Games on old consoles such as Nintendo 64 and the Playstation One use a variety of tricks to be playable on limited hardware. For the specific example of Final Fantasy VII, there is one trick that allows you to skip almost the entirely of Disk 1 once you reach the open world. In particular, the trick involves a use-after-free in the world collision cache (fun fact: a lot of speedrun techniques are security flaws!). This video explains it without spoilers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llQnrUHS0yA ; a better video is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHn6jpKsYCk, but that might have minor spoilers IIRC (Note: this trick is relatively new, and probably not used in that video).
mkfs•8mo ago
> the trick involves a use-after-free in the world collision cache (fun fact: a lot of speedrun techniques are security flaws!
In other words:
> Hey, you know those super difficult parts from games of your childhood that you're probably curious to see how we, the supposed speediest of gamers, swiftly navigate? Well, guess what? We just skip them altogether by glitching! Any% new record!
That's why no one cares about this. These people will play the same game or level thousands of times to trigger 1/1,000,000 glitches to skip huge swaths of games, then claim some made-up "record."
This is not skill. Even the non-glitch speedruns are more down to persistence (if not mental illness) than skill--which is a result of deliberate practice--like one sees in competitive shooters or fighting games. And these people throw tantrums constantly, like children, and curse the "RNG" (an admission this isn't about skill) the way a primitive tribesman might damn the gods for a prolonged drought.
ohdeargodno•8mo ago
If only speed running communities existed, where they made different categories like any%, any% No major glitches/skips, all with varying prestige and competitiveness, as well as agreed upon which skips are so soul crushingly shit to do that they're excluded from every category aside from any% :(
You might consider therapy, if playing games fast makes you angry.
mkfs•8mo ago
> If only speed running communities existed, where they made different categories like any%, any% No major glitches/skips, all with varying prestige and competitiveness, as well as agreed upon which skips are so soul crushingly shit to do that they're excluded from every category aside from any% :(
Arbitrarily delineating good vs. bad glitches is dumb, and even glitch-free speedruns are more about persistence, just trying over and over again until you get the exact right sequence of inputs (or "RNG") to claim the record, rather than repeatable skill. This isn't like some high-level CS:GO player who can consistently headshot fast-moving targets or a high-level SF player who's mastered techniques like hit confirms.
> You might consider therapy, if playing games fast makes you angry.
I'm not the one downvoting comments, and unlike speedrunners, I don't throw tantrums over games.
marci•8mo ago
It reads like you said "Arbitrarily delineating good vs. bad glitches is dumb", then immediately proceeded to arbitrarily delineating good vs. bad skill.
People who don't like CS:GO type of games won't find any value or interest in some "player who can consistently headshot fast-moving targets". Some people just like seeing their favorite game break in unexpected ways. It's a bit like going into someone else home in the same building with the same floor plan, or just the mirror tracks in a racing game, everything is uncannily familiar, and this uncanny feeling is enjoyed. Maybe you just don't see the appeal, which is fine as well.
ohdeargodno•8mo ago
> This isn't like some high-level CS:GO player who can consistently headshot fast-moving targets
Saying this about the one competitive shooter that has random first shot inaccuracy is an incredibly funny take.
>just trying over and over again until you get the exact right sequence of inputs (or "RNG") to claim the record, rather than repeatable skill.
There are pretty much zero active speedrun games that require "the right RNG" to win. There are some games with explicitly bad random things that are guaranteed to fuck up a run, like RE4, but skilled players all have backup strategies and most top runs did not get perfect RNG everywhere. Sums of best on most games are 20% lower than the time. Do you know why ? Because runs that end up requiring a 1/100000 strategy to win get bumped into different categories, otherwise the category dies. Sometimes, a reliable way to do that skip (like, say, Mi'ihen skip in FFX) is found, and what was once a cosmic bit flip is now a regular route that everyone knows and gets done.
Some players reset after 3 minutes, because they cannot accept the idea of having a suboptimal start, but runners like Siglemic or ZFG, who are responsible for the growth of speedrunning as a watchable thing got there because they push runs to the end, no matter what. As for "no repeatable skills", runners learned to manual superswim on The Wind Waker (requiring frame perfect input, sometimes without pause buffering), have game knowledge to the point where a randomizer ALTTP run is a fun live speedrun challenge, can setup ACE on games like Super Mario World, and so, so many others.
How many failed BLJs and 70 star stairs skip did it take you to get so angry at people playing games fast ?
winterbloom•8mo ago
They are being genuine, no need to be toxic
purplesyringa•8mo ago
I appreciate that calling a hobby "no one" (read: many people) enjoy a mental illness is genuine, but I think I find the grandparent much less toxic than the comment it replies to. There's no need to shame people for things they find interesting.
cchianel•8mo ago
Related: Archipelago (https://archipelago.gg/), a framework that randomizes multiple games, across multiple clients. For example, Player A is playing Mario 64, and Player B is playing Pokemon Red. Some items from Player B's Pokemon Red (such as the Rock Smash HM) would be in Player A's Mario 64 world (for example, from collecting a Star). As a result, the two players need to coordinate and help each other progress.
Noumenon72•8mo ago
How is this possible? I didn't want to watch the whole video since I've never played the game.
1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_rudg2AdUk
cchianel•8mo ago
mkfs•8mo ago
In other words:
> Hey, you know those super difficult parts from games of your childhood that you're probably curious to see how we, the supposed speediest of gamers, swiftly navigate? Well, guess what? We just skip them altogether by glitching! Any% new record!
That's why no one cares about this. These people will play the same game or level thousands of times to trigger 1/1,000,000 glitches to skip huge swaths of games, then claim some made-up "record."
This is not skill. Even the non-glitch speedruns are more down to persistence (if not mental illness) than skill--which is a result of deliberate practice--like one sees in competitive shooters or fighting games. And these people throw tantrums constantly, like children, and curse the "RNG" (an admission this isn't about skill) the way a primitive tribesman might damn the gods for a prolonged drought.
ohdeargodno•8mo ago
You might consider therapy, if playing games fast makes you angry.
mkfs•8mo ago
Arbitrarily delineating good vs. bad glitches is dumb, and even glitch-free speedruns are more about persistence, just trying over and over again until you get the exact right sequence of inputs (or "RNG") to claim the record, rather than repeatable skill. This isn't like some high-level CS:GO player who can consistently headshot fast-moving targets or a high-level SF player who's mastered techniques like hit confirms.
> You might consider therapy, if playing games fast makes you angry.
I'm not the one downvoting comments, and unlike speedrunners, I don't throw tantrums over games.
marci•8mo ago
People who don't like CS:GO type of games won't find any value or interest in some "player who can consistently headshot fast-moving targets". Some people just like seeing their favorite game break in unexpected ways. It's a bit like going into someone else home in the same building with the same floor plan, or just the mirror tracks in a racing game, everything is uncannily familiar, and this uncanny feeling is enjoyed. Maybe you just don't see the appeal, which is fine as well.
ohdeargodno•8mo ago
Saying this about the one competitive shooter that has random first shot inaccuracy is an incredibly funny take.
>just trying over and over again until you get the exact right sequence of inputs (or "RNG") to claim the record, rather than repeatable skill.
There are pretty much zero active speedrun games that require "the right RNG" to win. There are some games with explicitly bad random things that are guaranteed to fuck up a run, like RE4, but skilled players all have backup strategies and most top runs did not get perfect RNG everywhere. Sums of best on most games are 20% lower than the time. Do you know why ? Because runs that end up requiring a 1/100000 strategy to win get bumped into different categories, otherwise the category dies. Sometimes, a reliable way to do that skip (like, say, Mi'ihen skip in FFX) is found, and what was once a cosmic bit flip is now a regular route that everyone knows and gets done.
Some players reset after 3 minutes, because they cannot accept the idea of having a suboptimal start, but runners like Siglemic or ZFG, who are responsible for the growth of speedrunning as a watchable thing got there because they push runs to the end, no matter what. As for "no repeatable skills", runners learned to manual superswim on The Wind Waker (requiring frame perfect input, sometimes without pause buffering), have game knowledge to the point where a randomizer ALTTP run is a fun live speedrun challenge, can setup ACE on games like Super Mario World, and so, so many others.
How many failed BLJs and 70 star stairs skip did it take you to get so angry at people playing games fast ?
winterbloom•8mo ago
purplesyringa•8mo ago