I've always said that the FUD surrounding AGI destroying humanity is silly, as long as we aren't so stupid as to bring AI into military decisions. This group of leaders doesn't bode well from that perspective.
Not to mention that at the same time this is happening, SecDef fired a number of generals, and the military is being used for political purposes, at least according to some.
Somehow I imagine that Andrew Bosworth didn't phrase things quite that way.
I thought the modern US military was very big on process and tradition in the development of officers.
And for individuals with the right skills and experience, O-5 isn't unusual.
EDIT: Here's a random example:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Military_Medicine/comments/1468l1f/...
The somewhat famous quote "Alight here for the Home of Rest with Army Exemption thrown in", a familiar greeting to RAF's working force by Farnborough's tram conductors, is a testament to it.
https://www.politico.com/news/2025/04/15/pentagons-digital-r...
But then again, pomp and circumstance…
Palantir, Crowdstrike, many others pretty much started inside the govt and were built around classified information as a means to get their advantage. It's not right, but It's definitely something that happens. Source: I was there for it with both orgs and even back then everyone though Dmitry formely from CS was a dick. I still have the mousepad that Palantir created for the office in lieu of a training guide (just a bunch of printed shortcuts / commands).
Yes, as commissioned US military officers they become subject to UCMJ.
USDS and DDS employees are/were civilian federal employees with capacity for legal authority to act on behalf of the US Government.
DoD and its branches have uniformed service members subject to UCMJ, but they also have many civilian employees with decision making authority and ultimately the services report to civilian secretaries; the ratio of uniformed service members (e.g. enlisted, and commissioned officers) to civilians can vary greatly by service. Another main difference to consider beyond UCMJ would be eligibility to be considered a combatant versus not; not all uniformed personnel should be considered combatants. "Authority" is not exclusive to uniformed personnel.
Many DoD programs can be led or managed by civilians, typically a GS-15 which is roughly equivalent to O-6 (e.g. Army/Air Force/Space Force Colonel, Navy Captain)
If I recall correctly, Palantir's main starting point beyond some of its fraud-tracking origins at Paypal were through its attempts to compete in the DCGS-A / replacement acquisition in DoD.
Crowdstrike had Dmitry, but its main US Government ties were through Shawn Henry, a former director of investigative operations at the FBI; Crowdstrike had a few business lines in its early days, which included its intel/research/analysis services, breach investigation/remediation services, while it was developing its endpoint protection products/platform.
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And to the upstream parent comment:
> The key difference is the DDS folks were not uniformed military. That can make all the difference when trying to sell your product or service to a military decision maker.
A lot of DoD acquisitions, developments, operations decisions end up being materially informed by civilian personnel that are direct employees of the US Government, contractors supporting the US Government via Federally Funded Research and Development Corporations (FFRDCS, labs, etc.), other contractors, etc. In some cases, it seems like the DoD programs are entirely reliant (i.e. dependent) on their contractor support (via FFRDCs, labs, etc).
Some of this comes from the fact that the typical active duty officer's assignment duration in a particular role (e.g. acquisition program manager, chief engineer, etc) ends up being two years or less before a permanent change of assignment (PCA). Having organic civilian staff in these roles can be essential for maintaining continuity and can be a key part of a program/mission's success.
(Also worth noting that in a lot of cases where the head of a program is a civilian employee, it's not uncommon to find that are military retired, prior service but separated, and/or also a reserve officer in the same or very adjacent field)
but I mean..
why put them in the military?
That seems like, I don't know, maybe something that can go south in a lot of different ways.
Source: Was a draftee once, talked to a technical officer later.
Sometimes known as "fork and knife school". I can't speak specifically for the Army, but a particular personal incident comes to mind.
When I attended AFROTC field training at Maxwell AFB, in a lot of ways it was a fairly typical boot camp experience, with roaming enlisted training instructors ready to very promptly and firmly correct any deviations from standard in a memorably expedient fashion (much less swearing than Full Metal Jacket, as it's the Air Force). One day during this fine summer camp I found myself on the receiving end of one such chewing out from a TI, for walking around the wrong side of a table in the dining facility.
It was in the midst of this comically scathing tirade (something about him threatening to crawl up my nose and living in my nightmares if I dared try it again) that this Technical Sergeant abruptly stopped, wheeled around and was about to tear into another hapless cadet that took the same detour I did. But instead, without a whit of the seething rage he was pouring out just a second before, he calmly patiently explained to this trainee that she was to take a different route, punctuating the instructions with a "right over there, ma'am". It was at that moment that I noticed that she did not have cadet insignia on her lapels, but captain's bars. It turns out she was a proper M.D., fresh from med school, directly commissioned and immediately outranking the sergeant that was giving me the what-for and her polite guidance.
So by Direct Commissioning, it is indeed direct.
The other was a Navy doctor. An officer, but really because he was a doctor.
Their experiences were wildly different. Not so much about risk but the Marine was a grunt and his description oozed what it meant to be at that level of rank. The doctor ... his description was that doctors, while they had rank, were largely left alone to their own devices to do what they needed to do. Rank wasn't really relevant to their daily lives.
My grandfather landed at Tarawa. He only talked about privately, it to family members that were in the service.
> The doctor ... his description was that doctors, while they had rank, were largely left alone to their own devices to do what they needed to do. Rank wasn't really relevant to their daily lives.
From my experience, military doctors tend to be doctors that happen to wear a uniform. They already have the skills actually needed by the service (unlike most military jobs, where it's assumed that you know little to nothing of the job), the direct commissioning training is mostly so they can function and fit in that environment.
At least, my experiences talking with a combat medic and the weather corps couldn’t be more different.
Sure, most of them join either during med school or during residency, with Uncle Sam picking up the financial obligations.
Funny story - good friend was an army doc and we managed to both get time off at the same time/location. Hanging out along the ocean and come across a little kid that got hurt. So he goes into doctor mode and talks soothingly to the kid, who is very apprehensive. He says “I know you’re not so sure I’m a doctor. It’s because I haven’t asked your parents for their insurance info yet” and smiles at the mom and dad.
Later on he says that never dealing with insurance is one of the perks of being a doctor in the military.
Despite not being anything close to an MD, a social media app I use has determined that I am. I get recruiting ads from the Navy that says this, in effect: "Don't worry about malpractice or insurance, just your patient". It's a pretty good sales pitch, I imagine.
If only the rest of government aspired to that. :)
> don’t worry about your constituents nor breaking the law, just your own self interest.
It really is about time politicians were locked up for their equivalent of malpractices.
The bigger reason is profit-minded middlemen taking advantage of inelastic demand to jack up prices, a problem that does not exist in other countries.
I think the ad, and you, are talking about malpractice insurance and other documentation to prove that you didn’t do malpractice.
The comment you replied to is actually taking about the underlying act of malpractice.
The first line of defenses against actual malpractice is that professionals are supposed to have some self-respect and standards. But of course our society is structured against professionalism. The insurance company or hospital admin doesn’t care if you are a real professional who does the right things when nobody is looking, that’s too hard quantify.
The ad is offering the opportunity to be a professional.
Throwing politicians into courts and prison after due legal process for crimes they actually commit is an aspect of a healthy civil society.
If your judicial system is so corrupt that every accusation against a politician is a ruse manufactured by their enemies and no fair trial is possible, then you don't have a healthy civil society either way.
It's beyond frustrating to have politicians use us as rhetorical punching bags. The stereotypes they espouse about civil servants are largely inaccurate. I say this from having worked decades inside the DoD an in non-defense private sector.
Of course the opposite is true too. But it bothers me that much of the discourse on both sides tend to ignore the high functioning projects and sectors. It’s a cool professional experience to take part in.
The Air Force officer mentioned that he got a “light” version of basic training. The Navy NCO said nothing. His ROTC’s wife added that it must have been petty light, because she remembered a call from him where he mentioned that they ran out of ice cream.
In terms of physical exertion, enlisted BMT is a bit more intense. Job-specific training might be much more intense, for the handful of AFSCs that see ground combat.
If these execs were experienced engineers that needed to be embedded in a unit in the field, maybe, and definitely not at O-5. Usually these sorts of urgently-needed experts become instructors and teach troops the specific technical skills without the need for being enlisted/commissioned/warrant themselves.
Someone more familiar with the political games inside the Pentagon will better understand this decision.
When outside the wire we would, of course, follow the directions of the army escorts because they were unequivocally in charge. The only time I can remember anyone chastising us was because we were getting overly aggressive in traffic up in the Kurdish region and there was an incident the previous day where some mayor's son had his engine block shot out so they were like, "you guys need to cut that shit out, these are our allies up here".
An Article 88 (or 133!) case involving these guys would be a really funny scandal, though.
In my state that only requires a DD-214 with honorable discharge and $50.
They won't actually suffer so much as a hangnail, of course, but inside their heads they're kicking Persians down the well all day every day.
At every stage of the RL expansion there has been a stunning lack of both solid direction and attention to detail. Not to mention piss poor logistics.
The default position for anything in meta/facebook is to just throw people at the problem. Which I suppose is a good match for a stereotypical view of the army.
sounds like a perfect match for the military
It’s too late to edit, but it could use significantly improve clarity/elaboration.
Yea! We can't fall behind as the worlds leading weapons manufacturer. It's important that we tap even Silicon Valley to continue producing weapons of war and death.
> This announcement doesn't surprise me at all.
Our burgeoning legacy hasn't surprised me since the 90s.
What else do you propose? NATO, NATO aligned, Ukraine, Taiwan, and Axis of Evil take each other’s hands and start singing Kumbaya?
Amen.
Are you familiar with brainwashing?
Your words, not mine.
He's so skilled he splits atoms with his mind. He probably should be president, except he's nowhere near the highest paid executive in the US. Probably not in the top 500.
What strategy would you suggest to arrive at a better price for his work?
If they're trying to modernize the strategy and direction of the organization before bringing in additional SMEs, this makes a lot of sense. Good leadership and a good direction really does matter.
After the overall direction and vision is in place, then they can bring in technical SMEs who are hopefully also direct commissioned in and not just contractors hired for a year or 2.
What are other nepotistic initiatives?
https://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/articles/2024/10/10/...
"The Army in March 2021 awarded Microsoft a 10-year contract worth up to $21.9 billion for IVAS, but the initial version of the system experienced technical difficulties with a number of soldiers experiencing dizziness, headaches or nausea after wearing the goggles."
O-5 (Lt Col, Navy Commander) would be VP / GM level stuff, GS-13 through GS-14 in the federal government
O-6 equivalent in the civilian world equates to a GS-15 in the federal government, and a senior VP in the corporate world
O-7 (brigadier general) would be an EVP level position, C-level large org
O-8 (general) would be CEO
For understanding their actual scope of responsibility I think my model is more useful.
Gets you free priority boarding on all flights you take.
But if you really want to pay more, and are flying on higher fares, getting on the plane first turns back into a perk cause you get some free booze. And your seat is now more comfortable than the airport seats (even many airport lounge seats, where the best seats can go quickly when it's busy).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purchase_of_commissions_in_t...
Maybe it's going to be a system for allowing tech companies to deploy their personal defense battalion against riots?
It was only at the end of the 17th century that Samuel Pepys introduced the officers apprenticeship, which of course, was mostly open to (again) high-born kids and people who got favors from the crown, but at least they had to have years of experience first and pass an exam. So the Royal Navy Officers were still literally nepo babies.
Horatio Nelson
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horatio_Nelson,_1st_Viscount_N...
So we're taking executives from companies that sell to the government and military to advise the military on what to adopt. And not only are we bringing them into the fold, we're commissioning so we can give them a pension in 20 years after they've recommended their own employers' services and products.
That's all it is. Normally the officers come up through the ranks and build a grift to retire and peddle back to the military (see things like BeaverFit), but Detachment 201 lets them direct commission the grift back.
Kevin Weil, that tracks...
Lieutenant colonels are the equivalent of corporate senior directors (O5). This means they could be either a battalion commander, approximate footprint of 300-500 people, or a senior staff officer for a command/division. By that point they are expected to have at least 15 years military experience.
The challenge at that level of management is writing and evaluating plans for their organization that must be able to move across the battlefield and roll up all corresponding metrics. Think of that as moving your entire office staff to a new location 50 miles away as frequently as needed. A 6 week bootcamp won’t get you that. As someone with 28 years military experience and a corporate nerd with almost 20 years experience I promise that corporate management is not the same. That part time job can suddenly feel like a full time responsibility.
The exception to this are licensed doctors and lawyers. They enter the military as captains instead of lieutenants.
If it were simply that, this is a problem the military has run into before and has solutions to it. This is something else: at best weird propaganda at worst I don't really know.
And chaplains, I think. The three professions corresponding to higher faculties in a medieval university. Many weird things in the military make more sense when you recognize them as leftovers from ancient social structures.
As there isn't really any civilian equivalent to combat branches of service, however, they won't direct commission anyone into the infrantry at that level, sure, at least not since the civil war era.
I can’t think of many worse ideas.
But here we are
U.S. Army bringing in big tech executives as lieutenant colonels - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44273067 - June 2025
Related thread (not merged but down-weighted to avoid more overlapping discussion):
I'm the CTO of Palantir. Today I Join the Army - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44270660 - June 2025 (55 comments)
Secondly, why execs instead of people with actual technical skills. Surely military execs are already better prepared at managing military than some tech execs.
Lastly, as a non-U.S. citizen the optics seem horrible to me. Fire generals/people who served "the normal way" and bring in tech execs...that's gotta piss of just about anyone who ever served as a storyline or am I totally off base here?
But recent developments with Musk, the FY26 budget proposal, and CA National Guard make me think that the Republican party is starting to fracture more, and some of them must be taking a dimmer view of Trump in the process.
That’s an assumption
A laudable goal. Let's see how that works out.
Call me conspiracy theorist if you like, but this looks to me like US Gov seeking to put a leash on the tech/AI companies, by tricking execs into getting personally exposed for things that would otherwise qualify as private business. Strategically, that's worth way more than just getting some FAANG engineers as part-time advisors.
Regardless of rank or an easy track to a commission, there's no "increasing shareholder value" incentive in the military?
What makes you think PLA soldiers and officers aren’t embedded in Chinese tech companies already? After all, their executive boards usually have CCP “representation”.
hope franchise film that build dystopian future (ehm ehm ehm T1000 flashback) did not happen
The first thing I did when I met the real soldiers was to clarify that I got the grade for reasons, but that I absolutely am a civil and have no intent to be a bighead asshole who will boss them around just because that have less bars on the shoulders than I was given.
We started from a very, very good foot and had a wonderful collaboration.
Just do not pretend to be what you're not and things will be fine.
But it's most common for medical skills training, and very unusual to bring them in at this rank. Even MDs typically come in around O-3 (Captain/equivalent).
[1]https://www.army.mil/article/106407/direct_commission_course...
aspenmayer•1d ago
https://archive.is/pGSZO