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I Changed My License

https://bergie.iki.fi/blog/eupl/
24•jllyhill•37m ago

Comments

jruohonen•31m ago
CC BY-NC-ND is what I'm also increasingly using (for non-code), though not always, and disheartenedly. (And as commented, the non-code context is different.)
hypfer•7m ago
ND is usually a bit sad, as it makes the thing a dead-end.

The magic of the web has always been that things would continuously morph through being reinterpreted and all, and that just doesn't happen with ND.

I can of course see the valid reasons why one would pick that license, but it's still.. kinda sad that it's culturally dead.

jruohonen•4m ago
True enough; philosophically, I am still in the BY camp (a.k.a. BSD/MIT/etc.), and I do not particularly care about the NC part, but ND is increasingly important for non-code. But if they could do even the BY properly, it would be a step to the right direction (and, to some extent, I think they're doing that).
hypfer•3m ago
Huh. Can you elaborate why you view ND as increasingly important, whereas NC bothers you less?

Because for me, it would be the exact other way round.

ghaff•6m ago
The problem is that not even Creative Commons was able to come up with a real definition for non-commercial when they last (I think) revised the license. Essentially it means trivial uses (a photo in a grade school assignment) or its contentious in a way that reasonable people can disagree about. What constitutes acceptable usage of a properly attributed photo? Personally, I just properly attribute and stopped worry about whether most presentations constituted commercial use or not.
LoganDark•26m ago
I don't like the phrasing of the EUPL because it says you have rights full stop and then in a later section it says there are actually conditions. For that reason I would not immediately be sure the conditions are even enforceable, other than "this was surely made by lawyers and therefore also surely valid".

Aside from that, it is nice to see Communication counted alongside Distribution; this should have been done from the start IMO.

jraph•16m ago
> I don't like the phrasing of the EUPL because it says you have rights full stop and then in a later section it says there are actually conditions. For that reason I would not immediately be sure the conditions are even enforceable.

Full right to use no conditions ≠ full right on what you can do with the code

LoganDark•1m ago

    2. Scope of the rights granted by the Licence
    
    The Licensor hereby grants You a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive,
    sublicensable licence to do the following, for the duration of copyright vested
    in the Original Work:
    
    - use the Work in any circumstance and for all usage,
    - reproduce the Work,
    - modify the Work, and make Derivative Works based upon the Work,
    - communicate to the public, including the right to make available or display
      the Work or copies thereof to the public and perform publicly, as the case may
      be, the Work,
    - distribute the Work or copies thereof,
    - lend and rent the Work or copies thereof,
    - sublicense rights in the Work or copies thereof.
    
    Those rights can be exercised on any media, supports and formats, whether now
    known or later invented, as far as the applicable law permits so.
    
    In the countries where moral rights apply, the Licensor waives his right to
    exercise his moral right to the extent allowed by law in order to make effective
    the licence of the economic rights here above listed.
    
    The Licensor grants to the Licensee royalty-free, non-exclusive usage rights to
    any patents held by the Licensor, to the extent necessary to make use of the
    rights granted on the Work under this Licence.
This is a lot more rights than just to use and there is absolutely nothing about conditions in the entire section. You don't get any hint of conditions until three sections later where it starts modifying section 2, which feels sloppy to me.
amazingamazing•18m ago
Do these types of things really matter anymore? If you have tokens, given the source is available pretty easy to reimplement with plausible deniability.
Joel_Mckay•10m ago
As much as I dislike isomorphic plagiarism, your point is very valid...

It is a viable argument, and people shouldn't bury such insights given the estimated $9Tn worth of opensource work that was appropriated. =3

ChocolateGod•9m ago
[delayed]
andxor•9m ago
It's a quixotic crusade, in perfect European style.
KronisLV•5m ago
https://malus.sh/ (I think it was intended to be satire/critique)
Joel_Mckay•13m ago
For FOSS I personally prefer Apache 2.0 license, as 10 years from now I have no idea what people will need for their projects.

Personally, it makes me happy if people can make a business using a bit of my work. Just don't redirect commercial support tickets onto community projects, or get neglected customers to contact authors.

The way I see it... is symbiotic commercial relationships are important, as people can get their time sponsored to work on FOSS code. Also, having community projects form reliable long term infrastructure opens additional opportunity for people to work with FOSS options.

Telling people how they should have fun is always lame... whether it is Sony/Microsoft... or just some disillusioned dude convinced their work won't be obfuscated by an LLM in 30 seconds. =3

dotancohen•12m ago
This article would do better if it simply enumerated the problems with the LGPL and addressed how this new license which I've never heard of addresses those problems. This hinting and alluding might make great SEO, but that's fit for neither the audience of people producing software, nor for HN.
KronisLV•10m ago
Here's the license text if someone wants to do the work: https://spdx.org/licenses/EUPL-1.2.html#licenseText
LoganDark•6m ago
This is the actual license text, in English: https://interoperable-europe.ec.europa.eu/sites/default/file...

Other languages can be found here: https://interoperable-europe.ec.europa.eu/collection/eupl/eu...

LoganDark•4m ago
The article seems pretty clear that the LGPL is too weak compared to the EUPL for this author, and one of the main concerns is "SaaS loophole" which I assume would be addressed by the AGPL but also seems addressed by the EUPL.
mnahkies•8m ago
What are people's thoughts/experiences about dual licencing?

Eg: is there a clean way to dual license such that hobbyist, and exploratory work (eg: a proof of concept done in a commercial setting) are allowed, but using it in production requires a fee?

If you've done this, has it been successful? Obviously there's been many projects relicense over recent years (terraform, redis, etc) - but it's less clear to me if this is a viable path for new projects starting out, or if it just kills adoption from the beginning.

ricardobeat•8m ago
> We won the debate, and gained little for users or developers. All that our efforts did was to make it easier for big corporations build things more cheaply and for billionaires to become trillionaires.

As a long-time developer and consumer of OSS I don't agree with this at all. Open-source software has had an enormous effect on the world, and that... was kind of the point? When we licensed things as MIT we knew that corporations would use it. We wanted them to it. There was no expectation of turning your late-afternoon JS framework into a business, this is a very modern mindset.

LtWorf•3m ago
But why should I work for free so that companies can fire my fellow human beings?
BlackRabbit1•8m ago
For hardware/electronics I also recommend looking at the CERN OHL licenses.

They cover a very specific niche GPL/AGPL/etc. do not cover properly.

charcircuit•7m ago
>All that our efforts did was to make it easier for big corporations build things more cheaply and for billionaires to become trillionaires.

This is not true. Open source is fundamental to how easy users can create software in the LLM era. Users and developers have gained tremendous value. Saying they have gained little is simply false. And it's a good thing to make it possible for big corporations to make things cheaper. It means more efficient resource allocation for society. And for billionaires to turn into trillionaire they have to provide magnitudes more value to society in order to do so. Enabling people to provide trillions of dollars of value to society is a good thing that open source unlocks.

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218•mpweiher•3h ago•36 comments

I Changed My License

https://bergie.iki.fi/blog/eupl/
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