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Halt and Catch Fire: TV's Best Drama You've Probably Never Heard Of (2021)

https://www.sceneandheardnu.com/content/halt-and-catch-fire
162•walterbell•2h ago

Comments

IBCNU•1h ago
And as I understand it loosely based on the fantastic and seminal book Soul of a New Machine.

I had a great EM once who said I need to read it because nothing has changed in 40 years, and I keep a copy on my desk.

Touching as well, as it's on Joe MacMillan's desk in the final scene of third season.

What's so great about it is:

- mushroom theory of management works - trust new graduates and juniors to win by not understanding the possible - throw all the corporate bs away, just build - competing teams (skunk-works, vs roadmap team) works - real innovation is built by tinkerers, from the ground up, not top down

as a startup weirdo in the age of AI, who pines for the golden era (as they call it the golden prarie) i highly recommend this show!

LambdaComplex•1h ago
You just reminded me that I got about halfway through Soul of a New Machine. Maybe I'll pick it back up this week.
unmole•1h ago
> And as I understand it loosely based on the fantastic and seminal book Soul of a New Machine.

I've only watched the first season and really don't see the link to Soul of a New Machine.

tptacek•1h ago
Season 1 is Soul of a New Machine-ish, but about personal computing, not minicomputers, and is set in Texas.

Season 2 is roughly about BBSs and Compuserve, and still in Texas.

Season 3 is about the early commercial Internet, same characters, SFBA.

Season 4 is about the Yahoo era of the Internet and about venture capital, also SFBA.

ai_critic•19m ago
The problem with it is that it is ahistorical enough in the tech that some things just don't work. The show tackles stuff about like a decade before it was actually relevant in market, and that has subtle problems that give the business stuff an uncanny-valley feel. Still a fun drama though.
arscan•45m ago
My father was an unnamed DG marketing executive in the book, who joked that his greatest career regret was asking Kidder to be unnamed in case the book wasn’t any good (it won Kidder the Pulitzer). I’ve been meaning to go through his old notebooks, as he took detailed notes on everything, to see if there is anything left from that era.
IBCNU•32m ago
amazing lore!
danielvaughn•1h ago
Lee Pace's performance in that show is one of my all time favorites. It's incredibly hard to play a charismatic marketing guru because in some sense, you're not acting. In a given scene, the character might be trying to convince people around him of some crazy idea, but if he hasn't convinced you, the viewer, then the entire illusion falls apart. So he really has to do in real life what he's pretending to do on screen.

edit - a great example and one of my favorite scenes from the show: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XOR8mk0tLpc

IBCNU•1h ago
he reminds me of truly the best bosses

also something about him with a good engineer

reminds me of me and my boss, i hope lol

imglorp•1h ago
More recently, I loved how he killed it in Foundation. Another great casting for a great actor.
itsnowandnever•42m ago
foundation has an incredible cast but even among such talent he's a clear outlier
OneDeuxTriSeiGo•1h ago
Lee Pace is such a phenomenal actor. He really just transforms the roles he's in and makes something special out of each show he's in.

He's also fantastic in Apple TV's Foundation and it's been really impressive seeing his range put on display there.

idontwantthis•58m ago
He also stars in The Fall, one of my favorite movies ever.
prhn•36m ago
He also played Ronan in Guardians of the Galaxy and King Thranduil in Lord of the Rings!
swyx•16m ago
how dare you mention Lee Pace and -not- mention his role in Foundation, he carried that entire show on his way too muscley back
esafak•26m ago
Lee Pace is a first rate actor but I could not recognize him or indeed, most of the characters in this show, as representative of their roles. I struggled to suspend my disbelief. The show felt like it was written by people who imagined what it must have been like rather than people who had any experience of it. I still enjoyed it somewhat. Not Silicon Valley good but okay.
Slow_Hand•26m ago
Funny that this came up today. Last night I started re-watching the series after several years. Just this afternoon I was reflecting on how genuinely charismatic Lee Pace's Joe McMillen is.

You really feel it. Even when we know he's a manipulative sonuvabitch. It's mesmerizing. You have to admire his ability to spin shit into gold. The man has vision.

There's a sequence around S01E07 that I'm looking forward to reaching again, in which Joe is out on the front lawn with Donna's daughters during a hurricane and it's FEELS like magic. His performance feels earnest, and hypnotizing, and genuinely magical as he puts on a show for these young girls in the rain.

There's something intangible and hard to describe about the series. The writers have a way of making it transcend it's core drama and feel very different from just about any other show I can recall. Somehow it feels like pure creative expression that manages to defy outside expectations and tell a story that feels true to life and convey the ambitions of creative people who are fighting to make something beautiful.

metamet•5m ago
You're making me really want to start a rewatch.

It's shocking how few people have seen this show, let along watched it. Part of that probably has to do with how inaccessible it is on streaming. It's only readily available on AMC+. And no one has AMC+.

This is one of those shows that would likely shoot to the top if Netflix got the rights to it and even did a mild push. It's genuinely peak prestige TV.

hinkley•15m ago
Probably help him land Foundation. The narcissism is its own skill.
protocolture•14m ago
The guy gives me chills, he reminds me of every sales douche who has ever tried to pull the wool over my eyes, or sell a customer something so horrendous and undeliverable as to be actively business ending.

An absolute legendary performance.

seneca•8m ago
> The guy gives me chills, he reminds me of every sales douche who has ever tried to pull the wool over my eyes, or sell a customer something so horrendous and undeliverable as to be actively business ending.

The thing is, Joe is supposed to actually have substance and vision. He's not faking it. The difference is that all those sales guys are pretending to be someone like Joe.

leonflexo•1h ago
Great show and fantastic music. This show and Driver were two soundtracks that captured that early/mid 2010s vibe for me personally.
seneca•44m ago
Absolutely. One of those shows where I went to check what the songs were playing in specific scene often, and ended up with lots of new tracks added to play lists. Whoever did their music selection was top notch.
t1234s•1h ago
A great watch if you are nostalgic for the early BBS days or early WWW days. The post 2000 generation may not get it.
29athrowaway•1h ago
The first seasons were excellent, the latter seasons not so much.
1970-01-01•1h ago
Objectively it was consistently good but not great.

https://www.ratingraph.com/tv-shows/halt-and-catch-fire-rati...

29athrowaway•58m ago
The first season was the best season, and it's probably a good stopping point.
chucksmash•56m ago
Interesting. Different strokes I suppose. I loved this show but in the beginning they put too much emphasis on Lee Pace's character for my taste. Just kind of "ooooh, what will the brooding. mysterious maverick in a suit with a dark past do next? So unpredictable" and it didn't really resonate with me like the later seasons did.

In the same way that the beginning of Parks and Rec feels like they were setting out to make a version of The Office before it really became its own thing, the first season of HaCF felt like "what if we had a Don Draper type but instead it was Texas in the 80s?"

29athrowaway•53m ago
The latter seasons have memorable thought-provoking moments but they are sparse.

They could have compressed those into fewer episodes and it would have been more watchable.

tsunamifury•10m ago
You must be young.
tptacek•47m ago
Seasons 3 and 4 did a really good job of capturing what it was like being in the industry and in SFBA in the mid/late 1990s, better than anything I've seen. I worked at McAfee (then NETA) at the time and the MCAF-ish stuff was uncanny; the last gasp of cubicle culture in the software product industry.

I liked the storytelling in it, but, like I said earlier, it's pretty Six Feet Under-ish, in that as it progresses it is less and less about the original concept of the show and more about the relationships between characters built up over years of episodes. Whether that's a good or bad thing for you depends in part on how much fan service you want; it's why I find Mr. Robot completely unwatchable.

colinmegill•1h ago
So good
JSR_FDED•1h ago
This series is great at multiple levels:

- the archetype characters and their motivations to do what they do (100% valid today)

- struggles and exhilaration of startups

- as a pseudo-documentary of the early years of personal computing

Highly recommend it!

dvrp•1h ago
It’s great but it ain’t no Mr. Robot.
Sebguer•1h ago
One is a deeply human drama, the other is a spy thriller. Not sure why you'd even make the comparison.
TurdF3rguson•54m ago
I'm assuming Mr Robot is the spy thriller? It feels like more of a deeply human drama to me.
Sebguer•48m ago
You have a very different perception of 'human' than I do!
TurdF3rguson•31m ago
The main character suffers from DID. From trauma that happened when he was little. Maybe you didn't watch the whole thing, that seems pretty "human drama"-ey to me.
chucksmash•47m ago
They ran contemporaneously and tended to come up on the same lunch table conversations.
lotsofpulp•1h ago
I couldn’t get past all the drug scenes in Mr Robot.
hola-tamale•1h ago
Fantastic show! Just wrote an analysis of the conflicts between the characters and how every disagreement turns into a zero sum game:

https://gilpignol.substack.com/p/halt-and-catch-fire-the-tra...

IBCNU•54m ago
love how deep you go
airstrike•34m ago
it's slop
hola-tamale•13m ago
Sorry you didn't like it. I can assure you it describes real battle scars from startups. Good luck with inboard!
hola-tamale•25m ago
Thanks it's an attempt to describe interactions observed in startups, which the show portrays so well
gnabgib•7m ago
Looks like @light_triad's blog.. new account?
brightball•1h ago
My dad kept trying to get me to watch this show and I never got around to it. Maybe I need to.
tptacek•1h ago
It's quite good, but it gets very Six Feet Under by the end, and you have to suspend a lot of disbelief about technology; it's a little like Hackers in the sense that it's trying to communicate a feeling about operating in specific eras of computing, but not so much trying to realistically depict what it was like.

Christopher Cantwell, the showrunner, is also doing the new series of The Terror (aka North Pole Bear Show) that's premiering this year.

tsunamifury•14m ago
Hard disagree. The number of micro details it got right was insane. You’d have to be pedantic to think otherwise.

Right down to obscure LucasArts first online game.

DrFunke•1h ago
Season 1 was wonderful. The showrunner had initially written the pilot to get a job on Mad Men. It was eviscerated by critics for being too male, too masculine and seasons 2 onward pivoted into a girlboss series with Lee Pace's character taking a backseat and Scooter's character becoming a stay at home house husband. But if you like Breaking Bad and Sopranos, S1 is very well written.
wmf•1h ago
I always thought Joe MacMillan was Don Draper with a little Steve Jobs so that explains it.
seneca•49m ago
Strongly agree that Season 1 was by far the best, and the rest suffered for the changes.
Apocryphon•12m ago
S2 had a far more memorable depiction of hacker startups as we know it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJN2JN3_N_4

vesrah•1h ago
This is one of those shows I've had in the rolling background rewatch queue for years, I love it and I try to recommend it to as many people as possible. Flawed, yes, but still special.
IBCNU•52m ago
I like how in the fourth season, the computer props are literally just cardboard boxes.

I like literally love it, not ironically, it makes it more like a stage play.

Feel like the flaws are what makes it special. I don't want Kubrick for a tv show about BBS'

dzink•1h ago
Yes, hands down the best show! They need to do more seasons, especially with modern day problems.

Other thoughtful and well made shows: Dark Matter, For All Mankind, Foundation (also Lee Pace and also stellar).

hsbauauvhabzb•1h ago
> They need to do more seasons, especially with modern day problems.

Silicon Valley, the insanity that it’s both a comedy and true to life

airstrike•35m ago
I think you might enjoy Travelers
bane•1h ago
It starts as a kind of okay near-real alternate history of early computing in the Silicon Prairie, and ends with some really powerful storytelling about the fragility of humanity.

Totally worth a watch.

3abiton•47m ago
It captured a bit the feeling of being at the start of the computer boom in 60s-70s. The partnernship between the 2 male protagonists was central till the end of show (evolving through different phases). The show was great, it went in very unexpected directions later on.
ppcdeveloper•1h ago
This is on my bucket list to finish. Watched one or two episodes and it reminded me of a dead serious Silicon Valley.
don_neufeld•54m ago
One of my all time favorite series - add my upvote to the pile!
donatj•53m ago
I genuinely enjoyed it and do recommend. As another commenter mentioned, Lee Pace's performance is stand out.

My only real critique is that it has the same problem as Mr. Robot. The writers and script are clearly very tech-literate, but the spoken lines are stilted and awkwardly delivered with odd intonation because the actors clearly have no understanding of what the words they're saying mean.

afspear•49m ago
The opening of this show feels very relevant today. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucSUs3adMQ8
caycecan•41m ago
One of the better CG title sequences. They don't belabour it, get the visual concept across and wham! Show starts.
Slow_Hand•22m ago
Yeah. I'll watch it every time.
seneca•47m ago
I thought Halt and Catch Fire was fairly well known, especially in the tech world.

Season 1 was absolutely killer. I like that they tried to capture different eras per season, but subsequent seasons got progressively weaker.

I still think Gordon's final scene is one of the best pieces of writing in TV drama history. Took my breath away the first time I saw it.

segmondy•45m ago
It's fairly well known to some of us. It's one of the few shows I own DVDs of.
brcmthrowaway•46m ago
How does it compare to The Americans?
seneca•39m ago
They have essentially nothing in common, other than the fact that both rapidly degrade over the seasons and both are nostalgic looks back at recent eras of America.
et-al•24m ago
The Americans is an easier watch in general because of its themes, but H+CF is worth viewing for anyone in tech.

There's only four seasons and they're all solid.

kqr2•41m ago
Syllabus:

https://bits.ashleyblewer.com/halt-and-catch-fire-syllabus/

TheAtomic•36m ago
LOVE H&CF, so good
aresant•35m ago
It's a tech story wrapped in a soap opera wrapped in one of the all time finest soundtracks ever played by an incredible group of actors and written by artists - it is singular!

PS - Christopher Cantwell - one of the writers and showrunners - has written a library of wonderful comic books worth investigating

PPS - ATX TV did a 10 year anniversary interview with a handful of the cast and crew that's worth watching if you're a fan - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6L1suN-mGE

AnishLaddha•29m ago
one of my favorite shows of all time!
ChrisArchitect•26m ago
The best. Not unheard of around here. (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45007414)

This article? Not so much. Is OP one of the one's discovering it?

durakot•19m ago
Yeah this is a gem of a show worth a rewatch every few years. Especially once it finds its legs after S1. Criminally underrated.
tsunamifury•16m ago
The show captured the sublime transcendence of ambitious failure like no other form of art ever has.

It is an all timer.

SparkyMcUnicorn•4m ago
[delayed]

Halt and Catch Fire: TV's Best Drama You've Probably Never Heard Of (2021)

https://www.sceneandheardnu.com/content/halt-and-catch-fire
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