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Gemini 4 Carbon

https://blog.google/innovation-and-ai/models-and-research/gemini-models/introducing-gemini-4-carbon/
336•acossta•1h ago•263 comments

CNC Stone Carving

https://carmelitegothic.com/cnc-stone-carving/
235•bschne•3h ago•79 comments

MacBook Pro with PROLED XDR Display and Touch

https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/proled-xdr-display/
195•etothet•1h ago•298 comments

Dayjob: Tax – evaluating AI agents on 50 professional tax assignments

https://surgehq.ai/blog/dayjob-tax
83•landonxi•2h ago•49 comments

Mac Studio M5 Ultra 512GB Officially Released

https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/mac-studio
32•nsagent•56m ago•27 comments

Show HN: SlideBySide – Present slides without sharing your screen

https://slidebyside.com/
12•denismenace•1h ago•5 comments

The Grid, a factory-scale robot in Massachusetts that builds PCBs on demand

https://www.circuithub.com/post/unveiling-the-grid
279•seddona•2d ago•121 comments

Start Doing Graph Theory

https://vertex.degree/
419•ibobev•5d ago•98 comments

Converge (YC S23) Is Hiring a Founding Platform Engineer

https://www.runconverge.com/careers/founding-platform-engineer
1•thomashlvt•1h ago

AlpineBSD

https://wiki.alpinebsd.org
75•bradley_taunt•3h ago•63 comments

Apple's git still trusts the compromised eMudhra certificates

https://emudhra.we-have-a-problem.com/apple.html
839•galadran•7h ago•329 comments

Fine-tuned Qwen on my 16gb GPU to respond without the letter e

https://kevin-wu.ca/blog/qwn/
20•k33wu•3d ago•4 comments

Gaussian Splats part 3: There's always a bigger scene

https://www.magnopus.com/blog/gaussiansplats-part-3-theres-always-a-bigger-scene
56•ibobev•5d ago•11 comments

Emacs Turns 50

https://www.technologyreview.com/2026/10/20/1145399/emacs-turns-50/
258•internet_points•4h ago•108 comments

The Agent SDK

https://cursor.com/blog/agent-sdk
49•torutofu•4h ago•60 comments

Regent's Ground-Effect Vehicle Reimagines Coastal Travel

https://spectrum.ieee.org/ground-effect-vehicle
19•rbanffy•3d ago•7 comments

From confession to conspiracy: How the Wedgewood fake polls story spread

https://www.cip.uw.edu/2026/10/23/from-confession-to-conspiracy-how-the-wedgewood-fake-polls-stor...
40•croes•4d ago•26 comments

Git for the US Code

https://lexifina.com/blog/git-for-the-us-code
389•alansaber•16h ago•202 comments

Kentucky man becomes the first humanist granted religious exemption from AI

https://religionnews.com/2026/10/26/in-a-first-a-humanist-granted-a-religious-exemption-from-usin...
290•danso•4h ago•338 comments

Ink droplets in motion snag top prize in Nikon Small World contest

https://arstechnica.com/science/2026/10/meet-the-2026-winner-of-nikons-small-world-photomicrograp...
360•_Microft•2d ago•67 comments

Why Is This Fingerprinting Script Creating Bioweapons?

https://nullpt.rs/fingerprinting-bioweapons
8•hazebooth•1h ago•0 comments

Archive.today links going forward

https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/1xhf6qp/archivetoday_links_going_forward/
96•consumer451•2h ago•55 comments

Survival LLM: AI assistant and emergency library that runs on your own computer

https://www.brangus.io/survival-llm
486•Luc•22h ago•182 comments

Executable Archaeology: Reanimating the Heuristic Compiler (1961) and KBEmacs (1984)

https://arxiv.org/abs/2610.36341
6•abrax3141•16h ago•0 comments

US agency approves Amazon Leo’s $11.5B acquisition of Globalstar

https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/us-agency-approves-amazon-leos-115-billion-acquisi...
187•noptd•6h ago•91 comments

Decompiling Fast Food Tycoon 2: Drawing the World

https://healeycodes.com/decompiling-fast-food-tycoon-2-drawing-the-world
152•healeycodes•3d ago•30 comments

Early progress on accelerating drug development with Claude

https://www.anthropic.com/research/early-progress-drug-development
304•dataking•21h ago•295 comments

Tailscale SSH: Investigation and remediation update

https://tailscale.com/ssh-investigation-update
351•figmert•22h ago•179 comments

Nvidia Nemotron 3.5 Transcribe: open ASR for 40 languages

https://huggingface.co/blog/nvidia/nemotron-transcribe-granary
38•wondersky•2h ago•5 comments

Code-execution flaw in UEFI firmware threatens most servers on planet Earth

https://arstechnica.com/security/2026/10/code-execution-flaw-in-uefi-firmware-threatens-most-serv...
275•DamnInteresting•21h ago•170 comments
Open in hackernews

MacBook Pro with PROLED XDR Display and Touch

https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/proled-xdr-display/
194•etothet•1h ago
https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2026/10/apple-unveils-groundb...

Comments

mixtureoftakes•1h ago
M5 chips instead of m6 are SO DISAPPOINTING! looks like a good laptop otherwise though
dkindler•1h ago
M5 pro or max which is better than the m6. There is no m6 pro/max
NewsaHackO•59m ago
But I assume they are planned/developed at this point, why not release it with the new Pro?
otterley•55m ago
Historically speaking, the Pro/Max versions of the chips have become available at around the same time the next-generation base chip does. So, M4 Pro/Max shipped when M5 shipped, M5 Pro/Max shipped when M6 shipped, and so forth.
NewsaHackO•52m ago
OK, didn't realize that. Makes sense, I guess. Was holding out on buying a new laptop since May for this, definitely not going to wait another year.
GeekyBear•49m ago
The M7 generation is said to be another huge advance on local LLM performance, so Apple is skipping the M6 Pro and M6 Max to bring out the M7 generation early.
tschellenbach•1h ago
no point in upgrading from m3 max atm. (it seems)
mattrighetti•1h ago
Am I the only one that has never ever felt the need to have a touch screen display on my Mac?

EDIT: I already can’t stand when people touch my display just to point at something, I definitely don’t want my own oily fingerprints smeared all over a screen I spend all day looking at.

egypturnash•1h ago
Nope. Never had any desire for one.
dcss_gardener•1h ago
You're going to get a ton of affirmatives but remember this is also the forum that considers removable batteries one of the most important smartphone features. Our opinions about consumer tech are outliers.
karpovv-boris•1h ago
especially with the same lid angle. Look at the pictures, they didn't even know how people use touchscreen on the laptops, it's funny
jeroenhd•59m ago
Touch screens on laptops are a bit like 4k screens or >60Hz screens. You don't expect to get much out of them, but once you're used to them, going back is annoying.

Everything from my watch to my printer has a touch screen, it's kind of strange how long Apple has held out, especially with the ultra expensive market they target with their laptops.

akamaka•56m ago
Mongoose•1h ago
Fully willing to accept that I could be an outlier, but I have never understood how a market exists for laptops with touch screens.
apocalyptic0n3•56m ago
I had one for work a while back that could turn around so the screen faced upward while closed, effectively making it a bulky/heavy tablet. It was convenient for walking over to someone desk and discussing a topic. But it wasn't ground breaking enough for me to ever seek something out like it again. I rarely even open my laptop these days unless I'm in a conference room.
causal•54m ago
Kids expect all screens to be touch ready. Chromebooks they learn on in schools are touchscreen. It will be a competitive requirement before long, I think.
Louisgaga59•39m ago
I agree with you. When I show things to my kids on my laptop, they instantly try to play with the content by touching the screen.
hirvi74•29m ago
While true, I do not believe kids are the intended market for a laptop in which the entry model starts near $3k USD.
droidjj•50m ago
I used to work regularly on a commuter train with a firm-provided touchscreen ThinkPad. The touchscreen was great on the train because it was faster (for many things) than reaching for the trackpad. And when you're in a sort of cramped sitting position, reaching forward feels natural.

I'm a lawyer by trade and am forced to lean on GUIs with little keyboard-control support. When I code (for pleasure), I don't miss the touchscreen, but I often miss it when I'm trying to read PDFs and Word documents on the go.

georgel•1h ago
Glowing logo is back!
pat2man•1h ago
worth the $3k right here
LoganDark•55m ago
Oh my god yes!!
whycome•1h ago
My god they finally did it. After all the fears of canibalizing iPad sales and gorilla arms. An Apple touchscreen MacBook.

Absurd it took this long when they basically led the field in touchscreen innovation (especially on the UX side of things)

I always thought the Surface Book design by Microsoft was very Apple like and it always seemed like the logical step: let the screen detach but keep the extra horsepower in the base.

mepian•1h ago
Does it support the Pencil?
cmckn•1h ago
$3400 for the base model 16”, 24GB/1TB. $2900 for the 14”. Quite steep.
djanogo•59m ago
$4950 for Max, Nano Texture 36GB/2TB - This is getting ridiculous.
gtm1260•53m ago
Seriously. I paid 3400 for my M3 Max 128GB macbook in 2023. Sad times.
KingFelix•34m ago
are you still on the same macbook? Im using the same config and its running solid, note from above is true on the darker colored version, getting some color changes, but its still a beast of a machine.
sunaookami•27m ago
Not the poster but I'm also still using my M1 Max 32 GB RAM Macbook bought at the end of 2022 (yes, just right before the M2 Max...) and see no reason to buy another. Also paid 3400 (euros).
Aurornis•8m ago
> I paid 3400 for my M3 Max 128GB macbook in 2023

A 16" M3 Max with 128GB of RAM and no other upgrades would have been $5000 at launch.

They started shipping at the end of 2023, so you couldn't have bought a refurb.

Either you're remembering the price wrong or you got a crazy deal.

mabunday•1h ago
Is there any reason this wouldn't work with an apple pencil too?
CooCooCaCha•1h ago
I think if they did support Apple Pencil they’d have used that as a selling point.
CooCooCaCha•1h ago
As someone who does coding and art, I’m disappointed that there’s no Apple Pencil support. Makes touch feel more like a gimmick.
allenu•1h ago
The touch screen is such a silly idea here. It even looks ridiculous in their own marketing photos. [1] The keyboard and track pad are already a great combo for getting things done.

I don't get why they're doing this other than making another step towards unifying iOS and macOS (and visionOS?).

[1] https://mastodon.social/@allenu/117519656286195439

ajay-b•1h ago
I could see it with tablet but reaching out to touch my laptop, or worse desktop, screen would get very tiring, very quickly.
allenu•55m ago
I agree. The ergonomics of using a touch screen on a laptop screen aren't great. It only really works if you convert it to a tablet so that the screen is closer to you and angled up a bit for comfort, but it's no longer a laptop, so why bother?
nomel•50m ago
If the screen could fold all the way back, old school convertible style, I would see the point.
SirMaster•45m ago
I mean it seems like a good idea to me for mobile app development, being able to touchscreen the simulator.
giwook•
aaomidi•1h ago
Cellular?
codys•1h ago
Apparently no Apple Pencil support (not mentioned in their press release or on the sale page)
minimaxir•59m ago
This bullet point is funny:

> Draw. Sketch and annotate directly onscreen.

asdff•32m ago
I always wanted to fingerpaint my notes
chrisfosterelli•1h ago
I have never wanted to touch my laptop screen or felt any sort of desire to do so. In fact I try really hard not to touch it so that I don't get smudges on it.

The laptop touch screen always felt like an awkward use case to me because the ideal UX for touch and KBM are so different. If you're designing for use on laptop/desktop you need to design for KBM-first -- since the majority of devices will be -- and therefore the touch experience suffers, and users with a touchscreen just use the KBM.

I don't think the average consumer cares that much about this either. I've noticed my grandparents often buy laptops with touchscreens accidentally and then proceed to mostly interact with it by accident.

Part of me wants to believe that a company like apple must/would do this right if they were going to do it but on the other hand there's the whole touch bar debacle and it doesn't seem like their foldable phone is starting off with the best reviews either.

mattrighetti•54m ago
> In fact I try really hard not to touch it so that I don't get smudges on it.

Glad I'm not alone. Unfortunately every week I have to clean it from dust and also smudges that gets passed from the keyboard when you close the lid.

jonah•49m ago
Get a custom-made cloth or use a thin microfiber like a lens cleaning cloth and put it between the keyboard and screen. Whenever you close the computer. Keeps the smudges off and prevents key shaped wear marks in your display.
mason55•51m ago
> The laptop touch screen always felt like an awkward use case to me because the ideal UX for touch and KBM are so different

Which is why I think it makes sense for certain things where you can update the experience to be enhanced for touch but not, like, daily email & web browsing. But those things that will do well with touch do seem to align with the creative side of Apple's market - things like manipulating 3D objects, moving audio tracks around, that kind of stuff, if the interface is re-thought for a touch experience then I think there's a lot there.

Certainly there are times, even just basic things like looking at pictures, where I wish I could touch my monitor like it was a tablet.

I don't want to try to tap a link on a desktop rendered website, a mouse is more precise for that kind of thing, but I can imagine a lot of use cases that will improve if you assume that a large subset of your users has some kind of touch device.

minimaxir•1h ago
Their demo example for the touch interface is piano keys? That's a 2010 Scott Forstall level of skeuomorphism that doesn't translate well for a laptop screen because it's not convenient.
AndroidKitKat•54m ago
The hands are also almost in the exact same image Steve Jobs had on a slide during the iPad keynote showing touch on a laptop is not ergonomic. It's poetic, almost.
gizajob•52m ago
Soon, if they attach an alternator to Steve’s coffin, they’ll be able to run the Apple campus off it.
lysace•51m ago
"We've done tons of user testing on this, and it turns out it doesn't work," Jobs said at the company's "Back to the Mac" event in 2010. "Touch surfaces don't want to be vertical. It gives great demo but after a short period of time, you start to fatigue and after an extended period of time, your arm wants to fall off," Jobs continued. "It doesn't work, it's ergonomically terrible."

https://tech.yahoo.com/ai/apple-intelligence/articles/ergono...

benoau•45m ago
That was looking at it as a usability problem.

Now it's a "how will you still need an iPad" problem, that they have solved perfectly because it's a usability problem.

ecommerceguy•1h ago
If i wanted a touch screen mb air, id get an ipad. i will actively avoid these. apple has been dropping the ball big time lately. ive noticed siri has a 5 second delay on my phone now, making reminder setting not so easy.

is graphene os ready for primetime yet?

jasonvorhe•44m ago
Has been for a whole. Don't get a Pixel 11 though or wait for the new Motorola flagship.
fumar•1h ago
Dynamic Island looks good. I am glad I picked up an M5 max prior to the price hike.
boplicity•59m ago
They're finally getting OLED, which is one thing that's kept me on competitor laptops. They're just so much easier on my eyes.
ndiddy•59m ago
It's interesting that they've decided to release a new high-end model this year even though they aren't coming out with new high-end M6 chips. Apparently they have decided to not make Pro/Max versions of the M6 in favor of accelerating development of the M7 series, which will have improved support for on-device AI. https://www.macrumors.com/2026/06/25/2027-macs-m7-chips/
otterley•57m ago
Historically speaking, the Pro/Max versions of the chips have become available at around the same time the next-generation base chip does. So, M4 Pro/Max shipped when M5 shipped, M5 Pro/Max shipped when M6 shipped, and so forth.
ndiddy•50m ago
The Macbook Pro with M5 Pro/Max came out in March, while the Macbook Pro with M6 came out yesterday.
ajaimk•47m ago
They’ve done it before: first retina model has the same cpu and GPU as the previous gen
sourdecor•58m ago
I was hoping a 2-in-1 foldable that acts like an iPad too. I have been waiting decades for that.
codybontecou•55m ago
Was also hoping for this.
jasonvorhe•43m ago
Looking at all the broken Duo folding screen issues I wouldn't count on it.

Huawei made a Fold laptop that seems to be running Linux already if you're into that.

Robdel12•58m ago
Will this be another touchbar? Only time will tell but I never want to touch my screen. I don't even really do it with my iPad, lol
erxam•58m ago
The product itself is fine, I have no strong opinions on it. But what a hell of a disappointing unveiling.

Take down the store and website for a few minutes, boot it back up, boom. That's it. They couldn't even bother with a keynote or a livestream or something.

For their flagship laptop receiving a substantial update after six years. Okay.

minimaxir•57m ago
There is apparently an in-person event that is not livestreamed. https://www.tomsguide.com/news/live/apple-touchscreen-macboo...
erxam•44m ago
That's cold comfort, unless the influencers were meant to livestream it themselves… which I still don't particularly like, but it's something?
cbm-vic-20•44m ago
Makes sense this event is in LA- this this is designed to be a mobile media creation device. Most users don't care about most of the features that are highlighted in the press release, but someone creating any sort of visual media would.
fckgw•58m ago
Doesn't look like it folds back or does tent mode. Those are some good use cases for touchscreen PCs, being able to walk around in tablet mode in something like a warehouse, for example.

Dynamic island looks nice.

dsr_•42m ago
This. No 360 hinge, no desire for a touchscreen.

You'd think Apple would understand the form factor.

mckn1ght•57m ago
Not a fan of touchscreen on inclined surfaces, personally. I think the ergonomics of this will be bad for shoulders/elbows.

Like the iPad when it’s docked to its smart keyboard, I don’t like touching it at the point, it’s better to use the trackpad that’s laying flat.

It also wobbles when you do touch it. The macbook may not do the wobble, but it will constantly push further open and this may weaken the hinge mechanism over time.

maxdo•57m ago
the angle they show for music is sooo unnatural, what a gimmick
otterley•56m ago
I'm curious as to how the touch feature will work (if at all) with privacy screens.
int32_64•55m ago
Pro tip always get the silver macbooks because they wear out considerably better. On the black ones the paint near the charger ends up looking terrible and any dents/nicks/scratches look bad.
adrianN•52m ago
I like scratches on my machines, it gives them character.
buildbot•49m ago
Yeah the “brassing” is really cool
Maxion•42m ago
FWIW a brass macbook would be pretty dope
ch_sm•28m ago
Very Steampunk.
buildbot•16m ago
Given $$$$ that might actually be reasonably possible to do if you can get a good enough model of the chassis.
brailsafe•47m ago
I wish there was a red or green one. Sick of only having two options.
arttaboi•54m ago
Apple perfected the trackpad to the point where a touchscreen never felt necessary; and that’s how they got away with not building one.

This feels more like a marketing gimmick, anyone remember the Touch Bar?

joshuat•54m ago
I wish I could buy this without touch just for the rush of nostalgia, having the illuminated Apple logo on the back
imwally•50m ago
One MacBook Air with a glowing Apple logo on the lid, please!
speedping•53m ago
No cellular which is literally the only thing missing from the macbook pro :(

1. Mini LED is fantastic so the OLED jump is marginal at best 2. I know many people with a touchscreen windows laptop. None of them uses the touch function on a regular basis

Larrikin•48m ago
Cellular on my first iPad felt like such a waste of money. Every time I needed Internet I had Wi-Fi or my phone became a hot spot
brailsafe•40m ago
My first iPad entirely felt like a waste of money. Any time I'd want to do something useful with it, the mac was a better choice. Not sure what cellular on the iPad would have ever offered me, but I know why I want it on my laptop.
Zenbit_UX•46m ago
What’s your use case for cellular on a laptop? At least here in Canada data plans are expensive enough that I could blow through my monthly limit in 30min with a laptop. I would be quite annoyed if my wifi dropped and I had discovered only later that I’d exhausted my data unknowingly
speedping•38m ago
I'm always on the go, working from trains, light rails, cafes with bad internet etc.

iPhone hotspot is slow, unreliable and drains the phone's battery quickly

Luckily i'm in a country where a 600GB 5G plan costs the equivalent of 15$ a month, with 3$ per extra eSIM (watch/computer/car/whatever)

rvz•52m ago
I would not buy this, unless you can fold the machine's screen backwards beyond 120° and use it like an iPad.

So without that, having touch doesn't make any sense and once again, won't buy this unless the second generation of touch Macbooks are available.

Worked well with the first foldable iPhone Duo didn't it? /s

thehamkercat•52m ago
For local LLM people:

(for comparison, M4 pro has 273 GB/s and M1 pro has 200GB/s and M1 max has 400GB/s)

M5 Pro (20-core GPU): 307 GB/s memory bandwidth (supports 24 GB, 48 GB, 64 GB).

M5 Max (32-core GPU): 460 GB/s memory bandwidth. (36 GB)

M5 Max (40-core GPU): 614 GB/s memory bandwidth (supports 48 GB, 64 GB, 128 GB)

abhikul0•26m ago
IMO getting a studio for LLMs is a wiser choice since it doesn't heat up and there are no batteries to degrade.

For an M5 max top bin with 128GB Ram:

- mac studio: $5,899.00 (with 2TB ssd bump to match the default macbook sku)

- macbook 16: $7,399.00

Portability gets a hit but I feel you can have a thin client and let the studio do the heavy lifting back at your home/studio(heh).

alasano•20m ago
What's are the odds that the M7 Max goes above 128GB? (Presuming the rumors about Apple skipping the M6 Pro/Max are true)
benoau•11m ago
At this point it's pretty certain they've skipped M6 Pro/Max or they'd be a flagship feature of today's laptop.

The odds of > 128GB are very good, AMD have already bumped the Strix Halo to 192GB of RAM and both AMD and Nvidia should have successors to their offerings in 2028 that will compete with the M7 Pro and Max. Both AMD and Nvidia will be using TSMC N2 too so the competition will be ramping up.

JaggerJo•52m ago
Personal highlight: Seems like the GLOWING apple logo is back!

(don't care about the touchscreen)

katbyte•22m ago
Wait for real.. for real! https://www.macrumors.com/2026/10/28/illuminated-logo-return...

I was gonna get it for the oled (also don’t care about touch screen) but now it’s also for the glowing logo!

sim04ful•52m ago
There's no universe this doesn't negatively affect the UX of the OS for non-touch users. You can't simply support (or rather you can half-arse) new affordances without contorting the rest of the already well worn paths.
wahnfrieden•47m ago
Those changes are already in the latest macOS. So feel free to share your opinion on what we’ve already been using instead of speculating.
robmccoll•40m ago
I'm still on Sequoia for this reason. I want a UI optimized for displaying text content and mouse and keyboard control. Mostly keyboard. I definitely don't want the larger border radius on the windows that would seem to be designed for touch.
cruano•19m ago
Isn't that his point though ? Their plan seems to half-ass touch support (i.e. the menu bar, minimize/close buttons, etc. all stay in their current size), so it seems like a waste of hardware to include a touch screen just for very little functionality. If instead they make the UI friendly to fat fingers, they'd very much affect the mouse/trackpad experience.
embedding-shape•35m ago
Does that mean you also believe the same to be true for mouse affordances ruining it for keyboard users and vice-versa? Or "touch" is special in this regard?
sunaookami
arjie•51m ago
I see. The iPad and Macbook are converging. Interesting. I can’t say I get the use case but perhaps it will fold in some interesting way that makes it usable. I have no problem using a touchscreen occasionally but in the standard configuration the screen will wobble if you touch it.
jerlam•26m ago
Apple's been trying (in vain?) to sell iPad users a Magic Keyboard for six years and add a windowing system to iPadOS to pretend it's a real operating system, so I suppose they're trying to bridge the gap from the opposite (Macbook) side.
pavlov•51m ago
Wasn’t the Touch Bar also supposed to be “a new dimension for pro workflows”.

I guess if users don’t touch it, then you just have to keep trying with something bigger to touch.

hmokiguess•50m ago
It's sort of outrageous to launch a new product like that but not with M6, I am gonna wait for the M7 version
wahnfrieden•49m ago
I just don’t understand stabbing pointed fingers at the screen to use it vs tapping the pads of my fingers like an iPad.

Besides holding my arms up it’s also painful to keep my wrists bent to get a better angle for my fingers to articulate.

lbreakjai•49m ago
I had to double check when I saw the "piano keyboard" demo picture. I assumed I was on a parody website. How the mighty have fallen ...
00deadbeef•48m ago
I want it for the OLED but not for the touch or glowing logo
JeremyHerrman•48m ago
looks like they brought back the glowing apple logo on the lid for the first time in a decade!

the older macbooks used the display's backlight to illuminate the logo, but since these new OLED displays light up individual pixels I wonder how they're lighting it up now...

okso•47m ago
If the main reason to use macOS is that it's required to develop iPhone apps, a touch screen helps with testing them.
vincnetas•36m ago
Would it not be just easier to connect actual iphone to the laptop for testing?
elxr•34m ago
I don't own an iphone
okso•3m ago
Not for fast user interaction tests.

I have a Linux laptop with touchscreen, and my main use is to test the touch interactions on web apps, sometimes Android apps.

Sure it's possible to open it on the phone, but that's an extra step usually not justified.

nsbk•46m ago
My god the prices. Good thing I lost interest in high-end laptops. Beefy desktop + light laptop is how I roll nowadays
varispeed•46m ago
I like how I can see its screen quality on my screen.
chakintosh•46m ago
What's the point of a touch display if the laptop doesn't have a 360 hinge !? The interaction looks very awkward and unless they stiffen the hinge compared to previous model, the thin screen will keep tilting backwards.
asdff•39m ago
Macbook hinges always get loose with time too
abletonlive•5m ago
"always" is doing a lot of work here. I've never had mine go loose and I'm still running an M1 Max from 2021 as a daily driver.
at1as•32m ago
"Touch screens don't want to be vertical" "After an extended period of time, your arm wants to fall off" "ergonomically terrible"

- Steve Jobs

Apple: check our new vertical touchscreen!

jerojero•45m ago
I like OLED screen but don't care at all for the touch screen.

The price is really high too.

thecatapps•45m ago
So unbelievably disappointing, right after the disappointment of the Duo. I was in the market for both, the early reviews of the Duo stopped me from upgrading, and the landing page of this new Mac has stopped me from upgrading that.

1. No cellular? This was honestly one of the biggest selling points in my eyes. The iPhone hotspot has been so unreliable lately.

2. Never would use the touchscreen in software engineering. Agree with others that I don't understand a real use case for it, and apparently their website designers can't either.

3. OLED is nice.

4. 24h battery life is nice.

5. No M6 Pro/Max. Just getting one generation up?

6. Not even a cool name? No Macbook Ultra? Macbook Studio? Obviously not important, but even they couldn't justify it as its own separate product from the existing Pros.

On the bright side, the wallet savings are nice. Absolutely not worth a $4,150 hit (using my M4 Pro 48GB/1TB 16" as reference)

rowanG077•45m ago
Very worried to see it's 1mm thinner. The existing macbook pro was already struggling way too much with heat. And now they shave off 1mm.
jayd16•44m ago
I guess they're testing the water before turning on native iPad app support? Not sure why they wouldn't ship it straight away.
losvedir•44m ago
Cue the folks who have used nothing but Apple laptops for the past 20 years coming here and wondering who would possibly want a laptop with a touch screen.
bitpush•32m ago
I think the confusion is lot of Apple enthusiasts drank the kool-aid the company served them saying touch screen is "yuck". And now they have a touch screen, it takes a while to re-orient themselves.

We saw this with foldables. It was a bad idea, but when Apple did it, it was a great idea all of a sudden.

And if you rewind a while back, you'll see "large phones are bad because one handed use .. blah blah" and then Pro Max.

theanonymousone•44m ago
Wasn't "touchscreen for a laptop" another one of those things that Apple intentionally refused to do? Is this the effect of the new leadership?
socratics•29m ago
Admittedly, Apple has “refused” to do many things over the years (pen support on iPad comes to mind) and yet ends up doing them. Apple refuses to do something until they want to sell it. FWIW, I don’t understand the appeal of this device at all, but I don’t expect much consistency from Apple.
tidbeck•21m ago
Yes it is (as people already have discussed in this thread). A link to the keynote where Steve Jobs talk about it: https://youtu.be/7zfir0Ide0A?si=fKF68UUoLhXK8cPJ
valine•43m ago
I always thought if Apple did touch on the macbook it would come with a redesign to merge macOS with touch elements from the iPad. As it stands this feels like more of an afterthought.

If there’s one killer feature though, it’s iOS device mirroring and the iOS simulators. I’ve instinctively reached up to touch the iOS simulator so many times.

I wonder how they do the glowing apple logo with no backlight.

dsego•38m ago
I thought that they would basically replace macbooks with ipad pros. Sort of like microsoft surface, a tablet-laptop combo. Not sure what their plan is now.
super_mario•42m ago
If the screen were detachable and you get a giant 16'' ipad, I would consider it. I do not want touch interface on a laptop and will never buy this. I do want non-touch OLED screen though.

Dynamic island sounds like it will be huge distraction if animations will play there.

giwook•42m ago
This is truly groundbreaking! I've always wanted to play piano on a 14" screen.
joshstrange•41m ago
Does anyone use/like touch on their windows (linux?) laptops? I've never really been drawn to wanting to do that. My mouse is far more accurate and doesn't block my view. But maybe it's just because I don't have it and I would find tons of uses for it. Also, I don't love the idea of putting fingerprints all over my screen. I guess I can understand for testing iOS/iPad apps but past that I just don't see myself wanting to use that.

Then again, it really doesn't matter to me at all what the screen looks like or what features it has, I use my MBP docked 99% of the time with the screen closed, to the point that my next computer will almost certainly be a Mac Studio and I'll just use my MBP on the rare occasions I need it on the go.

rottencupcakes•38m ago
I've had a touch screen Lenovo for 10 years. It was a huge mistake and I never use it. It's uncomfortable and doesn't work with laptop interfaces or form factor.

All the cons are real (which Apple figured out in the aughts), but enshittification at a corporate bureaucracy is inevitable without a strong person in charge.

njovin•38m ago
In my limited experience providing tech support for family members with touchscreen laptops, it's awful. The touch-targets are mostly designed for mouses, so they're easy to miss. Your screen gets filthy. Moving from keyboard to screen and back is tiring.

I'm sure there are good use-cases, but IMO everyday average-home-user computing is not one of them.

embedding-shape•36m ago
I got a Surface laptop/tablet hybrid thingy, which was weird at first to get used to, but actually kind of nice. I mostly got it for notetaking, drawing and 3D work, which it worked very well for, until the machine bricked itself during a Windows Update like a month after the warranty, and now it no longers powers up itself.

While it worked, it was useful for me, mostly the drawing I guess was the most different, as I used to use Wacom tablets for that, but seeing exactly where you draw makes things a lot easier.

If I was still in the market for a laptop, I'd probably again get a touch-based one, as long as it's not Microsoft, as that was the first and last time I bought any Microsoft hardware. Probably not Apple either as the OS and software is such a mess, so probably leaning Asus or Thinkpad with Linux on it, if anything.

SuperShibe•41m ago
Seems like this is essentially a 400$ upgrade for the M6 Pro MacBook Pro. Those 400$ get you better sound, a better display and touch.

This is clearly targeted at creatives, the touchscreen feels more like a nice bonus they give out so people can experiment with touchscreen macOS and polish their apps for it - my guess is that this is preparation for a more convenient touch-based macOS device they're going to launch in a year or so.

elxr•34m ago
Better sound is not really a selling point to anyone in the real world.

IMO, this is a macbook pro but ~200g lighter and with an improved screen that's finally oled. Absolutely NOT worth 2900. An M6 mbp specced to 24GB is $700 cheaper directly on their site. Yeah it's an M6 and not an M5 pro, but I guarantee the performance difference won't matter 99.9% of the time.

$2900 is just ridiculous. So many better options with this budget.

malshe•32m ago
Not an M6 Pro chip here. It's either M5 Pro or M5 Max
tap-snap-or-nap•41m ago
Will the keyboard and trackpad leave a mark on the screen despite us keeping surfaces clean?
thisisauserid•39m ago
No gorilla glass for gorilla arm?
tristor•39m ago
I have never wanted a touch screen on my laptop. I still don't. Who is this for?
mastercheif•39m ago
OLED screens often exhibit poor text rendering.

I'm curious to see this in person. Looks like the "PROLED" is not using an RGB stripe layout.

Pixel density can reduce text fringing, but I have not seen a laptop OLED panel that renders text as well as an LCD yet.

AlanYx•20m ago
It's got a very interesting pixel layout, different even from previous tandem OLEDs. Hard to describe quickly in words, but shown in Figure 2 here: https://www.apple.com/ca/macbook-pro/proled-xdr-display/pdf/... I imagine some of the C-shaped empty space is probably to accommodate the per-pixel emitter transistor.
K7PJP•37m ago
I fail to see how Terminal.app benefits from a touchscreen, so what's the point? /s
wslh•37m ago
At this point an Apple robot or car make more sense than a touchscreen.
soci•36m ago
Didn't OLED screens age bad with use as with plasma back in the day? I'd rather not want a less bright mac screen in a few years.

Don't take me wrong, OLED displays on a a MacBook screen is quite a nice feat compared to regular the regular displays we have as of today.

mmcnl•30m ago
OLED displays now are tandem OLED displays which stack multiple layers. This means you don't need to exponentially crank up the voltage to provide more brightness which also increases lengivity of the panel (and increases battery life).
AnthonBerg•15m ago
I have a, what, 2019 LG CX OLED TV. 55". Used in anger as computer monitor since new. With complete disregard for burnout. It's… perfectly fine? I can't see any dimming or patterns or faults at all.
aavshr•33m ago
is it just me or a lot of Apple's copies these days seem too LLM generated?
skadamat•32m ago
I'm so perplexed that they chose this product name, while still retaining their existing Macbook Pro product line.
faitswulff•31m ago
I guess I’m skipping MBPs until they take this feature out like I did with the Touch Bar.
at1as•30m ago
Sure, we wanted OLED (my ROG G14 has a wonderful screen compared to my mac).

But touch will go about as well as the touchbar did

nntwozz•30m ago
It's ergonomically terrible.

It doesn't work.

Steve Jobs said this in October 2010 during Apple's "Back to the Mac" special event, where the company was previewing Mac OS X Lion.

Everything is going down the drain right in front of our eyes.

I can't make sense of any counterargument as anything but copium.

t1234s•29m ago
You can find the steve jobs video showing where they wouldn't make a touch screen laptop. He is probably rolling over in his grave now.

I do like how they are brining back ports. I think they need to add back the Ethernet port.

elxr•29m ago
Everybody worried about the usefulness of touch (which I do find occasionally useful), meanwhile they've literally set base pricing at $2900. For a 14 inch mbp, with 24GB. Hilarious.

How on god's green earth is this worth $2900?

NorthSouthNorth•29m ago
Got the m5 pro like last month. Actually no FOMO this time. I wonder how the AMOLED looks irl, I bet it's sweet but the current pro motion is already top notch.
psoga•28m ago
how did they reduce the weight? the design looks the same
__mharrison__•28m ago
No pen support is lame.

Having said that, I'd be afraid to touch it. On one of my MBPs, I held it by putting my hands near the hinge, with my thumbs resting in the lower corners of the screen. Over (a short period of) time, the protective(?) coating on the screen wore away.

msie•27m ago
I feel Apple had to release a touch display to quiet all the few complainers out there. And the next version won't have touch.
jon128•27m ago
Looking forward to running Gentoo with Asahi patches on this some day.
malshe•27m ago
Some of my students use touchscreen Windows laptops. They seem to be OK with them but I never found them usable particularly for coding. A touchscreen laptop has ergonomically bad design. Or it could just be a generational thing.
asdff•27m ago
Funny how half the press release tries to hide the notch/island/whatever its called. I almost thought they gave up on that, then I finally saw it like 7 or 8 images in.
drcongo•26m ago
Why would anyone touch their screen? Madness.
toddmorey•26m ago
Aside: Does anyone else find the new AI texture explosions Apple's using on their marketing pages now a little unsettling and un-Apple? I guess I'm desperate for at least one tech brand to feel / remain human.
bilalq•25m ago
Touch is probably not going to be useful in most contexts, but there are two things that come to mind:

1. Since many iOS apps can run on Apple silicon Macs now, this might be useful for apps where touch matters for more than just clicking buttons.

2. For mobile app developers, you can actually try real touches events on the simulator/emulator while developing and get better sense of how it feels without needing to pull out a physical device.

I have a touchscreen on my Googlebook (I know, early adopter issues galore, but I love mine now). I basically forget I have it most of the time, but every now and then, it's been cool.

chrisfosterelli•23m ago
That's a good point, the use case for mobile app dev would be quite appealing even if a little niche.
achairapart•22m ago
Does this mean that macOS will natively support touch screens so I don't need to look anymore for after-market solutions[0] for mine? That would be cool.

[0]: https://www.touch-base.com/

randyrand•22m ago
> PROLED

Really... I would expect this naming from an Onion article.

usui•21m ago
No Apple Pencil is a huge miss for consumers. I guess they don't want to cannibalize the iPad though.

I would probably never touch the screen with my fingers, but I would draw with it. Would also be really useful during calls.

eutropia•19m ago
tandem OLED is one of those techniques that makes me think "why didn't we just do this in the first place?"
thealexliang•16m ago
For those HDR video editing / color grading specialists, how do these compare to Samsung + LG OLED TVs, Sony HDR Reference Monitors, or else?

I’ve always been interested in HDR video (HDR 10 +, Dolby Vision, HLG) and have wondered if the marginal upgrade in producer display quality will further impact the consumer HDR consumption. Also I think it’s noteworthy that they showcase DaVinci Resolve instead of Final Cut Pro, which is their own non linear editor and color grading app.

supersing•15m ago
Such an advanced OLED display only to be covered by fingerprints after a week of use.
canuckintime•14m ago
Will touch and dynamic island be supported in clamshell mode? Can they be enabled in other Macs?
grishka•14m ago
It's very unfortunate that there now isn't a single desktop operating system not ruined by touchscreen support.
swader999•13m ago
Finger prints on my screen are a capital crime or at least family meeting time.
rjrjrjrj•13m ago
Can you use the touchscreen for the "run iPhone and iPad apps" feature of Apple Silicon Macs?

And if so, has Apple changed the policy from developer opt-in to automatic on touchscreen Macs.

ryzvonusef•12m ago
Ah, HN is truly the successor to /., developers crying about touchscreens on laptops and gorilla arms.

Brothers, there is a market beyond your bash shells!

;p

unconscionable•12m ago
The touchscreen would make sense for a hybrid laptop convertible. But in this form factor I cannot understand.
baxuz•12m ago
Touchscreens on vertical screens are ridiculous.

Especially if they don't even have stylus support

nu11ptr•11m ago
I wasn't sure how I would feel about my newish MBP M5 Max when they released this, but given the price increase, and the fact that I have zero interest in a better screen since I dock most of the time, I am happy I paid $2K less for the same horsepower earlier this year.

Update: The one nice thing I noticed is the weight of the 16" is only 4.1lb vs. 4.7lb from the previous model. I guess OLED is a lot lighter. THAT would be nice.

thrw0090389jfhM•10m ago
The fancy OLED display would actually be a potential reason to finally upgrade from my M1 Pro but even if I could afford it, I find prices like that hard to swallow (and I couldn't care less about touch in a laptop fwiw). Guess I'll buy one used in a year or three, maybe.
nightc1tyrogue•10m ago
1. Improved thermal system

2. Even better speakers

3. Thinner and lighter while retaining the 100 Wh battery

4. No more notch

Seems like a solid all-around update to be. Other than cellular, I can't possibly imagine what more people could want.

einpoklum•10m ago
A massive overpriced laptop with a novelty touch feature on its monitor gets free promotion on HN. Ah well.
infecto•10m ago
I am going to jump on the touch hate bandwagon but more specifically I think it’s odd in the format they designed. I think the MSFT surface is brilliant because you can fold it down into an iPad like device which can be great for travel and other non-desk uses.

Touch while still being a normal laptop does feel odd. I would be curious who wants touch in this form factor.

miguel-muniz•9m ago
For work I have a Windows laptop with a touch screen and these were the only times I have wanted to use it:

1. The trackpad on it is so god awful that using any sort of multi finger gesture is a non-starter. In this case the touch screen works significantly better.

2. I wanted to draw in a whiteboarding tool. Drawing with my finger is not ideal so I tried a passive stylus. Drawing with a passive rubber-tipped stylus leaves a lot to be desired. I would much rather use an active stylus or a pen display for artists if I could.

Apple is known for the best trackpads. They have set the bar high and they have consistently met that bar for over a decade. I don't need a touch screen for gestures when their trackpad feels just as good. To my next point, there is no pen support on this screen.

Given this, I feel the touch screen is going to be seen just like the touch bar, a pretty feature that receives some good niche support, but ultimately does not align with how the majority of users use a laptop. I just hope there's an option to turn off the touch screen when they inevitably start shifting this display down to the base model.

boringg•6m ago
"The trackpad on it is so god awful that using any sort of multi finger gesture is a non-starter. In this case the touch screen works significantly better."

probably the only reason -- and this is mitigated with a mouse.

gffrd•9m ago
This means they've figured out a way to keep the screen from wobbling when poked … let the theorizing commence!
Projectiboga•8m ago
Years ago like 2010, 11 Microsoft had demo touchscreen computers running an art application in the Kids Room at the MOMA museum in NYC. It was responsive to actual brushes and was quite an interesting interface. As far as I knew it was a beta.
karim79•7m ago
Touch screen on a laptop is objectively disgusting. I have a Lenovo yoga X1 or something with a touch screen (and it folds backwards into a tablet) hence the name. It is stupid and useless. I can imagine Steve Jobs turning in his grave right now.

If you want a screen to touch get a fucking tablet.

dep_b•4m ago
My god they’re really running out ideas in Cupertino. What I need is a screen that gives an electrical shock to anybody that dares to touch it with their filthy fingers.
mstaoru•2m ago
M5 MBP owners, did Apple finally manage to fix the permanent "keyboardprint" on the screen?

I had it very badly on Intel MBP, and now on my M3 Max. I tried some screen protectors, but none of them stuck (pun intended).

I suppose touch only makes it worse?

defraudbah•2m ago
so many complains on touch screen is how i know it will be a banger

I don't like it, it still will be a popular laptop and within 5 years - one of the best. I am moving away from Apple, thank you for a ride!

subsaharancoder•2m ago
devices have become so expensive you can now lease them like a car..you will own nothing and be happy
stryakr•2m ago
I think this is more for the generation that grew up on phones and tablets, who are now in the professional space and like that interaction model
usaphp•1m ago
15% weight reduction over previous gen macbook pro is great.
Whenever I had to use a laptop with a touch screen for work, I immediately turned it off. I have no idea what my use case would be as a coder, and it doesn’t seem like Apple has come up with anything new to give me a reason to try it again.
gizajob•55m ago
I’ve felt for years that they were holding out until they could make a dual touchscreen MacBook work and be a peak experience. I was expecting an iPhone duo type MacBook. That hasn’t happened.

Who plays a musical keyboard on a vertical surface? Nobody.

jeroenhd•33m ago
Some of their examples are absolutely ridiculous, for sure. The lack of a fold-back design, like the surface, with pencil support is also a surprise to me. I suppose they'd still rather sell you an iPad with an operating system they don't let you control rather than bringing their laptop segment up to par with the competition.

But having had to emulate pinch-zoom in an Android emulator has made me wish I had my touch screen laptop back. Emulated touch events also don't work like real touch events, so web dev can also be a bit annoying sometimes.

lucasoshiro•49m ago
My company once gave me a touchscreen laptop and I did know that until I touched the screen by accident. It was fun to play but I never found it useful. I heard many people saying the same, some of them even preferred to disable. I find it uncomfortable to touch a laptop screen... The only thing seems to benefit from that for me is photo editing apps or 3D modelling.

So, I'm curious about how you use it. Do you have a specific use case where touchscreen made you life easier?

jeroenhd•36m ago
It's just small things. I don't have a touch screen laptop anymore, but being able to physically tap things or reaching over to touch things just felt natural.

I have a phone with a QWERTY keyboard that also acts as a trackpad, yet I rarely use mouse mode on it. Seeing kids interact with laptops for the first time and touching the screen expecting them to work like every other device they use is also probably a sign of the times.

I understand why not everyone likes them, though. Some people prefer to disable their trackpads too, or prefer ball mice, or prefer mouse gestures over keyboard gestures. To each their own. I welcome the diversity.

xutopia•59m ago
I remember Steve Jobs saying something about how silly it would be.
nomilk•57m ago
He said the same of the stylus during the iPhone launch, but it eventually came to life (just in a much more specific setting/use case)
asdff•35m ago
The pencil is bad enough but how it charges itself is even worse. Lets turn my ipad into a brittle stingray. It's up there with the mouse having to charge upside down for apples top own goals.
K7PJP•7m ago
He said if the device required a stylus, they failed. The pencil is useful for certain applications, but not required.
sroussey•57m ago
Yes, I agree, but I caught myself touching the screen twice this week forgetting it was a Mac...
whalesalad•57m ago
when i'm in a supine position like in bed with my knees up... i will unfold my framework pro to 180º and use my thumb to scroll docs etc. only downside is smudge marks on the screen which rly irritate me.
1e1a•56m ago
I need a screen which zaps me whenever I touch it, to discouraged me from accidentally leaving fingerprints at the edge.
TuxSH•56m ago
You're not alone. Though, I wonder if this means better coating, the coating on the existing MacBooks (but not the M1's) get damaged far too easily when in a bag.
mattrighetti•51m ago
> the coating on the existing MacBooks (but not the M1's) get damaged far too easily when in a bag

How so? I have an M2, carry it in a bag daily but my screen is still pristine

jgrahamc•56m ago
I use Mac mostly, but I also use a Panasonic Toughbook (https://blog.jgc.org/2025/07/ode-to-anti-mac-panasonic-tough...) and it has a touch screen display and I find it's a useful addition to how I interact with it.
mcv•54m ago
I've had a Thinkpad with a touch screen and I loved it. Sometimes touching something on the screen is a lot faster than grabbing the mouse, moving the cursor, and then clicking.

Although it's a lot more useful on laptops that can fold into a tablet, which neither MacBooks nor my Thinkpad can do.

randerson•52m ago
If you've ever watched a kid try to use a MacBook, they instinctively touch the screen because they were raised on iPads.
dsego•51m ago
Their marketing web page shows someone poking with their fingers at the virtual keyboard and it's so cringe. Who is going to use their laptop that way? For pro workflows? Pros have midi keyboards with pads and those are even not that expensive.
linguae•50m ago
I would love a tablet running macOS, which I prefer over Windows and desktop Linux. I have a Microsoft Surface Pro 7. It performed fine under Windows 10, though performance suffered when upgrading to Windows 11. The Surface Pro is a nice piece of hardware, but I wish it had macOS instead of Windows. The iPad Pro definitely has enough processing power to run macOS, but it runs iPadOS, which is too restrictive for me as a developer.

If Apple went through the effort making macOS touchscreen-ready for this new MacBook Pro, then perhaps we’ll see a tablet with macOS one day. I’d buy an iPad Pro with macOS in a heartbeat.

SirMaster•47m ago
Even when developing a mobile app and using the simulator, you never wished you could touchscreen the simulator?
causal•44m ago
1) Youth expect all screens to be touch. They are learning how to use computers in school on touchscreen Chromebooks. Apple knows they must adapt to user expectation.

2) AI is forcing UI evolution that is hard to anticipate, but I suspect will be served well by having more kinds of inputs available in advance.

SirMaster•48m ago
I mean it's only $400 more than the LED non-touch screen.

Seems like it would be useful for app development being able to do touchscreen for the iOS and iPadOS simulators.

abujazar•31m ago
I much prefer using an actual device, which is required for a lot of other hardware features anyway.
dstroot•43m ago
You’re not an outlier.
nfriedly•24m ago
I look for touchscreens when looking for a cheap windows laptop for someone because they tend to be better quality screens (IPS, decent brightness, etc.) instead of some awful TN panel that's barely visible in a well-lit room.

I don't really expect anyone to use it as a touchscreen, but if they do, at least that will work too.

makeitdouble•2m ago
Getting rid of the fixed keyboard helps a lot (my preferred form factor), but even in the classic laptop form factor is makes a ton of sense IMHO.

There's a lot of small niceties that pile up into a better experience, the sister comments cover a bunch of those, so I'll focus on a macos specific nice point:

iPad and iPhone apps can now get direct touch when running on a laptop, instead of the mouse mode. With this, there is now a perfect platform able to run Mac, iOS and iPad apps outside of the ill-fated Vision Pro.

That's too little to late for me, but I think many will appreciate the benefits.

Hamuko•46m ago
Really glad I'm not currently shopping for a new computer.

It's also pretty fucking sad how this thing comes with less RAM than my low-end Mac Studio from 2022. I only upgraded from a 512 GB SSD to 1 TB, and I still have 32 GB. And even still, I paid 2599€ for it, where as the OLED MacBook Pro is 4049€.

varispeed•29m ago
Here they offer no finance for over £5k. Crap.
44m ago
That seems like a great use case for it.

How many Macbook Pro owners are mobile app developers though?

SirMaster•41m ago
Not sure, but I bet most mobile app developers are MacBook users haha.

I mean it's a $400 up-charge over the same model without touchscreen. Not that unreasonable if you are a heavy app developer IMO.

whynotminot•30m ago
They sell other equally capable MacBook pros if this isn’t your use case?
giwook•23m ago
But without the new screen, which is genuinely impressive and a noticeable upgrade.
whynotminot•6m ago
And nicer new screens cost more money!

You don’t have to touch it?

Kwpolska•27m ago
Is it really that useful if you need to test on real hardware anyway?
hirvi74•25m ago
Simulation is already great, and one can (and should) test their app on device.
qingcharles•29m ago
Here's the official launch video, where it looks silly to me, but I know very casual users who love their touchscreen laptops:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnZI5uUSdEo

hbn•1m ago
Casual users should not be buying the most expensive MacBook Pro unless they have so much money that $3000 (or more) means little to them.
chrisfosterelli•26m ago
I agree, there's definitely places where I could see it being useful. I just wonder if it's too marginal to justify it. I felt the same way about the touch bar.
phoghed•50m ago
I liked the Touch Bar for custom app actions, but I didn’t like that it replaced the physical keys. Not that I use any of them much besides volume.
chrisfosterelli•25m ago
The touch bar's specific advantages grew on me and I liked the slider for volume/brightness. But I definitely haven't missed it either.
jayd16•49m ago
You act like you don't use a touch screen every day. Its not some crazy impossible technology to have an oleophobic display.
chrisfosterelli•29m ago
I think my comment was internally consistent with my phone use.

My comment was not about touchscreens in general, it was about touchscreens on laptops. The phone touch experience is excellent because everything is designed for touch. Correspondingly, if you plug a KBM into a phone, it's a very poor experience.

If my phone's display is oil repelling, it simply doesn't work very well. I regularly wipe the screen to keep it clean. Luckily, this is very easy to do since my phone is the size of my hand and the display is attached to a solid box with no hinges involved. I can clean it with my shirt when I notice smudges and am in the habit of doing so. A laptop screen is much more annoying to keep clean.

solarpunk_enthu•35m ago
Maybe users changed over the span of 16 years, while being daily exposed to touch screens? Remember, in 2010 the idea of using a finger was novel.
samatman•53m ago
Yes it is. I mean, you’re not going to play Chopin on it, obviously. But for selecting notes into a DAW? Hella convenient.
dsego•43m ago
How is it convenient? A pro workflow is not holding your arm with the finger up in the air trying to avoid accidental taps, when you can get a small 25 key akai midi controller for a 100 usd. And it's small and comes with velocity-sensitive keys and pressure-sensitive pads.
officeplant•21m ago
we have computer keyboard playing mode in nearly every DAW under the sun. It's useless
SirMaster•45m ago
Their demo is also mobile app development using touchscreen for testing apps in the simulator.
dsego•41m ago
Pretty useless, it's easy to simulate touches and gestures already.
iainmerrick•39m ago
Not multi-touch gestures.
sllewe•32m ago
Seems like a slim use case, no?
hectdev•27m ago
yea but if the company is footing the bill...
freeone3000•5m ago
Macbook Pros attempt to cater to every slim use case simultaneously, with the idea that if they can handle a use case someone else can’t, they’ll sell another laptop.
dsego•32m ago
I think there was a modifier key + click and drag to simulate a pinch, so at least some gestures can be simulated. But since one is developing for the mobile device, it makes sense to tether the device and send builds to test out on the target device itself.
Slow_Hand•41m ago
As a longtime laptop musician, using the QWERTY keyboard to play notes in the absence of a MIDI controller is infinitely preferable to this goofy demo.

Apple better have some better use examples than THAT.

oefrha•24m ago
Reminds me of that stupid DJ demo of the touch bar. Did any DJ actually use that in practice? Well if they do they better hold on to their now vintage MacBook.
Y-bar•30m ago
I agree that a piano demo seems like a bad idea. But damn if I don’t daily long for the iOS 6 days where buttons and tappable areas were well defined and there were some fun and whimsy to the interface. As compared to the flat unintuitive desolate landscape of recent years. I would rather have a big animated cassette deck in my music player than the current overly polished full page advert I get every time I open the app. At least Forstall and his team cared enough.
smith7018•15m ago
Annoys me to no end that fun colors are limited to the "cheap" lines like the Neo, Air, and Duo while Pros are boring. If I'm spending $4k on a laptop then why can't I get it in green? It genuinely makes no sense.
Bud•39m ago
Except there is no "paint". Neither are there any "black ones"; space grey isn't very close to black, and I've seen no wear issues of any kind on any of the Macs I support.
dbbk•24m ago
Life is too short
dmitrygr•22m ago
the champagne color for airs looks really nice when worn too, but i mirror your sentiments on black - it does not age well
wpm•18m ago
Champagne/Starlight is definitely the way to go when available. Starlight especially, it's mostly silver but sometimes the light catches it just right to give it this sort of iridescent gradient to a light gold.

I liked the old Gold they used in the mid 2010s too.

•
30m ago
Just look at Windows 8?
wpm•21m ago
Mouse affordances don't usually ruin it for keyboard preferrers. Keyboard shortcuts and control are often an afterthought or downright written off because "they can just click" but thats down to laziness or lack of care than some hard and fast rule. However, a keyboard affordance is usually invisible, and a mouse affordance isn't, so they can very happily co-exist without affecting one another. For instance, the Alt modifiers in menus in classic Windows, those have almost no effect at all on anyones ability to click the menu item with a mouse.

Touch affordances and UI does have to be visible, and there is only one screen. So the touch affordances and mouse affordances are mutually exclusive: targets get larger, padding expands, UI gets dumbed down, etc etc.

sim04ful•4m ago
well put!
dbbk•25m ago
But they have already done it. The updates are already in macOS and they have not negatively affected the UX.
latexr•12m ago
Er… Yes they have. Liquid Glass is awful. It’s not only ugly (that’s preference, though), it has definitely negatively affected the UX. That’s why they’re adding sliders and options and reversal left and right.
christophilus•34m ago
I dislike it very much. It's never what I want, and in the cases where I have it, it generally only gets used accidentally (e.g. when one of my kids pokes the screen). It's not ergonomic for normal use.
craftkiller•34m ago
> Does anyone use/like touch on their windows (linux?) laptops

My retired parents. When they borrow my laptop, I see them trying to touch my regular non-touch screen.

varispeed•32m ago
I bought a laptop for a relative and didn't realise it doesn't have touchscreen. They complained for a day and I often saw them try to touch the screen and then being disappointed it doesn't work. Week later they never mentioned it again and use the laptop just fine.

When I was buying them a second one and asked about touchscreen, they said they don't care anymore for it, so second laptop also was without touchscreen.

diabllicseagull•32m ago
To be honest, I'm more often than not more concerned about not having smudges on my laptop's screen.
Kd368•31m ago
It’s on my X1 Thinkpad. I find it more convenient to use the mouse as that’s where my hands are naturally and a habit.

However I have noticed that when I am dictating more using typeleas or whisperflow I use the touchscreen more as it’s more faster and has a good flow if you wanted speed

Maybe this is the reason they doing it now

opwieurposiu•30m ago
I got a 24" all in one computer with a touch screen because the kids were into drawing on the computer. The kids managed to scratch it up somehow, they had a stylus and I think the tip broke.

Anyway that experience made me think that touching a super high image quality screen will only lead to heartbreak. Better to use a cheap screen if you want to touch a lot.

Moosdijk•8m ago
If you want your kids to touch a lot.
wombat-man•29m ago
I worked at MS when they were putting out win 8, so I'm maybe biased. I enjoyed the touch interface laptops but I'll fully acknowledge that in my case they were making up for a bad touchpad experience.
katbyte•27m ago
I had one a decade or so ago and I did use it because it was there, sometimes. But it’s not a feature I would ever go out of my way to get or pay extra for - the only thing I was looking forward to here is the oled so guess I’ll find out if I will use it.
jmyeet•26m ago
Oh how far we've come. Steve Jobs in 2010 stated [1]:

> Steve Jobs told a crowd at an Apple event in 2010 that the company did “tons of user testing” on putting touchscreens on MacBooks and decided against it because, he said, “It doesn’t work. It’s ergonomically terrible.”

> While previewing Mac OS X Lion in 2010, Jobs explained the main issue was comfort, saying, “After a short period of time, you start to fatigue, and after an extended period of time, your arm wants to fall off.”

Design is the art of compromise. A laptop works. Physical keyboards are better than onscreen keyboards. Laptops with detachable tablets end up with a heavier screen so the base has to be heavier so it doesn't tip over.

I honestly don't know what the use case for touchscreen Macbooks really is. OLED? Sure. Why not? But touch? Who is this for?

[1]: https://www.cnet.com/tech/computing/steve-jobs-said-a-touchs...

rbanffy•26m ago
It's not a huge thing. My Thinkpad has a touchscreen, a clickable trackpad, and 3 buttons on top of the trackpad. The only thing it doesn't have is a trackpoint in the middle of the keyboard.

I use the trackpad most of the time, even for right and middle clicks (2/3 finger click), but I prefer the buttons when I have to select, and the middle button when I need to paste repeatedly. I don't use the touchscreen much, but it's the easiest way to swipe between virtual desktops on Linux. The touchscreen works well with the laptop turned "inside out" (my kid's laptop does that). Screen doesn't get smudges because of its texture. The example shown mentions the desktop swipe, and the piano keys are for setting up a chord, not playing a tune, both of which make sense (and try to set up a chord without multi-touch).

A bit of a shame there is no M6 Pro and M6 Max...

__mharrison__•26m ago
I have a touchscreen ThinkPad. As an instructor, I found it useful to draw on slides with the pen. I rarely touch it otherwise.

I mostly use MBPs now and resort to using my iPad as a mirrored screen to draw on slides. It is hacky.

ghawkescs•26m ago
I have used Surface laptops for years and touch is a definite nice-to-have. I especially like having it when diagramming and designing. Paired with the Surface Pen is can really unlock a lot of digital whiteboarding experiences.
cruano•24m ago
Pen support sounds 10x more useful than touch, particularly when they already have a pen for the iPad.
cromka•23m ago
But based on the Ad, they did not show own usage and it doesn't look like the hinge is 180. If that's correct, Apple went absolutely against its own beliefs for UX/UI.
hbn•22m ago
Windows benefits from a touchscreen more often on something like a diagram where you'll be panning around up/down/left/right, zooming, etc because the trackpad situation isn't very good.

I've never felt the need for a touchscreen when e.g. using Miro because I can scroll and all directions and zoom intuitively on the Mac's trackpad.

chocochunks•14m ago
Eh. I don't think the Macbook's trackpad is that good. It's better sure, but it's still not as intuitive panning or rotating over the image directly on a touch screen. And it's still useless for drawing.
dmitrygr•24m ago
I always look for a way to disable it
sxg•12m ago
Why? I'm genuinely curious. Couldn't you simply not touch the screen? It's what you're supposed to do for all non-touchscreen laptops anyway.
elxr•4m ago
My guess is so they can wipe the screen without triggering an errant click. Like how you'd lock your phone when wiping oil off the screen.
nanapipirara•24m ago
I use a Wacom Cintiq with touch, it is only useful for testing during mobile gamedev because it can simulate touch easily without leaving the editor and having to export a build to my phone or tablet. Quite an expensive trick. I wouldn’t purchase it again if it broke. (I would buy the same model without touch and save some bucks)
rhinoceraptor•19m ago
I've had it on a few laptops, I always disable it. My current work laptop is a Thinkpad which doesn't even have an option in the BIOS to disable its touchscreen, I had to write a udev rule to do it.
bsimpson•18m ago
For a long while, my home laptop was a Chromebook Pixel. It had touch and a retina-quality screen when both those things were novel.

I found the touch useful for momentary interactions, like buttons. It's quicker and easier to reach up and hit NEXT than it is to find the cursor, move it to the button, and click.

Definitely don't use it nearly as much as on a phone, but it is useful for surfing.

cpursley•17m ago
My wife loves her surface book specifically for the touch. No touch is what held her back from going Mac. She's a teacher and is constantly making assets and stuff in Canvas and those sort of things.
rtkwe•13m ago
Sometimes tapping a button is easier or faster than grabbing my mouse and navigating over to it but it is pretty infrequent.
Projectiboga•12m ago
It is more a nice extra than truly useful. Especially if trackpad or keyboard are starting to have issues. On occasion it can be easy to just fat-finger an onscreen button or on a long read just gently scroll. On videos they can be paused by tapping the play window. This is probably a step in their grand scheme to further merge Mac and ios together.
WillAdams•9m ago
I use it (for choosing tools) with a drawing program and a stylus (for the actual drawing) and it makes things quick/interactive --- no Apple Pencil support, and no ability to lay the entire device down flat means it doesn't suit my needs.
ed_elliott_asc•8m ago
I’ve had a few and liked it- is nice to be able to move my finger straight to a point on the screen and do something - is faster than using a mouse in some contexts
ptaffs•6m ago
I've been an enthusiast for whiteboarding, diagramming and handwriting, and had several Work HP Tablets and 360s, for several years I found good use taking notes in OneNote (specifically) for in-person meetings, for any other use like video conferences (which every meeting is now), giving presentations on screen-share, using office tools, etc, they just aren't convenient and are more prone to activating the wrong element with inadvertent touch. I write notes on paper and scan them for archive. This Mac Book doesn't fold flat which really should make it a non-starter unless Apple has a use-case I can't think of.
Groxx•5m ago
As a primary mode of use: oh hell no, it's awful. It's too far away from your hands, the ergonomics suck.

As an occasional "pinch to zoom that thing centered on my fingers, and adjust it to show what I want to someone 10 feet away" tool: it's fantastic. I could learn the key combo, but "use two fingers" is dramatically easier to remember and control.

Or to guide someone through something on screen, you can just tap it rather than having them mouse to precisely the control you meant. (yes this is often a terrible idea for teaching, but not everyone has fine motor control and sometimes there's random interruptions from other software - having them push those away can make it harder for them to learn/remember the actual goal)

Or for signing your name on a document, or anything else even slightly related to drawing.

Or if it's propped up on your chest in bed and your hands are naturally more comfortable on the screen than the keyboard (which is far too close).

Or if it's dark or you're at a low angle and can't read the keys.

It doesn't cost much, doesn't influence the display much, and is very useful occasionally. A great hardware feature to have IMO.

elxr•5m ago
I've used a few touch laptops. First one was a chromebook 9-10 years ago, and even then I got great use of the touchscreen just doing web browsing or navigating my files/google drive or scrolling through ebooks.

Always enjoyed touchscreens on my laptops. Nice thing is, you can just ignore it when you don't want it. It doesn't affect battery life, or thinness, or brightness, or clarity provided the implementation is good; it's just a bonus input method. I'll never say no to a laptop offering a touch option.

delecti•2m ago
I found it was something I didn't appreciate much until I had a touchscreen laptop. It doesn't fully replace the mouse or touchpad, but it is convenient enough of the time that I miss not having it. It also is a much bigger benefit when you're using the laptop by itself. But when reading something on the couch, it's helpful to scroll with a touchscreen, and it's handy to quickly interact with modal dialogs.
bpye•1m ago
I like some of the 2-in-1 devices that come with a pen - Surface Pro type devices or ones with a 360 degree hinge.

But with a conventional laptop I've only ever accidentally used the touch screen.