasional users it should suffice.

We'll make this happen. :)

nico•24m ago
> That way I don't have to install anything at all

It feels that something like this would be the holy grail of agents. A small agent that has only the minimum necessary built in knowledge. The rest, it just retrieves on the fly when it needs (+ caching)

It’s like storing pointers/links instead of the contents

advisedwang•34m ago
Chrome already has too much power in the browser standards world. The last thing we need is everyone's LLMs to follow Chrome team's guidance on how to do web development. This road leads back to "To view this site, please view in [DOMINANT BROWSER]"
philipwalton•27m ago
Mozilla Firefox and Microsoft Edge are also contributors to this project, so this is a cross-browser initiative to help improve how agents build for the web.
super256•24m ago
Calm your pitchfork, Mozilla and Edge are both part of Modern Web Guidance.

https://github.com/GoogleChrome/modern-web-guidance-src/blob...

0o777•20m ago
Both Mozilla and the Google Chrome team are part of the Web Baseline project and this project. They only recommend best practices supported by Chrome, Firefox, Edge, and Safari.

https://web-platform-dx.github.io/baseline/

zeroq•26m ago
What's the best way to introduce this to a Gemini chat?
fumar•16m ago
I added this a few months ago and Claude Doctor has not removed it. It must be working and getting use.
reedlaw•15m ago
These skills look better than most, but running my code through the legacy scan only found two issues. So while I still think training beats skills, I'm sure this has its place, especially with weaker models.
paulirish•5m ago
Yeah. The legacy scan is tuned to 1) focus on cases where there's a clearly detectable legacy pattern and 2) avoid false-positives. This means it only overlaps with 20% of all the skill's docs. (We'll probably get it to ~50% in another month).

In short: I 100% understand your disappointment. :) More coming soon like finding cases to update with Promise.withResolvers, the Array iterators, Object.groupBy, URLSearchParams, etc..

j45•9m ago
This is a great idea. I think while so much was being built out in the JavaScript ecosystem, awareness about the equivalent feature releases that were done to HTML, CSS, web components, and other technologies didn't keep pace.

Of course, it's not perfectly implemented the same in every browser, but that's nothing new.

cadamsdotcom•9m ago
Planning to give this one a wide berth.

The more "legacy code" is getting written everyday the more the web will be forced to remain backwards compatible...