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Stop sending me huge PRs; a rant

https://getsmall.xyz/post/cmstjfl9l000if70ljmpzr4va
29•trezm•1h ago

Comments

ventana•1h ago
Just an idea which I haven't personally tried: AI agents understand technical limitations, such as CI failures. Maybe make a CI job which checks that a PR has a reasonable size, and auto-reject with a polite message if it's not? Something like, "This PR size exceeds the limit of N lines that we accept for review; if you implement a big feature please consider splitting it in several smaller PRs." There are chances that it won't help, but it might!
striking•47m ago
Yeah, that's a fun way to get massive stacks of PRs that are individually incomprehensible.
t-writescode•20m ago
How? If one PR builds off another, won’t either:

  PR 1 is size 400
  PR 2 is size 400 + 400 new
  PR 3 is size 800 + 400 new
If they’re truly disjoint, would it be so bad to get them as unique? Because otherwise, when PRs depend on each other, you tend to get “one and then one and then one”.

At least that’s how it’s worked on teams I’ve worked on that have soft size limits.

wiml•16m ago
Then reject them for being incomprehensible?

Look, if you don't think code review is worthwhile, don't do it. Just give everybody unfettered permission to merge. But don't pretend to do review if you're not trying to maintain some standard of quality.

ok_computer•20m ago
That message could also be generated by a PR line count rule and string replacement without the ai overhead.

Edit - apologies I misunderstood which side the ai agent should be on.

esafak•37m ago
A simple solution might be to use a git hook that asks for confirmation if it is too big, with a suggestion to ask the user to have the agent split it up.
hahahaa•19m ago
Yes could be a pipe failure. Commonly used for coverage or security concerns, it could be also used for PR size.
stackskipton•25m ago
I know someone working on a smaller open source who has same thing. They have considered just blocking all PRs outside known contributors because AI spam even on their tiny open source project is too much.

At work, I've gotten into fights about PR approvals. If they are beyond us humans to review, screw it, remove the approver requirement and if CI passes, merge it.

throwatdem12311•11m ago
CI by itself is not got enough because LLMs are extremely good at writing vacuous tests that don’t actually test anything but look like the test something.

Even worse: they can write tests that make incorrect behavior part of your spec.

Tests matter.

Writing tests can be hard, boring, tedious. But if anything should still be written by hand in the age of LLMs it’s the tests. If you’re not looking at the application code anymore, you should at least be going over the tests with a fine toothed comb.

stackskipton•6m ago
It's all we got at this point. Even as SRE, I just got 2000-line Golang change to something I think should be 150. However, the boss is already bouncing around happy we are going to deliver something that's been in Jira backlog for 9 months.
gensym•21m ago
> why did you put it up for a human review at all then?

This seems to be the crux of the issue.

I'm guessing the most of the time, the answer is "because that's a mandatory gate to getting these changes into production". If the PR author doesn't see the value in review, it's going to be hard to convince them to write reviewable PRs.

If they're actually looking for human feedback, telling them how to submit PRs in a way that's amenable to human feedback is going to be a lot more successful.

danpalmer•20m ago
In my experience the models perform substantially worse if asked to create small PRs or commits. They lack the ability to sequence work and understand dependencies efficiently enough to manage it – it's not that they can't do small PRs, it's that doing them takes vastly more resources which then hits context limits etc. And if you want to then go back and edit a stack of commits or PRs, rebasing work into the middle, that's even more. I don't think any of this scales linearly in the amount of code or number of commits.

This is all in addition to the fact that the models are generally poor at storytelling, because that requires a theory of mind of the person you're communicating with. Authoring for review is storytelling, it's making changes in such a way as to build confidence in the reviewer. I believe current LLMs are still years away from this.

In my opinion, if you can't do these things, you're just cosplaying software engineering. Vibe coding has its uses, as does LLM programming, I do a lot of this! But we're kidding ourselves and dropping our standards dangerously low if we think that this is software engineering.

t-writescode•16m ago
I mean, sometimes I don’t know how I want to write something until I’m finished. Huge refactors are often like this.

So, just like you said, rewrite the whole thing, THEN break it apart into bite size chunks that tell the story and feed it to others with acceptable and reasonable context.

It’s a skill that engineers need, and it pays dividends to all on the team, including you, when your coworkers ALSO start doing this back to you and you’re asked to review it.

usewik•16m ago
Agreed. Asking for small PRs or commits can backfire, unless the work is deliberately scoped into smaller pieces from the beginning. This requires a human design review and planning and is one of the reasons I don't outsource that part to an agent.
usewik•18m ago
> If your variable is not named well and you need a comment, name your variable better.

100% agree. While you are at it, consider naming and writing your functions in such a way that doesn't require a wall of comments. Clean Code uncle Bob style.

t-writescode•8m ago
Indeed. If you’re going to have an essay on top of a function or anywhere in code, earn the essay. That code better be operating on a ton of assumptions or using some creative logic to get to how it is that a simple reading doesn’t make sense.

I’ve done it myself on:

* engine definitions for complex workflows and DSLs

* heavy graph theory sections that included ASCII diagrams to clarify flow.

But those functions are probably 1 in 100 or rarer. Basically everything else is good enough with basic IDE-helping javadoc style comments at best, maybe with some input parameter clarification and business logic-clarifying 1-2 line comments sprinkled throughout.

bawolff•9m ago
>I'm tired boss. I'm tired of reviewing one, two, three thousand line PRs because some agent was able to "one shot the whole issue." Small PRs were never asked for because they're easier to write, it's always been for the benefit of the reviewer.

100%

but also "no" is a two letter word and one of the most important and hardest parts of being a maintainer.

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