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OpenCiv3: Open-source, cross-platform reimagining of Civilization III

https://openciv3.org/
624•klaussilveira•12h ago•182 comments

The Waymo World Model

https://waymo.com/blog/2026/02/the-waymo-world-model-a-new-frontier-for-autonomous-driving-simula...
926•xnx•18h ago•548 comments

What Is Ruliology?

https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2026/01/what-is-ruliology/
32•helloplanets•4d ago•24 comments

How we made geo joins 400× faster with H3 indexes

https://floedb.ai/blog/how-we-made-geo-joins-400-faster-with-h3-indexes
109•matheusalmeida•1d ago•27 comments

Jeffrey Snover: "Welcome to the Room"

https://www.jsnover.com/blog/2026/02/01/welcome-to-the-room/
9•kaonwarb•3d ago•7 comments

Unseen Footage of Atari Battlezone Arcade Cabinet Production

https://arcadeblogger.com/2026/02/02/unseen-footage-of-atari-battlezone-cabinet-production/
40•videotopia•4d ago•1 comments

Show HN: Look Ma, No Linux: Shell, App Installer, Vi, Cc on ESP32-S3 / BreezyBox

https://github.com/valdanylchuk/breezydemo
219•isitcontent•13h ago•25 comments

Monty: A minimal, secure Python interpreter written in Rust for use by AI

https://github.com/pydantic/monty
210•dmpetrov•13h ago•103 comments

Show HN: I spent 4 years building a UI design tool with only the features I use

https://vecti.com
322•vecti•15h ago•143 comments

Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Technical Info

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/
370•ostacke•18h ago•94 comments

Microsoft open-sources LiteBox, a security-focused library OS

https://github.com/microsoft/litebox
358•aktau•19h ago•181 comments

Hackers (1995) Animated Experience

https://hackers-1995.vercel.app/
477•todsacerdoti•20h ago•232 comments

Show HN: If you lose your memory, how to regain access to your computer?

https://eljojo.github.io/rememory/
272•eljojo•15h ago•160 comments

An Update on Heroku

https://www.heroku.com/blog/an-update-on-heroku/
402•lstoll•19h ago•271 comments

Dark Alley Mathematics

https://blog.szczepan.org/blog/three-points/
85•quibono•4d ago•20 comments

Vocal Guide – belt sing without killing yourself

https://jesperordrup.github.io/vocal-guide/
14•jesperordrup•2h ago•6 comments

Delimited Continuations vs. Lwt for Threads

https://mirageos.org/blog/delimcc-vs-lwt
25•romes•4d ago•3 comments

PC Floppy Copy Protection: Vault Prolok

https://martypc.blogspot.com/2024/09/pc-floppy-copy-protection-vault-prolok.html
56•kmm•5d ago•3 comments

Start all of your commands with a comma

https://rhodesmill.org/brandon/2009/commands-with-comma/
3•theblazehen•2d ago•0 comments

Was Benoit Mandelbrot a hedgehog or a fox?

https://arxiv.org/abs/2602.01122
12•bikenaga•3d ago•2 comments

How to effectively write quality code with AI

https://heidenstedt.org/posts/2026/how-to-effectively-write-quality-code-with-ai/
244•i5heu•15h ago•188 comments

Introducing the Developer Knowledge API and MCP Server

https://developers.googleblog.com/introducing-the-developer-knowledge-api-and-mcp-server/
52•gfortaine•10h ago•21 comments

I spent 5 years in DevOps – Solutions engineering gave me what I was missing

https://infisical.com/blog/devops-to-solutions-engineering
140•vmatsiiako•17h ago•63 comments

Understanding Neural Network, Visually

https://visualrambling.space/neural-network/
280•surprisetalk•3d ago•37 comments

I now assume that all ads on Apple news are scams

https://kirkville.com/i-now-assume-that-all-ads-on-apple-news-are-scams/
1058•cdrnsf•22h ago•433 comments

Why I Joined OpenAI

https://www.brendangregg.com/blog/2026-02-07/why-i-joined-openai.html
132•SerCe•8h ago•117 comments

Show HN: R3forth, a ColorForth-inspired language with a tiny VM

https://github.com/phreda4/r3
70•phreda4•12h ago•14 comments

Female Asian Elephant Calf Born at the Smithsonian National Zoo

https://www.si.edu/newsdesk/releases/female-asian-elephant-calf-born-smithsonians-national-zoo-an...
28•gmays•8h ago•11 comments

Learning from context is harder than we thought

https://hy.tencent.com/research/100025?langVersion=en
176•limoce•3d ago•96 comments

FORTH? Really!?

https://rescrv.net/w/2026/02/06/associative
63•rescrv•20h ago•22 comments
Open in hackernews

Reminder to passengers ahead of move to 100% digital boarding passes

https://corporate.ryanair.com/news/ryanair-issues-reminder-to-passengers-ahead-of-move-to-100-digital-boarding-passes-from-wednesday-12-nov/
163•teekert•2mo ago

Comments

ivanjermakov•2mo ago
I'm not installing airline app. So electronic tickets (email PDFs) won't work either?
lsxr•2mo ago
Agreed here. I'll check in online, but I'll only install their app as a last resort. I'm hopeful that boarding passes are still sent as PDF. Then again, I rarely fly Ryanair anyway.
shrx•2mo ago
"passengers will no longer be able to download and print a physical paper boarding pass"

Doesn't look like it will be possible. That's a deal breaker for me, I don't need another app spying on me on my phone.

Freak_NL•2mo ago
The announcement says no downloads and required use of their app, but the dedicated help page says otherwise:

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

jonplackett•2mo ago
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but why are you specifically adverse to installing airline’s apps?
everdrive•2mo ago
I'm averse to installing any apps. I don't want to use a smartphone, and I don't want companies or governments to mandate their usage. As a consumer you have no real way of knowing which apps are tracking you and selling your data and which are not. Every app is suspect, even if some are legitimately clean. Every single company that says "just use the app" is another roll of the dice: will they get breached and reveal my data? Are they tracking me and selling to advertisers / insurance companies / police? Consumers really have no way of knowing for sure.
ranger_danger•2mo ago
It's an unnecessary invasion of privacy for one, and not everyone has or wants a smartphone or to install third party apps, or carry it with them onto the plane. It could also be dead, broken or otherwise incompatible, or the passenger may have a disability or religious reason that prevents them from using it.
ryandrake•2mo ago
In addition to the great reasons others posted, I'll point out another one: Most airline apps won't even install or run on my device anymore. So, even if I wanted to use the airline's app (I don't), their developers have chosen to not support my device, and therefore I cannot even install or run it.

If a company is going to make something a requirement like this, they need to also invest in the effort to support everyone's device, and not block people with old, icky phones.

Zambyte•2mo ago
I don't carry a smartphone.
subscribed•2mo ago
Excessive surveillance.

Selling my location, list of the installed apps, cookies, whatever they can extract.

That's for starters.

But most importantly why the hell should I be forced to use phone app if having a printed pass was good enough?

I need to reverse your surprising question into: should I be expected to install, update, maintain and use apps of ALL the service providers I use?

Separate app for train provider A, another for train provider B, another for bus provider C.

No paper tickets.

An app to purchase groceries, another app to pay for the parking, another app to buy a coffee, another app to buy a newspaper in the kiosk. And app to check in the hotel, an app to order food in the restaurant, an app to call the tax return website (not the phone, an app).

Can you see now how absurd is to normalise it?

zzo38computer•2mo ago
In addition to that (which is already bad), you will need a compatible smart phone (I do not have and do not intend to have; other people mentioned the same thing), and if you do have then it might use more battery power and more disk space, and sometimes the battery power will run out (or it can fail due to many other reasons), so it is even worse than what you mention.
greenchair•2mo ago
Think about the future ramifications if more companies were to implement this invasive garbage. Do you want to have to install mcdonalds app to order their food? Great clips app to get a hair cut?
embedding-shape•2mo ago
And more importantly from https://apps.apple.com/us/app/ryanair/id504270602 which people now are required to download and install:

> Data Linked to You - Location, Contact Info, Identifiers, Usage Data, Other Data

ezfe•2mo ago
Any app that you log into "links" anything in your profile to your phone, so of course it links this information.

I'm all for calling out bad privacy practice, like when a Weather app says it links your contact info. But an airline app inherently does this.

Did you know that Ryanair knows your name when you fly! They even know what city you're flying from.

subscribed•2mo ago
They didn't necessarily have to know my main email address though! Or a list of the installed apps.
ezfe•2mo ago
Installing as an app doesn’t share your main email address and they can only identify apps from a fixed list, so it’s not really useful to do that.
subscribed•2mo ago
Oh sorry, missed that one.

> your main email address

Right, it doesn't get my main email at the moment, true, turns out an app needs `android.permission.GET_ACCOUNTS` to do that. I do, however, expect them to do that later -- looking at their declared permissions, it's hard to assume a good will:

- `BLUETOOTH_SCAN`, `ACCESS_FINE_LOCATION`, `ACCESS_ADSERVICES_AD_ID` -- all together. Yes, I see they use `android.ext.adservices`

`READ_EXTERNAL_STORAGE`? `WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE`? What for? Do they even offer saving a PDF into a Downloads folder? I think they can do it without asking for the separate permission.

> and they can only identify apps from a fixed list

While it's true they would require `QUERY_ALL_PACKAGES` to openly get a _complete_ list, see this: https://www.medianama.com/2025/04/223-android-apps-data-brea...

And then check their admitted privacy practices/policy from their Google Play listing (com.ryanair.cheapflights)

Notice, the first section is `DATA SHARED`, not just collected. It's shared with the undisclosed third parties (we know from the privacy policy[1], though, that at the very least it includes all the social networks

>> App Activity: installed apps >> Purposes: Analytics, Personalisation

>> Also: Email address, financial information, physical address, user payment info, phone info.

`DATA COLLECTED`:

>> Photos, User ids (plural, it's not just email used to login), Installed apps once again, Files and docs (?!)

Generally;

I have a very little trust for a vendor that is known for the deceptive practices and which lies from the outset about the reasons to force all passengers into using their app.

If they lie in such a fundamental question, it should be assumed they're using deceptions and trickery.

Like with disgraced Meta caught red-handed on deception and trickery: https://arstechnica.com/security/2025/06/meta-and-yandex-are...

[1] https://www.ryanair.com/ie/en/lp/privacy-policy

ezfe•2mo ago
I suppose if you’re on android the protections are a lot lower… At least based on your description
subscribed•2mo ago
I agree. The fact AOSP doesn't offer blocking network by default is ridiculous.

Of course, Google is the ad company, this is the reason.

Thankfully I could contain and strangle it in its dedicated profile with the better AOSP variant. Works for the time being.

Fernicia•2mo ago
You can reject all of these permission requests and the app still works.
embedding-shape•2mo ago
"Other Data" and "Identifiers" too? Don't remember seeing requests for those in any application.
fph•2mo ago
The app still works /for now/.
meindnoch•2mo ago
"Ryanair, Europe’s No.1 airline, today (Thurs, 6 Nov) reminded passengers that from Wed (12 Nov) it will move to 100% digital boarding passes. This means that from Wed (12 Nov) passengers will no longer be able to download and print a physical paper boarding pass but will instead need to use the digital boarding pass generated in their “myRyanair” app during check-in to board their Ryanair flight."

Why does it matter whether the boarding pass barcode is scanned from a printed paper vs a phone screen?

saubeidl•2mo ago
Their app lets them exfiltrate data on you and use it for advertising/sell it to ad networks.
reliablereason•2mo ago
they say it is it's cause its greener but they could have used a website.
saubeidl•2mo ago
A pdf on your phone would've done that as well, but that's what they're explicitly banning with this move.
netsharc•2mo ago
Didn't Uber get caught tracking their users (I want to say victims but there are actual victims of Uber sexual harassment/assault) even though they didn't have the app open?

Tracking where your passengers go on vacation would be useful data for them. Sheesh you could even track flights: "User was online at London Heathrow until 11:45, and was then offline, and came back online again in Madrid at 14:30, the corresponding flight at those times was EasyJet 78".

jackhalford•2mo ago
Flying now requires you to own a smartphone
fanatic2pope•2mo ago
And to install an app, which almost certainly has privacy invasion baked into the terms of use.
Freak_NL•2mo ago
With Ryanair. Something to be avoided if at all possible, but a very bad precedent in any case.
signatoremo•2mo ago
Rather, enough people have smartphone that they won’t be object to using it as boarding pass.
conception•2mo ago
Maybe it’s nfc not qr.
tencentshill•2mo ago
It's may be a dynamic QR code that changes at intervals.
cl3misch•2mo ago
It has to be compatible with the physical scanners at the airport, e.g. before security. So Ryanair probably is not very flexible in how they design the code.
fph•2mo ago
Does the QR code that you use when boarding have to be the same QR code that you use before security, though?
Fernicia•2mo ago
Anti theft perhaps? Last March a guy was able to sneak onto a Delta flight by taking a picture of someone else's QR code. Some ticketing apps have temporal QR codes that are resistant to this exploit.
meindnoch•2mo ago
They didn't verify the passenger's identity at the gate?
redfern314•2mo ago
ID is never checked at the gate for domestic flights, only international, at least in the US.

This was the case being referenced: https://abc7.com/post/wicliff-yves-fleurizard-stowaway-secur...

Zambyte•2mo ago
I have never been asked to show ID on domestic flights at the gate.
mikestew•2mo ago
For a period after 9/11, ID was required to be shown at the gate on domestic flights. I don't recall when that stopped, but it's been a while (and apparently long enough ago that apparently some have never had to do it).
toast0•2mo ago
I seem to recall IDs occasionally being checked at the gate prior to 9/11 as well. Memory is fuzzy, but they weren't checking boarding passes or ids at security. But back then I would always get my boarding pass at the check-in counter (sometimes exchanging an actual ticket for the boarding pass).
mikestew•2mo ago
Memory is fuzzy…

Yeah, I can’t recall well enough to agree with you, can’t remember enough to dispute it, either. That was a long time ago. :-)

toast0•2mo ago
I spent some time looking for old information, best I could come up with was this article [1] from 1996 about requiring photo ID at check-in, which doesn't mention checking at the gate, but does mention why the airlines might be happy to do it (protect revenue by making sure passengers don't fly on other people's tickets... unless they share their name with the other person). This article [2] , also from 1996, is a little bit less precise about if people are denied at check-in or by gate agents.

I think it's all quite hazy, because if you had no checked bags and it was a small airport, but you might just go to the gate and try to get your boarding pass there. That and 24 years have passed. :D

[1] https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1996-09-11-fi-42564-...

[2] https://www.chicagotribune.com/1996/12/29/no-match-no-flight...

jandrese•2mo ago
Wouldn't that be noticed when the actual passenger tried to board and the system said they were already on board?
4ndrewl•2mo ago
It'll be interesting to see where this is enforced. Most people won't actually see a member of Ryanair staff until the gate (at which point very often you're asked to scan your own barcode with a staff member present).

I reckon you'll be able to print out a screenshot of the app and use it to check your bags in and get through security. They won't hold a flight up with checked bags at the gate - will cost them too much money.

rixed•2mo ago
It's not rare that some staff are checking that passengers have all needed documents as they head to departures. Looks like they could check app usage there. They could also easily check the app when bags are checked in (that's Ryanair staff doing this).

In smaller airports (the ones Ryanair used to operate from) it's also sometimes their own barcode scanners before the gates that are dedicated to them.

I believe they will be able to enforce this in many places.

4ndrewl•2mo ago
Ryanair use scan-and-drop self-checkin of bags in many airports.

It would also be curious to see who pays for removal of persons once they are airside - eg in the case the flyer with nothing to check in who goes past airport security, but before RyanAir staff meet them at the gate.

kyriakos•2mo ago
Unless it's a TOTP style code and changes
4ndrewl•2mo ago
Unlikely - that would require changes for non-airline barcode users (eg Airport Security, Duty Free, etc)
kyriakos•2mo ago
Yeah you are right
ThePowerOfFuet•2mo ago
>Why does it matter whether the boarding pass barcode is scanned from a printed paper vs a phone screen?

They can't collect your data from a printed sheet.

ndr•2mo ago
Why force the app though?

And is it true it won't allow screenshotting?

subscribed•2mo ago
Selling customer data for a premium, obviously.
chris_va•2mo ago
Out of curiosity, what happens when someone does not own a smartphone (or the battery is dead)? They just can't fly?

And, if their server flaky, does that mean all boarding will stop? If the agents can check people in manually, it seems like the small fraction of people using a paper boarding pass can't be adding much extra cost. If they are saving cost by removing that flow, presumably they are giving up redundancy. Given the quality of airline software, I predict they will see a mass outage within a year.

swiftcoder•2mo ago
Keep in mind that Ryanair already charges €50 to print you a replacement boarding pass at the counter if you can't make the app work...
dinkblam•2mo ago
but you can print for free before heading to the airport
philipwhiuk•2mo ago
Not now.
lxgr•2mo ago
If you own a printer.

I've once been in that situation with Ryanair: I booked through some reseller, not knowing that they'd make all bookings using some omnibus Ryanair account they would not share the password for (so mobile app use was out), and only emailed me the boarding pass PDF. But I didn't have a printer...

The airport business center did have one, with a moderate 50 cent per page fee – except if that page contains a boarding pass, in which case it was 8 Euro.

GTP•2mo ago
Interesting price discrimination here.
netsharc•2mo ago
I would've photoshopped the barcode onto a Covid certificate and then ask to print it...

Isn't barcode on the PDF good enough anyway, to be scanned by a machine (either biological or electronic)? Obviously it's Scamair, so they could've imposed dumb rules like "we need the physical paper"

lxgr•2mo ago
Yup, that's it. They explicitly weren't allowing scanning off of a screen, as far as I remember. (The code on the screen might be fraudulent, after all – can't do that on paper!)
afandian•2mo ago
> passengers will no longer be able to download and print a physical paper boarding pass
InfinityByTen•2mo ago
10 years ago I had to pay ryanair that amount for I didn't print the boarding pass. How the times have changed.
afavour•2mo ago
This is simply the mindset of discount airlines. If your battery is dead when you arrive at check-in that's too bad for you. It's in the terms and conditions.

If the server is flaky then boarding will be delayed for everyone and it'll be a whole crapshow but if their overall cost is lower than it would have been with printed boarding passes, fine.

lxgr•2mo ago
Usually they'll happily help you out with a "late boarding pass printing fee" on the order of a hundred €/$, though.

If this really is a total refusal to do even that, I'd be slightly surprised, but I'm sure their business developers have done the analysis and it makes some sense to them.

Muromec•2mo ago
I’m surprised they can get away with it in the EU. T&C or not, you paid for a fare and they know you did
lxgr•2mo ago
I once flew from London on Ryanair when the airport's passenger Wi-Fi was completely down, and 4G was completely overloaded as a result as well.

Things were indeed pretty chaotic. I can't remember if they did print paper boarding passes in the end.

> it seems like the small fraction of people using a paper boarding pass can't be adding much extra cost

You're looking at this from the wrong angle: This is Ryanair. Actual cost does not matter, only the opportunity to extract more revenue. Presumably app users are that much more valuable to Ryanair (as they can be upsold various things there, and potentially because it also acts as a filter for a generally less profitable customer segment).

gruez•2mo ago
The upsell opportunity isn't worth anywhere near $50 though. I suspect it acts as a price discrimination filter. You make people jump through hoops (ie. installing an app) to save some money, with the expectation that people who are willing to jump through hoops are more price sensitive, and would also be willing to switch to another airline.
nagisa•2mo ago
They already charge that and more if you have to check-in at the airport for any reason. And you cannot check-in online without making an account with them. Ryanair is grift squared.

That said I never had problems boarding with a PDF displayed on the phone screen. Unfortunate that they're going away.

jonas21•2mo ago
It's also a marketing channel for future flights. The app almost certainly asks for notification permissions, and most people will say yes -- they're useful for knowing if your flight is delayed or there's a gate change.

Now they have a channel where they can let you know about deals, etc. I'm sure they've modeled exactly how much this is worth, and I'd be willing to bet it's a lot.

baxtr•2mo ago
Re notifications: I have seen important apps not working unless you allow notifications.

This might be the case here as well.

You wanna fly? Allow notifications!

lxgr•2mo ago
Isn't that against App Store guidelines? (Not that Apple could afford to kick out Ryanair, but I think they have other options, such as blocking updates until it's been remedied etc.)
paganel•2mo ago
Stupid question here, because I haven't flown with Ryanair in like almost 10 years, but I've recently flown with WizzAir and after checking-in online (the night before) it generated a .pdf boarding pass which I saved on my phone. I was then able to get onto the plane by presenting the QR code from said .pdf, i.e. while I was at the gate, no need for internet access. Does Ryanair do things differently?
zoeysmithe•2mo ago
These byzantine arguments and justifications and profit motivation and incentive tea readings are so ridiculous at a certain point, I'm surprised so many people wont even consider socializing airlines.

What a cold comfort to a grandma struggling to use an upsell-focused dark patterns app when the wifi is poor at some airport to get home to see her grandkids stuck at some airport to say, "Well, this maximized shareholder revenue."

I feel like I'm in the last stages of 'anything goes' capitalism. The ridiculousness here has hit such levels, especially in the USA, that there must be pushback sooner than later. I dunno how the Irish feel about this considering this is their airline (HQ at least), or their experiences, but on this side of the pond, this has all has reached new levels of absurdity that would make even Kafka blush.

signatoremo•2mo ago
I just randomly checked Dublin to Rome route, for early December. The first 3 cheapest options are Ryanair, the 4th option (Air Lingus) is almost triple the price of the cheapest one, $262 vs $90

That’s your answer. People vote with their wallet.

lrvick•2mo ago
Frontier already expects digital boarding passes. I do not own a phone, so they charged me a $25 fee to print one at customer service. Except they also do not accept cash, so I had to go buy a gift card with cash from a vending machine for another $5 fee.

For $30 I could buy an entire discount printer and print one myself.

schmookeeg•2mo ago
Thank you for FAXing this comment in :)
MissTake•2mo ago
Or just using a laptop or a desktop pc…
selimthegrim•2mo ago
You can print Frontier boarding passes. They just make the link very hard to find.
lukan•2mo ago
You pay 50 €.
jandrese•2mo ago
For what it is worth, at least on iPhone you can still use the bus/train pass feature in Wallet even when the battery is dead.

But it has always been the Ryanair brand to ask the consumer "how much bullshit are you willing to put up with to save a buck?"

embedding-shape•2mo ago
> For what it is worth, at least on iPhone you can still use the bus/train pass feature in Wallet even when the battery is dead.

Doesn't seem like it'll help in this case, seems Ryanair is forcing the usage to be via their app instead of anything else.

jandrese•2mo ago
It depends on the details. Last time I flew I used the airline's app to get the ticket which were then immediately loaded into wallet and read via NFC at the gate.

But this is Ryanair so it's probably going to do some stupid QR thing that will be super touchy and be a struggle to work on at least half of the devices. Bonus points if the app refuses to start if it can't make a live internet connection back to some cursed cloud service so the people waiting in line who accidentally let their phone go to sleep find they can't get it to show the ticket in the dead zone at the gate.

GTP•2mo ago
For what it's worth, I flew multiple times using the boarding pass from their app without any problem.
stavros•2mo ago
You need the app to download the pass (AFAIK) but it goes into your Google/Apple wallet after that. I have the app disabled (so it can't run in the background, as much as possible), and I only use it to get the pass.

I wish they'd just let me download a pkpass file, but what can you do.

gruez•2mo ago
>For what it is worth, at least on iPhone you can still use the bus/train pass feature in Wallet even when the battery is dead.

AFAIK that only works for NFC passes? For passes that are just qr/bar codes I can't imagine how that'd work if the battery is actually dead. The "use bus passes when battery is dead" feature only works because there's dedicated low power circuitry to power the NFC hardware, which obviously doesn't exist for the display.

PaulRobinson•2mo ago
> Out of curiosity, what happens when someone does not own a smartphone (or the battery is dead)? They just can't fly?

Yup, based on this announcement, and previous policy calls they've made, that person won't be able to fly. End of. They lose their seat, kthxbye!

Ryanair has made its way in the budget market (arguably inventing the budget market to some extent), by employing money-making practices of dubious need from charging people to use toilets on-board, to flying with so little fuel that they regularly call fuel emergencies on approach.

Their bet - that the market seems to support - is that people will put up with almost anything if it means a cheaper ticket.

They're even expecting to get clearance from authorities to get rid of proper seating and move to "standing seats" so they can get more people onboard, their theory being you'll stand for 3 hours on a plane if it means your ticket is x% cheaper.

I refuse to fly with them on principle - they're a terrible airline owned by a terrible person, run in a terrible way. It's only a matter of time before people realise just how dangerous they are as an operation. I hope it's just a data security issue they run into and people run away from the app scared, and not the increasingly inevitable hull loss that many have been predicting for years.

This is just another reason not to fly with them, for me.

gruez•2mo ago
>to flying with so little fuel that they regularly call fuel emergencies on approach.

If you're talking about the recent incident, I thought that was because they tried landing several times at different airports? Is there any evidence that they routinely fly with less fuel buffer than other airlines?

throwaway290•2mo ago
a lot of hearsay saying they pack less fuel than other airlines (but not below minimum required limit) in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45539943
rkomorn•2mo ago
> (but not below minimum required limit)

I hate just about everything I know about Ryanair but if they're not below required limits, then I'd say they're not the problem and the point is moot.

throwaway290•2mo ago
but no one said they did illegal stuff;) just purposefully unsafer stuff than other airlines

strawman

PaulRobinson•2mo ago
Sure, I first heard about this years ago when Channel 4 (a UK broadcaster) ran a program about pilots stating they were concerned about the policy. There had been outrage within the aviation industry after three fuel emergencies in one day at one airport. [0] Ryanair sued [1], and lost: Channel 4 had engaged in fair journalism, it turns out.

Seems they're still at it, hence the recent incident.

[0] https://www.eurocockpit.eu/news/fuelling-debate-safety-vs-pr... [1] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23686678

sodality2•2mo ago
All three flights were diverted due to weather, and none of them fell below the legally required amount of fuel. One has to wonder if it’s really reasonable to criticize them in this instance if a single weather event affected them all.
sebastiennight•2mo ago
> charging people to use toilets on-board

AFAIK this has never happened.

This is a PR stunt that is regularly used (like the idea of standing-room-only tickets) to generate a new round of press for the company and highlight how cost-efficient and ruthless they are, which aligns with their branding and keeps the story alive.

I understand the sentiment but as sibling comment points out, you're very light in the way of stating facts to back up these claims.

notreallyauser•2mo ago
There's an interview with the CEO where he explains (claims) the idea of that policy is to reduce demand so they can leave out a couple of toilets and put in / sell more seats -- it's not about the charge for the toilet per se.
sebastiennight•2mo ago
> There's an interview with the CEO

May I point out that your counter-argument to "this is a PR stunt" is "no no, the CEO himself floated this idea publicly and got interviewed in the press to talk about it".

kjkjadksj•2mo ago
I mean it isn’t surprising people put up such abuse when I find that usually these discount airlines are half the ticket price of a major carrier for the same sort of flight. I’ve gotten remarkably good at efficiently packing my allotted small personal item bag.
potato3732842•2mo ago
The whole business model of discount airlines is to cater to the fat part of the bell curve and not the long tails. If you require special accommodation at any point in the process don't fly via a super budget value airline. Even if they do support your use case, they're not in the business of making it easy and they'll hit you with a "fuck you" fee to make it worth their while.
RobotToaster•2mo ago
> If you require special accommodation at any point in the process don't fly via a super budget value airline

That sounds pretty illegal if they aren't making accommodations for disabilities.

kjkjadksj•2mo ago
Discount airlines charge you if you so much as talk to a gate agent. I think their lawyers have found ironclad routings around something like that.
zdragnar•2mo ago
They'll make accommodations, but those will be very budget accommodations and not comfy, just like everything else about them.

Hence why you're better off going with something else. In fact, you're almost always better off going with something else. I'm not a giant, but at 6'4" (1.93 meters) I've found that I absolutely detest most shared transit. Either my legs are too long or shoulders too broad, and even non-budget airlines can be unpleasant to fly in.

jplrssn•2mo ago
The one advantage Ryanair has over non-budget airlines is that none of their seats recline.
walletdrainer•2mo ago
It’s true, in my experience at 6’7” it is much nicer to fly private. Shared transport offers a much inferior experience except on long haul flights where you have actual first class, but even then you need to be careful while booking to not accidentally end up on some silly plane.
kube-system•2mo ago
Yeah, disability accommodation laws are pretty weak, even in the countries with the strongest protections. "reasonable" accommodations often equate to situations that still don't actually provide practical accommodations for people.
hansvm•2mo ago
I'm not sure I understand. It sounds like you're saying you don't like the leg room being so cramped that beyond a certain height you're physically required to angle your knees into a neighboring seat's space. That's surely part of the charm though?
zdragnar•2mo ago
It's bad enough when I have to fight for elbow room with the people next to me. It's a whole 'nother experience to fight for the elbow room of the people in front of me to have a place to put my knees.
Spivak•2mo ago
I had the misfortune of acquiring a temporary disability while I was overseas and it kind of opened my eyes to how shitty the west treats the disabled. While I was in eastern airports the staff were tripping over themselves to accommodate me. I was assigned at least one person whose entire job was to stay with me and take me where I needed to go. They handled my bags, security, even got me food and drinks when I got hungry. It was beyond respectful. But as soon as I got to the western leg of the journey home I became a burden. I basically just got a wheelchair and my partner had to push me around while juggling our luggage.

It's crazy to see real life proof that it doesn't have to be this way.

autoexec•2mo ago
Every American I know who has spent time overseas comes back with at least one thing where they can't believe how massively we've screwed it up while also somehow ignoring that it's been being handled far more sensibly by others.
Der_Einzige•2mo ago
The right wing rise world wide will gut disability accommodations.
nxm•2mo ago
Not having a smart phone is not a disability
kakacik•2mo ago
We talk about ryanair, the scummiest of the bottom scum of airlines, they wanted to charge everybody 2 euros to use toilet (or did it pass? I can't imagine in EU, I would piss on their cabinets since I don't carry coins around).

I always print boarding passes, traveled enough to see tons of people struggling with their phones, with their pdf viewers or airline apps, to block everybody else to know what good manners and empathy to others (or simply less stressful travel) are. I wish I could save that atto fraction of a planet by not printing but it can't be like that with current ways of things.

Luckily ryanair is mostly absent from our airport (Geneva), its Easyjet all the way, way more than even Swiss airlines which chickened out on numerous levels on every swiss airport apart from Zurich. They are low cost with their share of issues but man, compared to ryanair they are absolute top versus rotten vomit, to keep things polite but precise.

Theodores•2mo ago
You would also be surprised at how 'tech savvy' non-tech people are in the UK. It is quite common for non-tech people to screenshot train ticket QR codes just in case they have no signal at the station yet none of the common train booking apps suggest this.

Rest assured, Ryanair knows their passengers very well. They know that every single one of their passengers knows how to babysit a smartphone so the battery doesn't die on their flight. Let's be honest, sudden unexpected incontinence is more likely than a Ryanair passenger fluffing up their pocket device for doom-scrolling.

HiPhish•2mo ago
> Out of curiosity, what happens when someone does not own a smartphone (or the battery is dead)?

Or you drop your phone. Or it gets stolen. Or for whatever reason the software fails. Electronic devices are so flimsy, even if you want to use an app it's worth having paper as a backup option. It's the same reason why I always carry cash and a card on me (and I pay in cash as much as possible anyway).

kjs3•2mo ago
My wife used to laugh at me that I almost always print out a boarding pass. Until the day her phone died at the gate.
chickensong•2mo ago
Not to mention that the hard copy always scans flawlessly at the gate. Phone scans, not so much.

Not only does the phone scan not work well, but people often aren't prepared and so the boarding line stalls while people unlock their phone and retrieve the e-ticket.

kmoser•2mo ago
> Not to mention that the hard copy always scans flawlessly at the gate. Phone scans, not so much.

Not true. Recently I printed a hardcopy of my boarding pass at the airline's kiosk, then found it wouldn't scan at security. Luckily I was able to pull up the barcode on my phone.

chickensong•2mo ago
Ouch. Perhaps it's a dice roll either way. I guess I just assumed everyone else also had issues with phone tickets, and not with paper. You and your sibling comment have opposite experiences however, so it seems I must retract my statement.
kjs3•2mo ago
That's the point...always have a backup. You never know which failure mode is gonna find you.
matwood•2mo ago
Phone scan works fine. People not knowing how to travel/board a plane is a different issue.
extraduder_ire•2mo ago
One thing their phone app does is crank the brightness to maximum when you view the boarding pass.
majorchord•2mo ago
> If you have already checked-in online and your smartphone or tablet dies, you will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport.

> If passengers don’t have a smartphone or tablet, as long as they have already checked-in online before arriving at the airport, they will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport.

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

dynm•2mo ago
Contrary to what many replies are telling you, the link clearly states that if you don't own a smartphone, you can check in online and then obtain a boarding pass for free at the airport.

(Not sure how easy that will be or if they actually verify that you don't own a smartphone, etc.)

nocoiner•2mo ago
I’m sorry, I am not seeing that at all at the link. I am surely missing something, but can you cut/paste what you are seeing on this point?
jenadine•2mo ago
The linked article doesn't have that info. But it is in their FAQ

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

> as long as they have already checked-in online before arriving at the airport, they will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport.

dylan604•2mo ago
Technically, the vast majority of users don't own their device. They are leasing it through their carrier. Then because it is HN, once the device is paid off, the user still doesn't own it as they cannot use it as they see fit and still must use it as the manufacturer sees fit. So this "own" word is potential for interpretation
ThePowerOfFuet•2mo ago
>Contrary to what many replies are telling you, the link clearly states that if you don't own a smartphone, you can check in online and then obtain a boarding pass for free at the airport.

The press release says absolutely nothing of the sort.

MaoSYJ•2mo ago
Passport/EU-ID to check you already have a ticket should be the standard. Everyone saves time and money this way BUT now they can earn more money at the gate.
ninalanyon•2mo ago
In Norway on Norwegian carriers all you need for internal travel is the credit card you booked the ticket with.
shellfishgene•2mo ago
No ID? So anyone with the card can use the ticket?
eqvinox•2mo ago
That's normal in the Schengen area, you only need ID if you're checking a bag. (Or if there's a spot check by police, but they won't care if your boarding pass matches your ID, just that your ID is valid.)
extraduder_ire•2mo ago
If they're for sale online, anyone with the card can buy another ticket.
hleszek•2mo ago
It is said on their website that if you lose your phone or it dies, you can get a free boarding pass at the airport.

Source: https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

jakub_g•2mo ago
Most of the answers are here:

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

Re: the "their server is flaky" (I believe you mean at the gate) case, I think any airline might be then struggling with boarding passengers, whether they have paper boarding cards or not.

hansvm•2mo ago
For more fun, Frontier's app doesn't even run on my phone. Step 1 to fly with them is to go buy a phone from the last 2-3 years (can probably get away with something a little older if iOS).
Beijinger•2mo ago
No problem. Normally they can print a ticket for you. 50 bucks...
reconnecting•2mo ago
Traveling seems to be essential, but having the App Store, iPhone, or Android definitely are not.

What happens if your phone is stolen, broken, discharged? Finally, I fly several times a month with different companies, does that mean I should have a circus of apps on my phone?

I hope someone will regulate this matter.

nashashmi•2mo ago
Typically other companies have used emails and websites to download passes. Maybe the same can happen here.
reconnecting•2mo ago
It's clearly explained in Ryanair's press release that this is not the case and the application is mandatory.
philipwhiuk•2mo ago
> What happens if your phone is stolen, broken, discharged?

Pay Ryanair 50 bucks for a printed boarding pass at the counter.

reconnecting•2mo ago
Thanks, but I'm fine with printing my own boarding pass at home for free.

From my perspective, even a paid toilet (1) would be a better offering than this.

1. https://abcnews.go.com/Travel/Green/paying-pee-airlines-crit...

ryandrake•2mo ago
More broadly, we need regulation where companies cannot make "ownership of the newest smartphone" a requirement to do business with them. I'm lucky to be in the USA where we still haven't smartphone-ized everything yet, but every year I see it creeping in. Every year, a new bank requires a smartphone to create a passkey or whatever. Every year, a restaurant I like moves over to QR code menus. Every year, a doctor decides to move over to smartphone-based payments only. And of course, all of the crappy app developers insist that 1. I use a very recent phone and 2. I run the latest OS, or I'm shut out.

I have no problem with enabling smartphone-based payments and passes for people who like them, but companies should not be allowed to block out (or charge extra to) others who prefer not to tether themselves to a phone.

reconnecting•2mo ago
Here in some European countries, like France, having a smartphone out in a restaurant is a sign of bad etiquette. It's not crucial, but from some people's perspective it might seem out of place. However, some restaurants tried QR code menus due to COVID-19, but most of them have since stopped using them.

I fully agree that having the latest version of a phone/OS should not be treated as a requirement for access to services, especially essential ones.

fauigerzigerk•2mo ago
>More broadly, we need regulation where companies cannot make "ownership of the newest smartphone" a requirement to do business with them.

I'm not keen on mobile apps in general, but I don't see a need for regulation here. Companies want customers. It's not in their interest to needlessly harass people with pointless technology requirements that drive people to competitors. No company has ever required "the newest smartphone" for everyday tasks.

I don't support a general right to refuse adoption of any and all new technologies. What I do support is a mandate to use open technologies wherever possible for infrastructure that no one can reasonably avoid. What we can't allow is that people who lose some oligopolist account can no longer live a normal life.

reconnecting•2mo ago
>Companies want customers.

Indeed, and that's why perhaps some internal marketing analytics show that people with installed apps often buy tickets from the same airline company. Then, we discover how airline companies decide to push their mobile phone application adoption through mandatory tickets.

Such decisions are always about sales, and never about security or customer care.

fauigerzigerk•2mo ago
You're probably right. I just think it's not worth piling the equivalent of technical debt on our legal system just to curb small annoyances. Budget airlines are an incredibly rich source of small annoyances.
ryandrake•2mo ago
"Companies want customers" is often not enough of a market force to result in behavior that is inclusive of everyone, which is why, for example, we need things like the Americans with Disabilities Act, which mandates that companies' services are accessible to all, and other laws which require full and equal accommodations. We could almost argue that making things "[new] smartphone only" might violate the ADA. I'd like to see such a lawsuit.
fauigerzigerk•2mo ago
I agree that we sometimes need regulation to guarantee access for everyone.

But regulations need to be kept up-to-date and they need to be consistently enforced. That's a lot of work. Having too many of them only helps lawyers and people who can afford them.

Some random company requiring a smartphone for access to some service doesn't strike me as exclusionary enough to justify burdening the system with more regulation.

leptons•2mo ago
>. And of course, all of the crappy app developers insist that 1. I use a very recent phone and 2. I run the latest OS, or I'm shut out.

Signal did this when my wife's Macbook could no longer be updated to the latest Apple OS version. Signal just stopped working for her completely on her laptop. She couldn't install the latest version of Signal due to her not being on the latest OS, and Signal won't allow the old version to work once it's outdated. We had to buy her a whole new laptop (not Apple this time) to get her back on Signal (something she relies on).

Yes, I know about the hacky workarounds to get the latest OS working on a Macbook, but fuck that noise.

reconnecting•2mo ago
I was not an active Signal user, but the same thing happens with Signal on my macOS Catalina, which I also don't want to update.

Luckily, email is always with me, despite OS version and platform.

ryandrake•2mo ago
Third party developers dropping support for OS versions that are, frankly, not even very old, is a scourge in software today.

I can maybe understand sunsetting support if the OS made a huge backwards-incompatible step change, but macOS and iOS updates don't tend to be that kind. The differences (for developers) between Catalina and Mojave are minuscule. Retaining support for Mojave should be close to zero effort on the part of the developer. There should be no difference in maintenance burden between building an application that runs on Mojave and Catalina, and building an application that runs only on Catalina+.

zzo38computer•2mo ago
> I have no problem with enabling smartphone-based payments and passes for people who like them, but companies should not be allowed to block out (or charge extra to) others who prefer not to tether themselves to a phone.

I agree with this. (The same would apply to restaurant menus.)

(In the case of restaurant menus, they could post a single copy near the entrance or somewhere that it can be seen by everyone in case they do not want to make multiple copies (and do not want to waste paper). E-paper displays might be used in case they sometimes change.)

blamazon•2mo ago
Use a different airline, the free market will take care of the rest!
lrvick•2mo ago
Not always a choice unless you want to spend the night at an airport and miss the thing you are flying in for.
rixed•2mo ago
Or use a different phone than apple's or google's, one that protect your privacy against airline companies stealing and resselling your data. The free market will... hem...
kjkjadksj•2mo ago
And pay more than what you’d pay for ryanairs extortionate ticket printing service
hexbin010•2mo ago
Haha all of them end up getting dragged down to Ryanair's level

Almost all short haul airlines in Europe more-or-less resemble the Ryanair model now

afavour•2mo ago
Traveling by plane, and specifically by budget airline, isn't essential. I'm not in favor of Ryanair's move here but it's also a free market, they can add restrictions and the market will react to it.
reconnecting•2mo ago
I'm fine with restrictions if they are reasonable/justified. I don't have an app store and I'm not planning to use one, and it's unclear to me why I'm unable to download and print a ticket when they can do the same for €50.

From a personal computer there are zero requirements, I don't need to have a special OS, or application, or anything. On the mobile application side, I must have one of two authorized app stores, an account there, and perhaps a specific OS version. This is something that I find unfair in this business practice.

hexbin010•2mo ago
What do we do if/when all other airlines copy Ryanair (again)?
kyriakos•2mo ago
If a government offers official apps for those platforms and banks allow you to use some services for free via app but charge a fee if you show up in person I think airlines can get away with it too
jimbokun•2mo ago
You can check in online before leaving for the airport in that case.
hollowturtle•2mo ago
Do the checkin online and add the boarding pass to your ios/android wallet, as simple as that. Just did the last weekend with ryanair. Btw the faq specify that as long as you do the checkin online, if you lose your device or it dies a boarding pass will be printed for you for free
zzo38computer•2mo ago
> What happens if your phone is stolen, broken, discharged?

Another comment says that if any of those apply (or if you do not have a (compatible) smart phone) then you can still receive a boarding pass at the airport, although it seems that you will still need check-in online.

phyzome•2mo ago
Wow, to hell with that. I'm not installing an airline app, even if I had a smartphone.
aquir•2mo ago
Can I download the app, add the boarding pass to Apple Wallet and remove/disable the app? Or just take a screenshot of the boarding pass and then uninstall it?
PaulRobinson•2mo ago
Likely dynamic generated QR codes. These are becoming more and more common place.
subscribed•2mo ago
Come on, it's not meant to be user-friendly, anyone who buys that deserves to buy a bridge.
bad_username•2mo ago
I suspect that when you install the app, it will require all the juicy permissions like contacts, and hoover up lots of data before you even begin to use it. So the damage will have been done, even though you uninstall it soon.
extraduder_ire•2mo ago
Last I checked (2022), it has wallet support and didn't prevent you from taking screenshots.
swiftcoder•2mo ago
Huh. I feel like one of Ryanair's major profit centres in the past has been that €50 fee they charge to print your boarding pass at the counter when the app doesn't work...
philipwhiuk•2mo ago
Sure.

You'll no longer be able to print a boarding pass but they will.

everdrive•2mo ago
A grim view of things to come. More companies will do this, and eventually your defacto tracking device (ie, your smart phone) will become your government-mandated tracking device. I'd like to stop traveling by air altogether. Sadly, I need to travel for work this December.
Aurornis•2mo ago
Boarding an airplane, which requires that someone check your ID, is one of the most reliable tracking indicators available to show that a person was in a specific place at a specific time.

Nabbing people at airports is a common strategy for this reason.

Putting the boarding pass on a phone doesn’t make it easier for the government to know that you’re flying.

everdrive•2mo ago
I just mean in general. If airplane companies normalize using an app then other companies may as well. Do you need a smartphone to pump gas? Or to use government services? How about to buy groceries? That sort of slippery slope is what I would be afraid of.
matwood•2mo ago
> If airplane companies normalize using an app then other companies may as well.

I fly a lot and can't remember the last time I had a paper boarding pass. When I board the vast majority of people also use their phones, so normalization has already happened with air travel.

rurp•2mo ago
You think this mandated budget airline app is only going to track a gate check-in and nothing else? My guess is that it will collect an absurd amount of extra data and waste endless amounts of time with up-sells and other dark patterns.
IlikeKitties•2mo ago
If you live in the EU, the euID app that's coming in the next few years will use the google play integrity API. It's all but inevitable.
suddenlybananas•2mo ago
It's really remarkable how committed the EU is to selling out to Americans.
Zambyte•2mo ago
> Sadly, I need to travel for work this December.

Tell your employer you need a phone.

thomond•2mo ago
I'm a bit shocked the EU allowed them away with this.
colinbartlett•2mo ago
How can this possibly be legal? If it truly is, the EU needs to get on it immediately.
IlikeKitties•2mo ago
Than you haven't been watching the EU enough. They are currently working on MULTIPLE different omnibus laws that will make owning an Google or Apple Approved Phone, running Google or Apple Approved Firmware and using the Google or Apple App store de-facto mandatory for living in the EU.

You vill download ze app and you vill accept the TOS.

*Downvote me all you want here's the proof:* https://github.com/eu-digital-identity-wallet/av-doc-technic...

teekert•2mo ago
What you are presenting is all opt-in.
mrbadguy•2mo ago
For now
hexbin010•2mo ago
It always begins that way to squash criticism.
zajio1am•2mo ago
Governments would mandate age requirements for many websites and these websites would be forced to check EU digital identity wallet.
teekert•2mo ago
I'm convinced they won't, they are just slow to react.
extraduder_ire•2mo ago
What about this do you think contradicts EU law?

The EU is remarkably laissez faire about a lot of things in the market.

physicsguy•2mo ago
The whole point of Ryanair has always been low cost flights by shoving passengers in and stick to the rules to make everything faster and having less staff. People want the £30 flight but don't want to stick to the conditions, ultimately. But that is the trade off you make.
zb3•2mo ago
Requiring a particular app for something that could be achieved by scanning a code (displayed on a screen) is bullshit.

And let me guess - then they'll use Play Integrity API so that you cannot fly if you're not using Google certified device with preinstalled privileged spyware (or lease an Apple device you don't own)?

thomascountz•2mo ago
Phone's dead/dropped under a bus tire/stolen at security/got bit-flipped by a cosmic ray, now what?

Nearly 80% of 207M passengers already adopted it means 41M passengers have not.

I apologize in advance for being overly dramatic. I just flew with a digital boarding pass and my phone nearly died while waiting at the outlet-less gate. I'm sure I could have gotten assistance, but it was stressful.

rixed•2mo ago
Empty battery is not unlikely in airports that make it extra-hard to recharge a phone (Looking at you, BER). Long ago it was possible to unplug a vending machine as a last resort, but these days all electrical sockets are concealed, as a measure to prevent overnight stays in airports I believe.
jenadine•2mo ago
If you lose your phone or if it's out of battery, you'll get a free boarding pass at the airport as long as you checked in online before getting to the airport.

If you didn't check in before, you'll have to pay a 50€ fee. (Same as before)

Source: https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

tmilard•2mo ago
Let's be honnest : more and more service will move to "only Smarphone" way. For economic reason (less process so less expences).

So what.

codegeek•2mo ago
I think requiring app is an overreach. I hate installing apps. If you want to save money and not do paper, I would just do this:

- Provide a discount/credit for using electronic digital boarding pass (PDF file, no apps). If someone is not able to use the PDF etc (either their own printout or on their phone) and require a paper pass at the airport for any reason, their discount/credit goes away. Simple.

globular-toast•2mo ago
> faster

Scanning a QR code from a screen is faster than from a piece of paper? How does that work?

> smarter

A smart person would carry both a digital and paper copy of their travel documents.

> greener

Ah, yes, all it takes to make flying "green" is eliminating a single sheet of A4 paper per passenger.

rixed•2mo ago
> Ah, yes, all it takes to make flying "green" is eliminating a single sheet of A4 paper per passenger.

That's 80% filled with ads...

johnjames87•2mo ago
Remember: you can always pick a different airline.
teekert•2mo ago
Yes, but also, collectively, democratically, via are laws, we can set where a race to the bottom ends.
subscribed•2mo ago
No, I can't. They're the only airline serving the city I have to visit a few times a year. Next two airports are 250 and 350 km away.

Not really feasible.

hexbin010•2mo ago
Until all other short-haul airlines copy them

They already copied many, many other aspects of the low-cost business model, so I'm sure this will follow

johnjames87•2mo ago
> Until all other short-haul airlines copy them

Like it or not, we live in a market economy with market competition. There are new airlines every year. In 2022 there was a net increase of 13 airlines in europe alone. If people want paper boarding passes, some competitor will give it to them. Always been like that in market economies, and socialists will keep fearmongering about "what one company does" like its the end of the world.

colinbartlett•2mo ago
Will the app requirement be disclosed at purchase everywhere? IE: If I am buying on a third-party online travel agent, will the checkout process state that in order to board the flight at the cost quoted, that I will need to have a smartphone with the app installed?
Freak_NL•2mo ago
There does not appear to be an app requirement after all. You are required to check-in online before heading to the airport though.

See: https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

OptionOfT•2mo ago
But why? What is wrong with PDFs? Either printed or digitally?

Want to make it a little bit more fancy? Apple Wallet and Google Wallet both support a more fancy setup.

Technologically speaking banning the other things is only driven by hoping that people will forget something and they can charge extra.

What's next? They 'accidentally' kill the app during boarding. And they can up charge you.

IlikeKitties•2mo ago
A printed PDF doesn't sell your data for profit. An App does.
9cb14c1ec0•2mo ago
^ This, and nothing else. There is a dark, evil underbelly to the data broker ecosystem that is largely powered by random apps people install on their phones.
rixed•2mo ago
Ryanair basically invented most of the dark patterns that are now prevalent in all travel websites. Back then, the experience was so awful that it was comical (and even inspired a song[0]). Therefore I'm not surprised that they are the first to mandate you install their app on your phone. All other companies that have dreamed of this will be quick to follow suit.

Notice the euphemism of calling this "going digital". Everybody is already digital, using a pdf reader on their phone at the terminal, despite some companies discouraging this practice. That's not digital enough, is it?

[0]: https://youtu.be/Id-zzOGnN6A?t=102

Freak_NL•2mo ago
This announcement is a load of bull. See this page about the new system:

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

> But what if, and what if, and what if?

> If you have already checked-in online and your smartphone or tablet dies / is lost, you will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport.

> If passengers don’t have a smartphone or tablet, as long as they have already checked-in online before arriving at the airport, they will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport.

lxgr•2mo ago
Wow, this might just be an improvement on the status quo (app optional, but high boarding pass printing fee if it's not used).

I don't think this policy will hold up in the face of Ryanair ticket resellers though, since it seems to be pretty clearly designed to make their life harder once again, but free replacement printing would offer them a way out.

jimbokun•2mo ago
It's hilarious how many HN commenters claimed these things weren't true without bothering to check.
jakub_g•2mo ago
> "If X or Y or Z... you will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport"

After queueing for 1.5h in a single queue for the entire flight, served by one service crew person.

hexbin010•2mo ago
And some Swissair agent denying knowledge about this new policy
blululu•2mo ago
Ironic that RyanAir’s press release website has a print button as if anyone prints websites. There are a lot of advantages to paper and printers. As a general policy policy point I don’t love this direction. But also it’s RyanAir. This is by far the smallest customer rights violation that they have and will continue to commit. And at this point everyone should know that a 25 quid flight from Manchester to Madrid on RyanAir has a catch. Just be glad your luggage wasn’t jettisoned over the channel to save weight.
bluebarbet•2mo ago
A "boarding pass" was always a redundant document anyway. As are "tickets" whenever ID is required for the service in question. The ID has a number on it, in the system that's the ticket. In police states like China, tickets are a thing of the past.

That flying - an entirely unsustainable mode of transport - is now widely viewed as a commoditized consumer good is already a form of ethical collapse IMO. Now this. We need regulation. But for that, people need choose it, to vote for it.

Animats•2mo ago
Can you display the boarding pass in a web browser? Allowing a RyanAir app on your phone seems high-risk.
qazxcvbnmlp•2mo ago
so many opportunities for shenanigans!

'watch this ad before we give you your boarding pass'

'no boarding pass for you until your group is called'

'ah ha! you have an iPhone 17 pro max instead of a $BUDGET_ANDROID, cool your seat fees will be 20% higher'

'oh you got your boarding pass on this device, but need it on a different device now? cool lets do a device transfer fee'

rwmj•2mo ago
Ryanair are probably reading this thread looking for ideas.
HiPhish•2mo ago
> but will instead need to use the digital boarding pass generated in their “myRyanair” app during check-in to board their Ryanair flight.

And of course it's only possible using a specific proprietary app. You'd think a penny-pinching company would want to use open standard to save money instead of develop a custom app, right? I'm 100% sure this is done intentionally to scoop up as much personal data from their customers.

dfxm12•2mo ago
Yes. Scooping up user data is just another revenue stream. That is the point.
mschuster91•2mo ago
Particularly for airlines. For years actually flying passengers hasn't been profitable, it's all about side income that makes a profit [1].

[1] https://www.investopedia.com/the-four-biggest-us-airlines-al...

canucker2016•2mo ago
There's a YouTube video that talks about how valuable the major US airlines reward program is. The market cap of each airline is less than the value of each airline's reward program at the time the video was made.

I recall Apple was valued in a similar manner back in the late 1990s. Their market cap was barely more than cash on hand. Talk about missed investing opportunities...

Not that I'm saying airlines are the next AAPL.

edit - here's the video - "How Airlines Quietly Became Banks" - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggUduBmvQ_4

swyx•2mo ago
i cant believe i'm about to defend Ryanair but just fwiw it seems quite normal to do a custom app specifically for tickets, for anticheat purposes + the nicety of putting your ticket in Apple Wallet is nice enough that i willingly do it for the airlines i fly.

ok that wasnt really defending Ryanair but just being argumentative for the sake of fairness. obviously Ryanair doesn't have Ticketmaster level tech.

pphysch•2mo ago
Why do you need to download and run an app to get your ticket into your phone's Wallet?
serial_dev•2mo ago
You can usually get the ticket printed at the desk, print it at home, have a PDF on any device like a Kindle, take a screenshot of the QR code, add to your wallet on your phone even without proprietary apps, etc…

I download the airline’s apps, but I hate relying exclusively on these potentially unreliable apps, or unreliable phones so I always get the ticket in other formats, too: always have an analog version, and some form of digital version on at least two devices.

I don’t travel often, but when I do, missing a flight would be expensive or annoying, so it’s a reasonable trade off for me, ymmv. With that said, I also don’t fly Ryanair, so they can do whatever they want.

swyx•2mo ago
btw ryanair charges you like $75 for printing at the desk haha
gruturo•2mo ago
It absolutely doesn't take an app to issue a boarding pass which will appear in your Apple Wallet. It's literally a zip (with extension .pkpass) containing a master JSON, a few assets like logos and a digital signature. There are tutorials for making your own.

Many airlines let you download one once you check in on their website, or email you one, or embed a download link in an SMS, just to name 3 alternatives.

robocat•2mo ago
Recent experience with United: the SMS option was deeply broken (as in couldn't actually get one boarding pass from the link in SMS). Their kiosks were crap too (as in attendant tries to tell me I'm doing it wrong, then they can't do it, and they finally have to check me in on their own terminal).

The overall UX/UI of airlines is terribly broken.

brewdad•2mo ago
2025 Web of Shit papering over a 1950s era backend.
john01dav•2mo ago
Why does a boarding pass need a rootkit? ("anticheat" is usually code for root kits, and at least it has some positive trade off for users in the video game case)

They can just check the scanned pass against their own database to verify authenticity. They could also cryptographically sign it.

chickensong•2mo ago
It may be "quite normal" to you, but that doesn't mean it's good. Stockholm syndrome comes to mind here.

Until technology gives us better controls, we must assume that every app, particularly those from large profit-driven corporations, is hostile.

BrandoElFollito•2mo ago
It may be hostile to you, bit that doesn't mean it is hostile. Paranoia syndrom comes to mind here.
chickensong•2mo ago
It's true that not all apps are hostile, but my pessimism and paranoia aren't unfounded. If you think the current state of software, security, privacy, etc, is fine and dandy and doesn't warrant skepticism, then our shared reality is probably too fractured to have a meaningful debate.
BrandoElFollito•2mo ago
I work in cybersecurity, heading the group in a company you know. I also develop open source software. So I am painfully aware of the pandemic of cybersecurity issues we face professionally and at home.

Progress has its good and bad aspects, and we must fight as much as possible in some battles, and choose them wisely. This is why the EU efforts around privacy are great, and without their drawbacks. But ultimately they are great.

Being infuriated as I see in this thread about the decision of a company to use mobiles as boarding passes is not something I adhere to. One can always fly with another airline that does not have these restrictions, and complain on another thread how expensive this is.

Saying that all of current technology is evil means going off the grid and living a quiet life in a remote forest. This is of course a solution.

Saying that some technology is evil (and it definitely is) means fighting for these specific things to be regulated. Ryan Air's digital boarding passes is not one of them.

chickensong•2mo ago
I'm not trying to crusade against digital boarding passes, my issue is with normalizing mandatory apps for all the things.

If we had high quality, trusted software, leveraging open standards, that would be one thing, but instead we have janky proprietary snowflake apps that are borderline malware. Like you said, it's a pandemic of cybersecurity issues, so it's hard for me to accept the 'just install the app' mentality.

I agree we should pick our battles, but I don't believe regulation is the only solution worth fighting for. My comment was to nudge cultural change, by pushing back against what I see as a bad practice.

slumberlust•2mo ago
No. I'm app fatigued and over it. Let's put some power back into he hands of consumers for once.
nutjob2•2mo ago
Its so they can collect a fee of 50 euros or pounds off you when your phone battery is flat or the app otherwise doesn't work.
hleszek•2mo ago
It is said on their website that if you lose your phone or it dies, you can get a free boarding pass at the airport.

Source: https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/lp/explore/digital-boarding-pa...

ranger_danger•2mo ago
This should be at the top of this thread... it practically makes the whole thing a nothingburger.
Dylan16807•2mo ago
It moves the app one notch back from mandatory, but that's still enough to be a real problem. That method is going to have very low capacity and if you lie about your phone being dead or elsewhere that might screw you over.
ranger_danger•2mo ago
> if you lie about your phone being dead or elsewhere that might screw you over.

I would bet money this will never happen, but ok.

kmoser•2mo ago
Last year I purchased a ticket to a Broadway show in NYC. I refused to use their digital ticketing nonsense, and when I showed up at the box office just before showtime and said my phone wasn't working (for my own definition of "working") they just handed me paper tickets. So I have to believe every one of these companies must have a way of issuing tickets when people's phones "don't work."
nutjob2•2mo ago
So always carry a dead phone with you when flying Ryanair.
kjkjadksj•2mo ago
I wonder if its like frontier where they hide the standardized mobile boarding pass behind a dark pattern?
addandsubtract•2mo ago
So far, you can just download the boarding pass to apple/google wallet after checking in. Only dark patterns are in their booking process.
dalmo3•2mo ago
So instead of one proprietary app now you need two?

What's darker than dark?

addandsubtract•2mo ago
You can also take a screenshot of your ticket. The passes are just for convenience.
ranger_danger•2mo ago
Ryanair app blocks screenshots
BrandoElFollito•2mo ago
I just tried and it does not (Android)
ranger_danger•2mo ago
Do you perhaps have biometric unlocking disabled?
BrandoElFollito•2mo ago
I do use biometric auth.
benoau•2mo ago
Vantadark patterns.
piperswe•2mo ago
There are plenty of open-source apps that can store & show .pkpass files, though I don't know if they're compatible with Frontier's passes
lazide•2mo ago
Ryanair is the dark pattern. Like damn.
g-mork•2mo ago
They move 200 million passengers a year. The app is full of upsell. Please explain how your open standard accomplishes their goals
Retric•2mo ago
You can upsell just fine through a website.
g-mork•2mo ago
I used this app over the weekend, it's actually quite handy. Can't help but notice those priority boarding and seat selection buttons while checking for the gate number. You can also order food from your phone in the cabin using some magical Bluetooth protocol I didn't understand

Just to be clear I think their policy is horrifically abusive, but I can totally see why they're doing it

pmontra•2mo ago
Their goal is not my goal. My goal is to fly to a destination. A paper ticket has always been enough for that. And if they want to upsell a web page can be full of upselling too. But I don't want upsells, only a flight and air companies are commodities. Imagine if I had to install an app for every chain of gas pumps around my country and the nearby ones.
throw20251110•2mo ago
Imagine you drive an EV and that's exactly what you have to do.
dreamcompiler•2mo ago
True for everybody but Tesla. If you have a Tesla you install the app once to enter your credit card and then you can delete the app if you wish. All you need to recharge is the ability to drive the car (which doesn't require the app).
dashundchen•2mo ago
Not true for Electrify America and many other chargers.

Plug and charge is supported on many vehicles, and you can skip the app entirely and just pay by card.

autoexec•2mo ago
Why do they force you to install the app just to enter a credit card? Sounds like something a website could do just fine.
rcbdev•2mo ago
But, it's not. All EV's in Europe I've driven had a simple plastic charging card, no apps required.
ranger_danger•2mo ago
I think with these kinds of ideological issues, all one can do is vote with their wallet. Nobody is forcing you to fly Ryanair, there are other choices, and if you don't like their practices, don't fly with them. If enough people do it, then they might change their ways, but if their 80% number is accurate, you're probably just stuck not flying with them anymore and nobody else is going to care but you, unfortunately.

Not trying to be rude at all... you said their goal is not yours, so that's why you choose not to do business with them. Every business can't please everyone at the same time.

glaucon•2mo ago
> I think with these kinds of ideological issues, all one can do is vote with their wallet

Needs to be viewed in the light of the distinctly un-open market in which airlines operate. There are only so many airports, and only so many slots. I might wish to start another airline which customers may use an open solution but the reality is that incumbents have a massive moat around them. No market, that I know of, is perfect but air travel is an unusually distorted one.

wongarsu•2mo ago
Though much less distorted in the EU than in the US. It's common to have the choice between 2-3 different airlines to get from one place to another, and if that's not good enough the next major airport is frequently just a 2-3 hour train journey away
Eddy_Viscosity2•2mo ago
This was going to be my comment. "vote with your wallet" only works in open competitive markets. But (with a few exceptions), this is not the world we live in. Regulation is the only option left. You have to vote with your vote to get laws in place that force industry to behave better.
kube-system•2mo ago
The GP was commenting on the motivations of Ryanair, and the parent was responding to that.
alkonaut•2mo ago
> But I don't want upsells

Ryan is cheap because they sell you lottery tickets on the plane.

If you don’t want upsells there are airlines that cater to that as well.

op00to•2mo ago
I refuse to ever fly Southwest because of their history of open seating. I refuse to ever fly Spirit or other American discount airlines because I want to keep the nickle and diming to a minimum. I fly less than I could if I sought out rock bottom airfares, and that’s ok.
EGreg•2mo ago
And they’re OK with that as well, clearly :)
brewdad•2mo ago
I understand not wanting to deal with open seating but continuing to boycott an airline after they fixed your pet-peeve makes no sense to me.
op00to•2mo ago
My reasoning: fuck ‘em. That and loyalty points.
port11•2mo ago
In many European segments we're finding them comparably priced. If we factor getting to the Ryanair airports, luggage, etc., sometimes we're better off flying, say, Brussels Airlines. And I'd happily buy food in Ryanair flights if their catalogue had any proper food.
dreamcompiler•2mo ago
> Imagine if I had to install an app for every chain of gas pumps around my country and the nearby ones.

Oh Great. Some oil company CEO's nephew in tech just read this and sent it to his uncle. Who will adopt it forthwith.

op00to•2mo ago
That’s pretty much what the EV charging landscape is, right?
mihaic•2mo ago
I don't think it helps if you're arguing their position. We don't want to allow them to upsell. They're crossing the line into social ostracization grounds.

At this point, their destruction of social trust is so severe that simply boycotting is not enough, just like you don't just boycott a company that's doing environmental destruction. They simply need to be stopped, regardless of their goals.

madaxe_again•2mo ago
Actually, it isn’t even possible in all cases.

I literally have just got home from a Ryanair flight where they provided me with no option but a paper boarding pass for my daughter.

It’s essentially a result of a crazy hack they’ve implemented to support families who have Ryanair prime.

You can only name adults as Ryanair prime members, and when you book through a Ryanair prime account, you can only book for the named members. There’s a maximum of two per account, as it’s intended for couples. The kids, aged 2-16, you have to make a “linked booking”. You don’t get boarding passes through the app or email - the only option is to go to a customer service desk and have them print you a paper boarding pass.

Also… digital boarding passes are an open standard - IATA BCBP. You can go make your own.

https://www.iata.org/contentassets/1dccc9ed041b4f3bbdcf8ee86...

ranger_danger•2mo ago
Page | 32

2.6.3. Fraud Prevention

Ill-intentioned persons may falsify their BCBP by changing the flight number or class of service. They may also simply print two copies of the BCBP and pass one to a friend, or even create a counterfeit BCBP. Technical solutions exist, e.g. algorithms, called certificates, which can for example secure the bar code if necessary.

rkagerer•2mo ago
Which I assume also means you need to agree to a shitty, user-hostile ToS?
ekjhgkejhgk•2mo ago
> And of course it's only possible using a specific proprietary app.

Right. I like email. I guess fuck me.

hansvm•2mo ago
Yeah, it's right up there with the rest of the shady business practices.

Delta, for example, charges more physical cash for a cash+miles ticket than for a pure cash ticket (every time I've been inclined to try to use miles over the last few years anyway). I get that they maybe don't meet the legal barrier for fraud, but even a child can see that it's unethical.

Toss in the seat-selection UI (strongly suggesting you have to select a seat if you don't know the game and figure out how to exit that menu, but every possible seat has an upcharge above the ticket price), "trip insurance" which is insanely overpriced and mostly only covers the things the airline is already required to reimburse you for, and everything else they do, and it's obvious that when a new anti-feature comes out (mandatory app usage being the latest and greatest) it just exists to scam a few more dollars out of you and lie a bit more about the true ticket price.

TrainedMonkey•2mo ago
I am going to summarize with - they want you to use their app for monetization and ux purposes.
cyanydeez•2mo ago
Open source should work hard on a "universal" VM to load these types of apps into.
john-h-k•2mo ago
There’s an easy solution. Don’t fly Ryanair! I’m perfectly happy to take this sacrifice in exchange for cheaper tickets
xn•2mo ago
The airline that inspired at least one passenger to write a song about them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1SKldiiWm4
_trampeltier•2mo ago
Reminder, soon you need just a strong jammer to stop the world.
fmkamchatka•2mo ago
> Will deliver a greener experience

LMAO. When you get people on a flight your unprinted paper is meaningless.

jojomodding•2mo ago
Even before this, I already had all my

> Travel Documents: accessible in one convenient place.

in my hand, with it requiring exactly 0 clicks to present the piece of paper to the barcode scanner.

kcartlidge•2mo ago
I like how their number one benefit is Order to Seat. In one fell swoop it shows that:

* Their priority is revenue above all else (fair enough; honest too)

* They are either deceptive or stupid

Re the deception/stupidity - if everyone is moving to using the same app, how does everyone "get served first" as per their bullet point?

cromulent•2mo ago
Last time I flew Ryanair in July, I presented my phone to the agent to check my boarding pass. She took my phone to scan it. I turned my head to talk to my companion.

When I looked back, the agent was in my settings, quietly enabling all the permissions for the app (which I had deliberately disabled).

When I (shocked) told her off, she rolled her eyes and said I would need to change them anyway to scan the bag tags.

The cheek.

imp0cat•2mo ago
Seriously, just pin the app to the screen before handing your phone to anyone.

https://www.samsung.com/sg/support/mobile-devices/pin-an-app...

cromulent•2mo ago
Yep. I naively thought that no-one representing a company would ever do such a thing.
jakub_g•2mo ago
TIL about App Pinning! It's also available in Android on Pixels.
silisili•2mo ago
I have no idea about Europeans, but as an American who's flown a lot recently, the push to smartphone based tickets has been a nightmare. Not because of the tickets, but people aren't seemingly smart or considerate enough to use them correctly.

Paper tickets were so fast. Fold, press, beep, done.

App based tickets? Constant announcements (I'm talking 10 or more during boarding) to turn your brightness up. Despite that, I saw

1 - 25ish percent of people had dark screens, so the attendant had to take the phone, up the brightness, scan it, then hand it back.

2 - A number of screen with cracks or something (didn't get a good look) that required moving the QR code around to get it to scan.

3 - An alarming number of people who didn't bother to even unlock their phone, who then proceed to fumble with thumbing or face scanning, close whatever they were doing, then go into the app and find their ticket.

I'd say the boarding process took at minimum two to three times as long as they did with purely paper tickets.

Arch-TK•2mo ago
Temporarily controlling screen brightness is something that, at least on android, the app can do itself...

The cracked screen thing - funny.

I wonder how long these twats will hold out.

I hope by the next time I fly Ryanair, someone has figured out how to emulate the look of the app and extract the relevant data so I don't have to run their garbage malware on my phone in order to have the pleasure to fly a "cheap" airline which bills you for everything after using every dark pattern imaginable when you purchase their tickets.

jerlam•2mo ago
While annoying, the boarding pass scanning process usually isn't the bottleneck.

After I scanned my boarding pass, I then waited in line in the jet bridge, because people in the plane were busy putting their luggage in the overhead compartments, searching for their seats, moving to let people sit in the window seats, and other assorted activities.

bradlys•2mo ago
The paper scanning is hardly the limitation with onboarding.

I feel like you never fly because if you did, you’d know the biggest limitation in boarding speed is the inefficient method they use to board people… not the scanning part. If everyone scans efficiently (something you see often at places like SFO), you just are waiting on the jet bridge… It only takes one person who needs to take off their coat before they sit down or has trouble putting their oversized carry on in storage, etc. to completely shutdown onboarding.

silisili•2mo ago
It's ok to point out a flaw in my argument without calling me a liar.

I probably should have said 3x the scanning time, perhaps not total boarding time, I agree with that much.

That said, if the person blocking your seating arrived on the plane 20 minutes later because scanning took an extra 20 minutes, that still means you were delayed 20 minutes + person blocking you.

But I'd expect someone who flies from an airport smarter than everyone else in the US to have already factored that in.

matwood•2mo ago
I fly a lot and most people are using their phones now without issue. But when someone does have an issue I remind myself that many people rarely fly, and haven't been through the process hundreds of times. Phone, paper, whatever - people screw it up if they haven't done it before. Boarding first, pre-check/global entry are all beneficial in part because you're dealing with other frequent flyers.
theandrewbailey•2mo ago
Quick, someone make a new list:

Myths programmers believe about app-based airline tickets

port11•2mo ago
1) Smartphone users have a constant, reliable, and fast connection to the internet.

2) People flying Ryanair always have a charged phone.

2a) Okay, but at least a powerbank.

john01dav•2mo ago
I wonder how these gate agents will react if I show their app throwing a hissy fit and refusing to work when it is blocked from any data mining. No permissions, no google play services, no safetynet, maybe no network. It is non cooperation with their bs, but it looks like a technical issue. And, if it can work without such things, then I hate it much less.
neximo64•2mo ago
Probably thats the goal, so there is a way to charge a fee. Do you not know Ryanair
galaxy_gas•2mo ago
When you do this they charge you the human assist fee and boarding pass fee or you don't board.
john01dav•2mo ago
I'd probably pay the fee, take my flight, then charge it back with a reason like "Fee for not using app, app did not work. Fee advertised as optional was not, in fact, optional for me". Completely true statement.
criddell•2mo ago
You would win but then Ryanair would ban you from flying with them in the future.
john01dav•2mo ago
I don't know about Ryanair, but I've had to reverse credit card transactions due to scams a few times and I've never been banned from other businesses.
criddell•2mo ago
Ryanair has a history of banning people who dispute charges.
ponector•2mo ago
Why should they care? Without presenting a boarding pass you can't even approach the gates, cannot pass security check.

And you cannot get a boarding pass without an app.

subscribed•2mo ago
I just installed it on a fresh profile in GrapheneOS.

Blocked from any access except network, and it didn't even try to check Play Integrity API. Works okay. Didn't have a chance to check in/display boarding pass, but I could access all the details of my flight no problem.

extraduder_ire•2mo ago
Thank you for checking that. Last time I used it, I was pleasantly surprised that they didn't use android's screenshot prevention to stop you making a copy of the boarding pass. I took a screenshot as a backup in case I had issues with the app.
gkoz•2mo ago
> What happens if I lose my smartphone or tablet?

> If you have already checked-in online and your smartphone or tablet is lost, you will receive a free of charge boarding pass at the airport.

Seems pretty clear what we need to do to stop this nonsense.

jen20•2mo ago
Given that Ryanair used to charge to print a boarding pass at the airport, it seems pretty likely their response will just be to do so again. This is a company which literally hates its customers.
Simon_ORourke•2mo ago
I'm 100% certain the douche who runs Ryanair is extremely concerned about paper waste.
TheOtherHobbes•2mo ago
The last time I flew Ryanair their printed boarding pass didn't work in security.

Not even when I went back and got them to print it at the desk.

I did eventually get their app to download it, and it was fine in that.

So. There's that.

rkagerer•2mo ago
Was hoping you could opt out by moving to Morroco, where local regulations bar digital boarding passes. But Ryanair still makes you get digital ones there, and have you redeem it for a physical one at the airport.
jl6•2mo ago
Ryanair is best thought of, not as an airline, but as a kind of carnival game that delivers a small monetary prize if you win, and a nasty electric shock if you do it wrong. By playing Ryanair, you have the opportunity to acquire a slightly cheaper flight, and if you can keep a steady hand and navigate the arbitrary rules (each a cunning trap), you can indeed save some money. Good luck.
ninalanyon•2mo ago
So i can't fly with Ryanair unless I have smartphone.
ibejoeb•2mo ago
Note: You can print a boarding card at the kiosk or agent desk.
fortran77•2mo ago
My 92 year old mother will never be able to fly RyanAir. She is unable to use a cell phone.
bfkwlfkjf•2mo ago
Reminder what kind of company ryanair is. At one point some 15 (?) years ago ryanair used to charge you 60 euros if you showed up at the boarding gate having only the boarding pass on your phone instead of printed on a piece of paper. There was absolutely no reason for this (their reader reads as well from phone as from paper) other than betting that some fraction of the people would forget to print their boarding pass in paper. And they were right, I saw it in front of me many times and one time almost happened to me. If memory serves me I believe that at the time this was regulated out by the EU.
hdgvhicv•2mo ago
20 years ago Ryanair included free baggage - they started charging in 2006.
bfkwlfkjf•2mo ago
Ok but what you're describing is the classic "be cheaper than competition, gain market share, then raise prices" and is basically how business works. Almost every company does this if they are run well enough to manage to pull it off.

Setting up rules to trick customers to make mistakes and then demand 60 euros for printing a sheet of paper is morally dishonest and I would say most don't do this.

bfkwlfkjf•2mo ago
Here's another one. I read some headline years ago that the ryanair boss was happy to order as many 737 MAX as he could, despite the planes reputation for problems, because if you make the flights cheap enough, people will still fly on it.

I have no doubt he's right, but says something about him and the company.

extraduder_ire•2mo ago
They have a history of buying a lot of planes whenever there's a chance to get them cheaper. Typically, they sell planes for more than they cost to buy new.

For the 737 max at least, they built a simulator training facility in Dublin so they could train their pilots faster for when the max returned to flight.

I wouldn't take anything their CEO says at face value though. He's often saying provocative things just to get news coverage (cheaper and more effective than traditional advertising), and admits to that himself.

eqvinox•2mo ago
I specifically don't use smartphone boarding passes when travelling (on full service airlines, mostly LH group), just so they get the statistic of me using paper. (The barcode has an 'issue type' field, it's a single character and generally the only difference between digital QR and paper PDF417 contents.)

(I collect paper boarding passes and want them to stay ;)

dev_hugepages•2mo ago
God fucking damn it send me a PDF with a QR code like a reasonable human being
nunclieh•2mo ago
People who don't have a smartphone can ask Ryanair at the airport to print the boarding pass for free provided they did the online check-in.

I don't understand the reasoning here: how is this different than before? Why isn't this more costly for Ryanair?

lunias•2mo ago
Reminder to airlines ahead of move to more BS for your customers: You provide one of the most enshittified experiences ever conceived. I have been, and will continue avoiding flying at all costs until the customer is considered again.
rurban•2mo ago
This requires free USB loading stations at their gates. Do they provide these? I don't think so
wicharek•2mo ago
Lots of negativity in the comments. I however see no issue. I have been using digital boarding passes forever and have no idea why would I want a paper one ever.