Pickup trucks are great, but they're only available in "behemoth" size in the US.
Not all trucks are 1/4 or 1/2 ton in the USA.
There's things like the Honda Ridgeline, Hyundai Santa Cruze, and the Ford Maverick
Subaru had the Baja for a little white but they only sold a couple thousand per year.
Then compare this to something like a Kei truck and it's really quite pathetic.
I will forever be sad that Canoo was wildly (possibly fraudulently) mismanaged and went bust before they ever built any of their planned pickup trucks:
https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/canoo-pickup-tr...
They were going to be built on the same platform as their vans and the best way to describe them is "Kei truck upsized and uppowered enough to be safe on US roads." They had neat party tricks like a compact bed for daily driving that could expand out to fit full size ply and fold out workbenches on all four sides of the truck.
I'm not even a truck guy and I desperately wanted one of these things. Just such a cool concept.
Unless I'm missing something this sounds like the bed extenders which I've seen on lots of trucks that allow the tailgate to be used as part of the bed when folded down. I was initially think they might be allowing the passenger compartment to be opened up to temporarily get full bed size but I didn't see anything like that when browsing the page. The closest thing I ever saw to that was on the Subaru Baja (which was far more a sedan than a truck) and given how short the bed was and the the fact that the back window was immobile seemed like it had less hauling utility than a standard hatchback.
Our truck carries stuff a lot. Bags of feed, bales of hay, etc. But unless you want to stack it unreasonably high, 10 bales is about the limit. For big loads, it has to haul a trailer. If it were only a 2-seater, with a bigger bed, it could carry more, but that would mean that all we wouldn't be able to carry all the stuff that's typically in the back seats for safety or protection from the elements.
Like everything, it's a tradeoff.
A 2025 one can carry 7500 lbs of payload in the bed, and tow 37,090 lbs (some states require extra permits or licenses for that much)
All modern trucks can carry and tow WAY more than they used to.
and the 1/2 ton ones have dramatically impvoved mileage (the modern 3L diesels do about 29Mpg, and the gas ones turn off cylinders when crusing, and can do 20-25mpg when empty. My older small pickup (old ram Dakota) from the early 2000's got 15-16 on the highway.
I've owned a few pickups over the years, owned my house much of that time, and can probably county the times I've needed to move plywood or other oversized lumber on one hand. Add a second hand for times I've moved long pipes or other oversized stuff that required flagging.
Previous truck was to haul a race car on a trailer. Same fringe benefits for the camping shit, plus tools and spare parts for the race car (engines sometimes, wheels/tires, etc).
My electricians have pipe racks on their work vans, but if they’re buying 5,000 feet of 3/4” conduit (10’ sticks), you better believe a box truck will deliver it. If they need 40 feet for a quick service call, that’s what the pipe racks are for.
I agree with you though, the ability to move sheet goods flat in a truck bed is almost completely unnecessary.
If you really want to do this in a 5’ bed pickup, you can get a rack for above the cab and a crossbar with two posts that installs into the topper mounting holes near the tailgate to provide a 4’x8’ plane to carry sheet goods on. Here’s a universal example for $200, a nicer one meant for a specific truck is probably 3-4x more: https://wmastore.com/product/universal-drywall-plywood-mattr...
Even my 01 Forester will look big parked next to the OG Brat. Despite looking diminutive next to most modern vehicles here in Cali... It's super annoying how big ~everything on the road has become.
The Maverick, Santa Cruz, and the currently-vaporware Slate are much smaller.
I'm going through this now because I'm looking at upgrading from my ancient 2002 Tacoma Xtracab. Here's compared to 2025 models:
Vehicle Length Bed
---------------------------- -------- -----
2002 Toyota Tacoma (Xtracab) 202.9" 74.5"
2002 Toyota Tacoma (2Dr) 184.4" 74.5"
2025 Maverick 199.8" 54.4"
2025 Honda Ridgeline 210.2" 64.0"
2025 Hyundai Santa Cruz 195.7" 52.1"
2025 Toyota Tacoma Xtracab 213.0" 73.5"
My Tacoma wasn't even the shortest you could buy back then and it's still shorter than half of the "small" trucks you can buy today. And unlike those, my truck has a full 6' bed. A Maverick is shorter than mine, but the bed is also nearly two feet shorter. I honestly don't see the point of a bed that's less than five feet long. At that point, it's just an SUV with a trunk that isn't weather-sealed.Now, granted, it's not like you get nothing in return. These new vehicles (except the new Tacoma Xtracab) all have four doors and full-sized back seats. I can fit a kid in my jump seats but anyone older than that has a bad time. I'm sure they're safer for everyone in the truck too.
But if you really do want to prioritize bed size and still want a short vehicle, that option is just no longer well supported. I accept that my use case is probably a narrow one:
* Live in a dense city with a lot of parallel parking so don't want a long vehicle.
* Kayak fish a lot so want a long bed I can load a kayak in.
* Can get away with a two-seater because we can use my wife's car when there are passengers.
But it's definitely not as well served as it used to be. I'm probably going to end up with a short-bed Tacoma and rely on a bed extender to keep the kayak safe.
> People would be lining up around the block for your truck.
You're not lying. I'm the only owner and it's got barely over 100k miles on it. Every few years, I find a note on it from someone asking if I'm interested in selling.
The kids joke that I love that truck more than them.
It has been a really amazing vehicle and I've had a ton of fun in it. But I'd be lying if I didn't say that it would be nice to have, you know, anti-lock brakes and a back-up camera.
I love it so much that when it was stolen on a trip to Montreal a few years ago, I bought the exact same year and model again without even googling other options.
It is a bit longer than I'd prefer--I live in urban Chicago and occasionally do have to forgo a good parking space, but usually those are, like, Honda Civic spaces that a slightly smaller truck wouldn't fit into either.
Sure, the Maverick is kinda small. But and does fine for most people, but it's not really built like a truck. For some reason, I can't handle this thing, because it's replaced real small trucks. It's just an Escape under the covers, and nobody considers the Escape to be a workhorse. Yet, I can give the Baja a pass, because it was honest in the fact that it's a car with a bit of a utility bed.
With just two of us in the back, we'd have the chairs against the cab (like the Brat did). Riding backwards in a vehicle is surprisingly relaxing. You can't see the traffic ahead, so you have absolutely zero interest in where the car is going, how fast, how close, missing exits, etc. You're just cognitively out of that loop. Even as a normal passenger, even if we stay silent, we're all firing off those "back seat driver" neurons a bit.
But riding backwards, where it's all out of sight and out of mind, it's a noticeable reduction in that. On one trip, we're heading to the mountains, my friend and I in back of the truck. Suddenly, the truck is braking very hard. We, of course, have no idea what's happening. I said "Well, this is it, good knowing you." "Yup! You too!".
Obviously nothing happened, but it was a curious incident to say the least.
It answers the question, what if Framework made cars?
https://sherpaec.com/products/olympus (no affiliation)
> 2.0-liter boxer engine ... 670 horsepower and 680 lb-ft of torque
Those are V10 numbers coming from something the size you'd find in an econo-box.
Obviously unlike your Camry this thing is not going to do 300,000 KMs over its lifetime, and will be rebuilt frequently. This is the extreme end of the engineering tradeoff, and it's interesting to see what happens when the scale tips all the way over.
I'm a bit spoiled with the beefy 2.5 in my Mazda... Though it's still about 480 HP less than this beast ;)
The only exceptions I can think of are the Subaru Impreza WRX/STI, and the Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution.
None ever came near Japan’s gentlemen’s agreement of “276” hp.
The reason they stayed with smaller engines in Japan was because of taxes on displacement.
We've got locals pushing 1,200+ HP out of K24's in their civics.
Edit- though, its redline was about double this Brat's...
For those who are underestimating just how advanced Vermont Sports Car is, this should open up your eyes.
active aero seems silly on a truck-design but ehh
regarding cars I did enjoy this video (comparing C8, GT3, GTD)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw7tDXLyLVo
admittedly not much of a track guy currently
personally I drive a 2 liter 4 banger as well with a turbo, fastest I've gone so far is 150mph, next car I'm trying to get is a supercharged Lotus Exige in orange
I know if you want speed it's cheap with a Corvette C6
SilverElfin•2mo ago
bigyabai•2mo ago
I'm just going to pull the band-aid off, you're probably not the target audience for a drag-race sleeper rig.
squigz•2mo ago
If he wants to believe he's the target demo for a car that would immediately put him into a wall, let him!
wickedsight•2mo ago
linsomniac•2mo ago
Decades ago I had a buddy that did something similar with a VW Bug that he did "on the cheap" doing almost all the work himself and things like paint through connections he had, I never talked price on it but it was at least $30K I'd bet and probably more like in the $50Ks, and took around a decade.
hoofhearted•2mo ago
They build all the fast Subarus for everyone; Travis Prastana, Bucky Lasik, Ken Block, Lia Block.
The Huckster, the Project Midnight; all them too.
https://vtcar.com/
DebtDeflation•2mo ago
Grazester•2mo ago
Still very learnable but outside the scope of standard engine rebuilt stuff.
yourusername•2mo ago
If you're starting from 0 that's probably a decade long commitment before you're able to start to execute a project like this. There's a youtube series 'project binky' where a pair of professional car tuners rebuild a mini cooper and stuff a Celica engine in it. They already have all the skills, own a shop and all the tools and it still took them years.
spike021•2mo ago
jcgrillo•2mo ago
I've been working on cars for 20yr, I weld, I have done CAD/CAM/CAE stuff, rebuilt and modified engines, done custom suspension work... there are so many aspects of a project like this that are just completely unknown to me, like I wouldn't even know where to start. Many aspects of this build are not things you can really learn or research on your own.
VintageRobot•2mo ago
I had to fix the wiper system. The wiper system you would think it wouldn't matter much whether the parts are aftermarket or not. I was very wrong, parts that even look almost identical may not work properly, due to differences in tolerances.
There is also different revisions of particular parts and it will become obsolete. You can lose an afternoon on the internet just doing that.
Then there is the tools. I've spent about a small fortune on tools. I have 3 torque wrenches, 3 sets of sockets, 3 sets of spanners and loads of weird specialist tools like special pliers. There are many jobs I can't do myself because they needs specialist knowledge to do properly e.g. gearboxes.
You have to be prepared to spend potentially years on it and huge amount of money, even on relatively simple projects.
There is a reason that a lot of guys get into old 4x4 pickups and do those up, because they are a known quantity and parts are readily available.
lewiscollard•2mo ago
> You have to be prepared to spend potentially years on it and huge amount of money, even on relatively simple projects.
is not at all mutually exclusive to this:
> Honestly, just learn it like anything else.
I didn't really know what I was doing when I started my project. I had an idea and the desire to make it happen. I barely knew how to use a MIG to do the fab work, so I got good (enough) at it. I knew nothing about LS engines, so I learned enough about them at each point I needed to know something about them. I only have a vague idea of how I'm going to do the next phase of it; I know that I can figure it out with enough thinking and by making all the mistakes I need to make. I don't know how to TIG, and it'll be really useful if I do, so I am learning how to TIG.
Start somewhere, and the more you do, the more you can do.
VintageRobot•2mo ago
I have no idea why people do this stuff to a nice car like a Rover P5. It isn't my car though.
> Start somewhere, and the more you do, the more you can do.
Obviously. But I had to do a lot of stuff that I wasn't prepared to do far quicker because the previous person who doing this took short cuts. I almost had the dash catch fire because someone did a bodge job on electricals instead of paying £15 for the correct part (a plastic plug).
The point I was making is that you are making it sound far simpler than it actually is. There been a good few weekends that have been sunny and I have honestly felt like I was wasting my time and couldn't face working on it.
I had to fit a new turbo and it took me about 3-4 weeks. Not because it was difficult (actually it one of the easier and nicer jobs IMO), it was sourcing parts around the turbo such as gaskets, copper washer kits and other dumb stuff like that.
There was constant trips to tool shops because I was always missing like a tool, trying to find a fitting/gromit in Halfords (they never have it) or a parts supplier 40 miles away in the sticks. It all adds up in both time and cost.
Now I know roughly who the order from, what I should order from etc. But that is going to be different for almost different manufacturer and worse if the stuff is more niche/custom.
The amount of the projects that get given up, suggest it not that easy.
lewiscollard•2mo ago
I actually feel everything you have said apart from this P5 being "nice" (it was fucked). Like turbo delays - I had that on my other project, and going from "I need a new turbo" to "I have a new turbo and things adjacent to the turbo" took damn near a year by itself. I know how this goes!
So I hope I did not appear to say that it's EASY. I've put in enough hours to know that it's not, and if it was everyone would be doing it anyway. It does in fact take a lot of time, and willingness to learn, and plain old determination, and money. I will say it's something that IS possible, and that I still agree with this:
> Honestly, just learn it like anything else.
But...I suppose we'll know that for sure once I have an actual working car, right? :)
Grazester•2mo ago
bob1029•2mo ago
sandworm101•2mo ago
Reubachi•2mo ago
It has no cats, no EGR system, sequential trans etc etc.
To original OP of this question, this is closer to a racing speedboat than a race car. More expensive to own than a yacht assuming you want to run it
UniverseHacker•2mo ago
joncrane•2mo ago
The next level up would be to get a modified car from a company that has very strong ties to the manufacturer, such as Ruf with Porsche, Roush or Saleen with Ford Mustangs, etc.
Trust me either of those options will be more than anyone but the 1% top skilled or thrill seeking individuals can handle.
jcgrillo•2mo ago
Step 2: Start learning. If you don't know how to evaluate the work of your builder you may have a few false starts finding someone who can actually do it, which will cost you even more time and money.
Step 3: Learn some more. Owning a vehicle like this is a constant development effort. The work will never be "done" so unless you have a mechanic on retainer you will be working on it constantly.
In short, unless you have like a million dollars to spend on a toy and staff to keep it running you'll have to shoulder at least some of the effort.
lan321•2mo ago
Cons are you're getting someone else's project.
Pros are they've already sunk stupid money into it.
You can get great cars on there if you have someone in the know to bounce deals off of.
The best way with infinite money is either some very high end small batch restomod or to even commission one of the large OEMesque motorsport shops to plan and build a one off. Smaller, specialized shops are also an option but the amount of people who're learning on customer vehicles is high and they'll be so hyped to get a large project they'll promise you the moon with entirely good intentions and then fail spectacularly.
VintageRobot•2mo ago
You also wouldn't want one. They cannot be driven on the road really as they aren't legal. They will also break a lot. Generally the more tuned a car is the more maintenance it needs.
If you are interested in cars, you are better getting an older vehicle and somewhere to work on it e.g. a garage and working on it as a hobby at the weekends. You will learn a lot more and can actually enjoy it.
hoofhearted•2mo ago
Yes, price is a major factor.
No, you are completely incorrect on street legality; and way far from the truth lol
The basis of a WRC rally car is that it is indeed street legal; and is required to be driven on the public roads with a proper license plate in between the stages of the rally.
acejam•2mo ago
Rally cars also must be street legal because they are driven on public roads between stages.
RajT88•2mo ago