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Show HN: I replaced vector databases with Git for AI memory (PoC)

https://github.com/Growth-Kinetics/DiffMem
20•alexmrv•54m ago•0 comments

Code review can be better

https://tigerbeetle.com/blog/2025-08-04-code-review-can-be-better/
225•sealeck•8h ago•114 comments

Data, objects, and how we're railroaded into poor design (2018)

https://www.tedinski.com/2018/01/23/data-objects-and-being-railroaded-into-misdesign.html
27•dvrp•2h ago•2 comments

Epson MX-80 Fonts

https://mw.rat.bz/MX-80/
65•m_walden•3d ago•11 comments

Show HN: I was curious about spherical helix, ended up making this visualization

https://visualrambling.space/moving-objects-in-3d/
730•damarberlari•17h ago•122 comments

SK hynix dethrones Samsung as world’s top DRAM maker

https://koreajoongangdaily.joins.com/news/2025-08-15/business/tech/Thanks-Nvidia-SK-hynix-dethrones-Samsung-as-worlds-top-DRAM-maker-for-first-time-in-over-30-years/2376834
119•ksec•3d ago•43 comments

A statistical analysis of Rotten Tomatoes

https://www.statsignificant.com/p/is-rotten-tomatoes-still-reliable
113•m463•7h ago•43 comments

Universal Tool Calling Protocol (UTCP)

https://github.com/universal-tool-calling-protocol/python-utcp
15•edweis•2d ago•5 comments

Why are anime catgirls blocking my access to the Linux kernel?

https://lock.cmpxchg8b.com/anubis.html
445•taviso•16h ago•459 comments

Mirror Ball Emoji Proposal (2018) [pdf]

https://www.unicode.org/L2/L2019/19310-mirror-ball-emoji.pdf
23•michalc•3d ago•7 comments

Gemma 3 270M re-implemented in pure PyTorch for local tinkering

https://github.com/rasbt/LLMs-from-scratch/tree/main/ch05/12_gemma3
360•ModelForge•17h ago•52 comments

Python f-string cheat sheets (2022)

https://fstring.help/cheat/
12•shlomo_z•2h ago•1 comments

Launch HN: Channel3 (YC S25) – A database of every product on the internet

112•glawrence13•15h ago•64 comments

Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

https://petapixel.com/2025/08/20/home-depot-sued-for-secretly-using-facial-recognition-technology-on-self-checkout-cameras/
99•mikece•15h ago•86 comments

The Pleasure of Patterns in Art

https://thereader.mitpress.mit.edu/why-repetition-in-art-pleases-the-brain/
23•prismatic•3h ago•2 comments

SimpleIDE

https://github.com/jamesplotts/simpleide
61•impendingchange•7h ago•26 comments

Show HN: PlutoPrint – Generate PDFs and PNGs from HTML with Python

https://github.com/plutoprint/plutoprint
113•sammycage•10h ago•25 comments

Sequoia backs Zed

https://zed.dev/blog/sequoia-backs-zed
367•vquemener•19h ago•225 comments

French firm Gouach is pitching an Infinite Battery with replaceable cells

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/05/gouach-wants-you-to-insert-and-pluck-the-cells-from-its-infinite-e-bike-battery/
90•pabs3•3d ago•71 comments

Show HN: Luminal – Open-source, search-based GPU compiler

https://github.com/luminal-ai/luminal
108•jafioti•15h ago•52 comments

Project to formalise a proof of Fermat’s Last Theorem in the Lean theorem prover

https://imperialcollegelondon.github.io/FLT/
106•ljlolel•12h ago•71 comments

An Update on Pytype

https://github.com/google/pytype
169•mxmlnkn•14h ago•56 comments

Zedless: Zed fork focused on privacy and being local-first

https://github.com/zedless-editor/zed
466•homebrewer•12h ago•259 comments

Introduction to AT Protocol

https://mackuba.eu/2025/08/20/introduction-to-atproto/
156•psionides•12h ago•80 comments

Coris (YC S22) Is Hiring

https://www.ycombinator.com/companies/coris/jobs/rqO40yy-ai-engineer
1•smaddali•10h ago

Advice for Tech Non-Profits

https://mitchellh.com/writing/advice-for-tech-nonprofits
37•ksec•6h ago•9 comments

OPA maintainers and Styra employees hired by Apple

https://blog.openpolicyagent.org/note-from-teemu-tim-and-torin-to-the-open-policy-agent-community-2dbbfe494371
126•crcsmnky•15h ago•42 comments

Tidewave Web: in-browser coding agent for Rails and Phoenix

https://tidewave.ai/blog/tidewave-web-phoenix-rails
280•kieloo•21h ago•52 comments

Pixel 10 Phones

https://blog.google/products/pixel/google-pixel-10-pro-xl/
389•gotmedium•13h ago•772 comments

Creating 3D Worlds with HTML and CSS (2013)

https://keithclark.co.uk/articles/creating-3d-worlds-with-html-and-css/
27•razodactyl•6h ago•6 comments
Open in hackernews

Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

https://petapixel.com/2025/08/20/home-depot-sued-for-secretly-using-facial-recognition-technology-on-self-checkout-cameras/
99•mikece•15h ago

Comments

usbpoet•15h ago
What's the purpose of the green square, anyways? Why not just have a regular camera feed?
nfinished•15h ago
Lazy subcontracted software engineers
mytailorisrich•15h ago
It could a psychological trick: Look the camera is filming and we got your face specifically, so don't try to steal.

In my local supermarket, the screen turns on and shows the face of the customer when they select "finish and pay", which I suspect is to give a "honesty nudge".

theamk•15h ago
Increase deterrence effect to scare away shoplifters.

Home depot goes out of the way to make its cameras visible. There is a large "camera" sign, bright light to catch your attention, a visible display to show it's not a fake, and sometimes even a motion activated chime. I assume the green square around the face is the next step in a game.

kjkjadksj•14h ago
The shoplifters don’t care. Look at any hardware section at homedepot. Half the bags are ripped open. Try and find some stock they say is there online. Its not it already got stolen. The registers is not where they need to be combatting theft. It is everywhere else in that store.
pants2•13h ago
Ironically, Home Depot is the only store I ever shoplifted from because of a bad UX on their app. They have/had a "shop in store" mode, where you can scan an item and pay for it in the app. So I scan and pay and leave.

A few days later I get an email "your item hasn't been picked up and you've been refunded."

Apparently if you scan an item and pay for it in the store they still expect you to wait for their staff to approve you, or something. It wasn't clear.

This was also only necessary because they didn't accept Apple pay so I had no way of paying for my items except through the app.

m463•6h ago
I hate the beeping cameras in the tools aisle and frequently stop browsing and leave

also locked cabinets... cause me to not buy whatever is in them.

delichon•15h ago
The green box around his face in the image is evidence that it detected a face, but not that it had collected or stored identifying biometrics. It would be legal for a POS device to detect any face, e.g. to help decide when to reset for the next customer. But as I understand it, this would usually be enough to trigger discovery, where he could learn the necessary technical details.

Even if this suit fails, the store is vulnerable to continuous repeats by other parties. Written consent from each customer is the only viable protection. So the BIPA law may mean that face detection, not just recognition, is not practical in Illinois.

m463•6h ago
It still "recognizes a face" and shows this. Legal terms do not have to be scientific or engineering terms.
mlyle•1h ago
Detecting a face is not the same as recognizing a face in either engineering parlance or typical usage.

If I don't determine this is a face that I've seen before, I've not recognized the face (maybe I have recognized that there is a face there).

To recognize entails re-cognizing: knowing again what was previously known. Simply noticing that something is a face does not satisfy that; it is only detecting. Without linking it to prior knowledge, recognition hasn’t occurred.

m463•1h ago
but just think about other things.

Like the google 'incognito' mode that wasn't private browsing, and google was found guilty.

engineers might say "of course it's not private" but the court opinion differed.

common sense to a normal person might not match engineer thinking.

FridayoLeary•15h ago
Sounds like the guy is fishing here. Theres no proof in the article that Home Depot is actually storing his information. I'm personally pretty suspicious about the cameras at self checkouts and at the entrance of supermarkets, but this lawsuit looks like a waste of time, or this is a really badly written article.
mixmastamyk•15h ago
Not our first rodeo. Post 2010 we ask for evidence data collection is not happening, and not being sold for $$$.
bigstrat2003•1h ago
You can't prove something is not happening, nor even provide evidence. So that would be a quite unreasonable standard if that truly is what you think we should enact.
scyzoryk_xyz•1h ago
Well, you can if you're suing a company or entity and there is a complete picture of the situation collected. This isn't a criminal case - I would not be surprised if this isn't about setting a precedent. The result clarifying boundaries for what can and what can't be done.
JohnFen•15h ago
I have developed an extreme distrust of self-checkout systems generally, in part because of the risk of this sort of thing. As a result, I simply don't use them at all anymore.
add-sub-mul-div•14h ago
Isn't it safe to assume there's face or gait recognition all around stores though? In general, if not most places yet then inevitably soon. It's only an issue here because of an Illinois law, how many states don't have that?
JohnFen•12h ago
Well, I do try to choose where I shop in part to reduce the amount of spying I'm subjected to, but yes, this is of course a risk.

However, where a store might be spying on me when I'm just doing my shopping, it's guaranteed they're spying on me if I'm using self-checkout.

Honestly, though, the privacy invasion is only part of why I don't do self-checkout. Another major part is that I don't want to risk the store thinking that I stole something from them.

beaviskhan•12h ago
I don't use them when it's an option - but Home Depot in particular often has zero actual cashiers. They've always got a couple people standing around in self checkout to assist when the system (inevitably?) doesn't work properly, though...
frosted-flakes•11h ago
HD has really good self checkouts though. They don't require any interaction with the touch screen except hitting "Done", nor do they have over-sensitive anti-theft scale systems.

It's just a wireless barcode scanner on a table with a receipt printer and a payment terminal. The screen shows everything you've scanned with pictures! and legible product descriptions, which makes it really easy to make sure you scanned everything correctly.

seany•46m ago
When they were first rolled out you had to weigh everything or get a person to come over _per item_ ... It was total Insanity.
UltraSane•36m ago
Target and Aldi don't use a scale. Costco does, but I bet it works better for Costco because they carry much less items so weights are more unique?

HyVee actually removed all self-checkouts. This sucks because they had awesome self-checkouts with conveyor belts.

c22•11h ago
When I am being abused by a faceless corporation I simply withdraw my business entirely and direct my capital towards a competitor. Sometimes this is very inconvenient for me, but change has to start somewhere, right?
neuralRiot•10h ago
Exactly this, last time I went to HD I had a cart with maybe 20 items, NONE of the working self-checkouts accepted cash so I just walked out with empty hands. Now I decided that if a place doesn’t have human cashiers I just don’t shop there and give priority to small stores, I might pay more but at least I know the profits are for a neighbor.
UltraSane•35m ago
I have not used cash in years. My Citi doublecash card gets 2% cashback.
tzs•2h ago
In the HDs I've seen the customer service counter has a couple cash registers and is staffed. I assume the registers are there so they can check out people who are there to pick up an item that they ordered for pickup, but they will also handle regular checkouts.
UltraSane•37m ago
I exclusively use self-checkout because the lines move faster because one line feeds multiple self-checkouts vs each regular checkout having its own line. This leads to head of line blocking from very customers with a lot more items than you.
legitster•15h ago
My understanding of these systems is that the green box just detects a face to a) make it easier to scan hours of footage later looking for faces b) add a subtle intimidation factor against crime.

Is a picture of a face count as "biometric" information? I strongly doubt it and suspect this case will be thrown out.

bgwalter•15h ago
Don't use self-checkouts. You do all the work, slower than the cashier, and are treated like cattle. Often there is a supervisor breathing down your neck and demanding the receipt before the exit doors open. Now there is facial recognition.
richwater•14h ago
> slower than the cashier...Often there is a supervisor breathing down your neck

Not sure what stores you're going to go but this is nowhere near my experience.

bgwalter•14h ago
You scan faster than a trained cashier? Do the self-checkouts in the US use RFID? Here in the EU I have to scan, clumsily and slowly.
ac29•14h ago
If the option is waiting in line for a cashier versus going to an open self checkout (this is almost always the case where I shop), then yes, self checkout is faster.

Even aside from the line, the only thing clerks are sometimes faster at in my experience is ringing up fresh produce where codes have to be typed in (these codes are usually on a label on the produce, but if not you have to go through a lookup procedure if you haven't memorized the code).

RiverCrochet•14h ago
In the U.S., particularly the Walmarts I've been to, cashiers are usually slower than the self-checkouts now.

Their self-checkouts used to be slow because the registers would verify the weight of items on the scale (the surface where you bag it) before letting you put it in the cart. If it didn't like the weight it would force you to put it back in the bag. I don't think they do this anymore. Asset protection can view a camera pointed at the scanner and bags if they think you're stealing.

Furthermore, it's hard for Walmart to retain people, so cashiers are treated like a dump stat. They won't really dedicate people to checking out anymore unless that's all they can do, e.g. elderly, so someone who's a cashier all day tends to be slow because they're accomodating that person. So you could be the fastest cashier in the world but it won't mean anything as far as raises, etc. Your fast cashiers are often pulled off and stocking unless its super busy.

lotsoweiners•6h ago
Last week I went to Walmart and went through self checkout. Probably about $100 of groceries. After paying and clicking to print the receipt there was an error with the receipt printer. They changed the paper but the error remained. They gave me a “trust me bro” you won’t get stopped and sent me on my way. I could have made a fuss but didn’t have anything I would have returned anyways. A bit off putting in how they handled it though.
namibj•13h ago
Bold of you to assume Walmart and the like train their cashier's on speed.

(I wish I was kidding; discounters that squeeze costs everywhere including cashier throughput seem to be the exception in retail.)

os2warpman•13h ago
I was a trained cashier many years ago because I didn't grow up privileged so I had to work retail (and dishwasher and waiter) jobs.

Not only do I have the muscle memory, still after 30 years, I also have the added incentive of knowing the value of my own time, not being fatigued from hours of work, the ability pre-position items in the cart at an optimal orientation for handling and scanning, and foreknowledge of what items I have and a plan for how best to bag them that was made prior to my arrival at self-checkout.

So, yeah, I scan faster.

Much faster.

edit: oh man this has brought up a bunch of frustrations. Why do customers just pile shit on the counter? When I interact with a cashier, like at a gas station on a long road trip, every item I place on the counter has the barcodes oriented towards the person, so they can just "zap zap zap zap" the items rapid-fire without handling them. My bag (I live in a civilized state that has banned plastic bags) is ready and waiting, items are organized and presented in an order that make sense for ease of bagging. My payment method is ready. The experience is efficient and quick.

It takes no mental effort to do any of this and yet I am constantly stuck behind people who act as though they are purchasing things for the first time in their entire lives and the process is as foreign to them as communicating in the language of an extraterrestrial intelligence is to me.

neuralRiot•10h ago
Awesome, what do you do with all the full 20secs saved? Jokes apart I’ve made the decision, after a near-death experience, to never rush anywhere for any reason, to live every minute and to enjoy even stupid moments like waiting in line, I might be wrong but I’m sure happier than before.
os2warpman•10h ago
Rushing leads to errors. I don't rush. I also don't anti-rush. Dawdle?

But to answer your question, after a year I use those 30 extra minutes to play Sonic the Hedgehog six or seven times, nibbling on an ice cream sandwich between acts and zones, a sandwich that eventually melts and makes a great mess of things including all over my Genesis controller, which I clean in the kitchen while looking out the window over the sink.

AmVess•2h ago
Trained cashier? The local Lowe's and HD have little old ladies running the checkouts. They can't even lift most of the things I am buying, and have to scan them myself.

Supermarkets usually have old slow people running them. The only time I don't use self checkout is when I have alcohol, and it is slower every single time than doing it myself.

andrewflnr•2h ago
The line for self-checkout is usually faster, often nonexistent. That easily eats any marginal benefit a fast cashier might offer for my 1 to 5 items.
tzs•2h ago
In the specific case of Walmart I use the "scan and go" feature of their app, so I scan the items using my phone's camera as I take them off the shelf.
danpalmer•1h ago
I spend less time in the self-checkout queue than in the cashier queue. Overall much faster. And I don't think that's just because the shops have chosen to have more self-checkouts, it's a matter of floor space - self checkouts are much denser so they can get much more throughput.
deathanatos•39m ago
Even a trained cashier cannot scan as fast as a trained cashier on these systems; they're slow by design. I got reasonably fast (but not cashier fast) on Safeway's and hit a wall: I kept running into false positive "unidentified item in bagging area", followed by clerk overrides. I eventually figured out that you can't place the item into the bagging area until the computer has processed it — there's a delay between the "beep" of the barcode scanner recognizing a barcode and the computer adding the item to the tab & then announcing the purchase, and you cannot hit the scale prior to that or it gets out of sync with you.

Also the only place truly training cashiers, AFAICT, is Aldi's.

HiroshiSan•14h ago
At my Walmart there is roughly 10-15 self checkouts vs 3 cashiers where people with full carts are waiting in line. Self checkout is great if you have a few items. Also cashiers aren’t that fast considering they have to scan, bag (in some places) and then take your payment.

Some self checkouts are better than others the worst ones are the ones that don’t let you take your items off the scale after scanning and then they throw an error for you to put them back.

I’ve also never felt treated like cattle but I’d figure a checkout with a cashier is more cattle like since you are being funneled through a tight space one after the other vs an open space like self checkouts.

bgwalter•14h ago
If no one used the self-checkouts there would be 15 cashiers.
redserk•14h ago
There is no evidence anecdotal or otherwise to back this assertion.

Many stores near me appeared to cut cashiers before they added self-checkouts. If anything, adding self-checkouts increased the number of available options to get out of the store faster.

I'd place my bets on curbside pickup getting pushed more before cashiers get added given how popular it's become as an option.

bgwalter•14h ago
My anecdotal evidence is that one of the supermarkets I go to had 4-7 active cashiers and no self-checkout. After a complete redesign and renovation they have two active cashiers and self-checkouts. The self-checkout is closed unless there is a supervisor.
fragmede•13h ago
No, there wouldn't be. Having to have 15 people on staff and manage them and pay them is a big cost to the store owners. Self checkout machine costs $xx,000, amortized over 10 years, vs $15/hr and other overhead for a human being.
neuralRiot•10h ago
In my experience usually there is 10+ self checkout lines of which maybe half of them are open, only 2 accept cash and the line for self checkout is 3x longer coupled with the fact that people take roughly 10-15secs per item + 10-15secs to find the “finish and pay” button, 15-20secs to pull out their card, or phone, 5-6 secs to get the receipt and leave. If there is a single elderly person on the line or somebody buying an item that needs the employee “blessing” then then that time might reach the full minute.
add-sub-mul-div•14h ago
I drive to the store, pick things up off the shelf, carry them all around the store, take them to my car, drive home, bring them into the house, but moving the items twelve inches across a bar code reader is "work"? I need some low paid worker to do that trivial part so I can feel some sort of status of having been served?
_DeadFred_•13h ago
No, it's to offload the burden/liability of being accused of shoplifting. If a cashier messes up, it's on the store. If you do, it's on you. Thanks but I'm not willing to assume that liability with little benefit to me.
ethagnawl•2h ago
I have no doubt that you've experienced all of the above but I'd hazard that it's the exception and not the rule.

Personally, I'm faster at scanning items than most cashiers are. I used to work in retail, though, so maybe that's just me.

I haven't ever experienced a receipt check while using self-checkout. If I did, I'd stop visiting that store. That's a bright red line for me. To my partner's chagrin, it's one of the reasons I won't go into Costco.

While self-checkout is less private in a lot of ways (see article) I value it because I have social anxiety and would prefer to avoid too much (or too little!) smalltalk with cashiers -- especially about the items I'm buying.

bigstrat2003•1h ago
> I haven't ever experienced a receipt check while using self-checkout. If I did, I'd stop visiting that store. That's a bright red line for me.

Not self checkout related, but the Kroger stores by me have all started having security guards check receipts before you can leave the store. They do this whether or not you do self checkout. Accordingly, I have stopped patronizing those stores because I refuse to spend my money at a business that treats me like a criminal. I sympathize in that they are trying to stop theft, but I'm not going to put up with that particular method of deterrence.

seany•42m ago
Not sure what state you're in, but in most places you can just walk by then with zero legal issues (excluding contractual obligations like costco)
eth0up•14h ago
I frequent the Home Despot and Lowe Life's, until recently, traditionally favoring the Home Despot.

The last two visits revealed the complete elimination of checkout lines and the appearance of a new cluster of self service registers with a new orientation perpendicular to the old lines. As I stood before the register, looking at the large monitor, I watched my dehumanized face beleaguered by green lines. I realized it had no other purpose but to foist an impression of my dirty face toward me, conveying my position as a filthy, groveling consumer pestering them with my petty needs. The camera could easily do its work without the hostile display, but then the customer may get away with a sense of dignity, which to them would be a form of shoplifting, or squandered neuromarketing potential.

During each visit, I make it a point to express my contempt for this to any ostensibly human employees nearby. I do so respectfully, yet their pride as high priests of home improvement and the glorious providence of private equity that blesses their sacred mission always results in perceived offense. Despite prefacing my grievance as not directed personally at them, the allure of indignance prevails and I always walk away as the bad guy who dared piss on their holy gilded ground.

Their use of cameras bothers me for different reasons, but I'm glad to fan the flames.

os2warpman•13h ago
>I realized it had no other purpose but to foist an impression of my dirty face toward me, conveying my position as a filthy, groveling consumer pestering them with my petty needs.

I look at myself and go "damn that's one sexy dude I'm gonna jut out my chin and stand up straight so if anyone looks at this, they fall in love with me".

Also, the staff doesn't identify as anything except someone trying to make it through their day.

eth0up•13h ago
I think a bit of Peter Principle and role enmeshment is at play here. Halo effect? Moral disengagement?

Or perhaps it's truly pure gratitude and warm hearted loyalty for having a job, any job, which our future suggests won't be very common soon.

On a more serious note, I don't think it's terribly valid to dismiss these behaviors (Home Despot mug shaming, not zealous employee bots) as nothing more than a fun opportunity to admire one's reflection. It may not by itself be a keystone stride on the path of anomie, but it's a stride indeed and I don't want that kind of society. Maybe you do. Home Depot and Blackrock certainly do. I don't.

themafia•2h ago
> always results in perceived offense.

If you think the company has contempt for you then you might try to see what they put new employees through. If you feel lucky just to be able to complete your transaction then you shouldn't have to wonder hard what it's like to feel lucky just to receive a paycheck without any notes or veiled corporate threats attached.

The gamification of society has reduced us all to cattle.

ProllyInfamous•9h ago
Home Depot's self-checkouts are using this facial ID to build/maintain their shoplifting database — this tracks thefts by the same person across multiple visits, and is used over time to build up a case against errant self-checkout-ers (i.e. to get them above a theft threshhold, at which point prosecution becomes easier).

There is also CCTV AI (whether artificial intelligence, or actually indians) which can intervene with your self-checkout process to "remind" you that you didn't actually scan everything.

AngryData•1h ago
Im not sure we should allow such premeditated charge stacking, it is just further weaponizing the law and fueling our prison industrial complex for zero gain to society. Who is to say many of those people wouldn't have stopped after being caught and charged the first time? Imagine if cops sat on the side of the road not pulling people over, just recording minor traffic offenses in a file, and then a year or so later drop 10+ charges on a person all at once and turning the collective charges into felony reckless driving charges? People would be outraged and nothing of worth would be gained.
pests•1h ago
Target is also known for building cases over time until more serious charges can be used.
widforss•1h ago
What you're describing is essentially the exact point system used for traffic infractions in many countries over the world. Driving 10 km/h above the speed limit? No biggie, you pay a fine. Do it three times? We take your license.
fluoridation•1h ago
No, not "do it three times". "Get fined for it three times." That's the key difference; there's feedback from the system that's supposed to act as a corrective. What's being discussed here would be taking away someone's license sight unseen, with no previous lesser punishment having been administered.
Ekaros•1h ago
Well, maybe there should be some sort of public registry where this sort of in process evidence would be publicly viable for you and others. Then you could regularly check it.
fluoridation•1h ago
If the store is going to be tracking this information, it could just as easily show a message to the offender. "Hey, we're on to you. Knock it off, or else." Going straight for the jugular is just rude.
Ekaros•1h ago
Not as rude as stealing in first place. These are sociopathic criminals we are talking here about. They deserve no sympathy.
GOD_Over_Djinn•1h ago
Stealing from Home Depot doesn’t make you a “sociopathic criminal”. It’s shoplifting, not murder. Besides, people who are stealing building supplies are probably doing it because they’re hard up for money and trying to make more on whatever jobs they have. They’re not stealing some random superfluous consumer goods, they’re just broke and trying to make a little more money.

It’s really not that hard to understand - unless you exist solely in the white collar Silicon Valley bubble and have never known a struggle in your life. The fact that you think they “deserve no sympathy” is straight up creepy. Who are you, Marie Antoinette? Who is the real sociopath here?

pastage•47m ago
> white collar Silicon Valley bubble

This is not helping. You should not make up an enemy that does not exist.

There are many otherwise "sane" people that like punishment, many of these people are the ones that has led a life of struggle. Go back to the reason of an eye for an eye, it is compelling even if it has been disproven.

fluoridation•1h ago
So are we talking about minimizing theft or maximizing justifiable human suffering?
Ekaros•1h ago
Clearly the system people have voted in has failed to minimize theft as it is left unprosecuted too often. Thus rational and moral actors have to work inside system people voted for. And that is to reach state where crimes are properly prosecuted.
fluoridation•59m ago
It has failed to eliminate it, is what you mean. Do you want to minimize theft at the expense of any other concern?
Ekaros•1h ago
Seems like proper punishment is only way to get deterrent effect. Or the courts to do their job. So to me this sounds like workable way, stack up the habitual offenders and send them to jail for a few months to few years setting them on straight path.
fluoridation•1h ago
I feel like if the rules are going to change like this, they should change fairly. A few months in jail for what would have been petty crime if not for the repetition seems excessive. If right now there's a lower cash value threshold for prosecution, the fair thing is that there should be a lower rate threshold. For example, someone shouldn't be jailed for stealing a thousand dollars worth of batteries over the course of ten years, I don't think.
cortesoft•1h ago
Do you have ANY evidence that sending someone to jail for a few months to a few years sets people on a straight path?

I am pretty sure the evidence shows the opposite.

AlecSchueler•1h ago
It's shocking at times to see such these ideas parroted in a community that prides itself on critical thinking. Punishment isn't rehabilitation!
Ekaros•57m ago
So why we are even using it anymore? Why not then close down all the prisons? If there is no deterrent effect or rehabilitation effect. Wouldn't it be greater savings just to close it all down and let everyone out?
pastage•57m ago
Rehabilitation and support is not what "people" want. Political parties that want more punishment seldom want to spend money even on punishments. So it becomes impossible to put people on a straight path. Having courts do their job is very expensive as well so instead people build their careers on getting fast convictions of people. The thing that helps is consistently building a society that cares, you have to know that the society will certainly react to your actions.

Having a hidden social credit system hidden and managed by a private actor seems like the worst way of doing it.

the_third_wave•1h ago
Time to change your laws and/or prosecutors I'd say so those 'minor thefts' can and will be prosecuted resulting in fines which need to be paid - no ifs and buts. Get them early and get them (hopefully not that) often and you may be able to keep the majority of 'proletarian shoppers' on a somewhat less crooked path. If crime pays more people commit crimes, if shoplifting is not dealt with more people shoplift.
novok•54m ago
Or if your dealing with forgetful / tech confused old people. Now your putting 75 year olds in jail when a sooner alerting system would've made them notice if they were not using it correctly.
danpalmer•1h ago
> i.e. to get them above a theft threshhold, at which point prosecution becomes easier

This feels like it should be illegal. Holding back on reporting or prosecuting until you think you're more likely to get a conviction or a bigger conviction, feels close to entrapment.

To do otherwise is just unnecessarily vindictive, showing that it's the punishment that matters more than the prevention.

freddie_mercury•27m ago
Is it really any different than the thief who steals things just under the felony limit...but does it every day?

In Texas the felony limit is $2,500. Is stealing $1000 on Monday, $1000 on Tuesday, and $1000 on Wednesday really so much better than stealing $3,000 on Monday?

stephen_g•33m ago
I've noticed at supermarkets here that of the dozens of times those 'you haven't scanned something' warnings have come up, only one time the item hadn't actually scanned when I thought it had. Every other time has been a false positive for me. They're pretty dodgy, the workers always seem pretty frustrated with it as they go around clearing them for people (sometimes a handful of people waiting, falsely accused by the machines)...
bcraven•2m ago
This is an important observation as you now have a mechanism to obtain free things from the megacorp of your choosing.
neilv•1h ago
I'm pretty sick of misguided/enthusiastic Loss Prevention people, and these digital systems amplify their hijinks.

The most conspicuous one recently was at one upscale grocery chain within the last year. There was what I took to be a dedicated LP person who seemed to be lurking behind the self-checkouts, to watch me specifically, and I stood there until he went away. Then, as I was checking out, this employee came up behind me and very persistently told me that I hadn't scanned something. Annoyed, I pointed on the screen where it showed I had. His eyes went wide, and he spun around, and quickly hurried away, no apology.

If I had to guess, I'd say they didn't code that intervention/confrontation as their mess-up, and I wouldn't be surprised if I still got dinged as suspicious, to cover their butts.

We do seem to have a lot of shoplifting here in recent years. And I have even recently seen a street person in a chain pharmacy here, simply tossing boxes of product off the shelves, into a dingy black trash bag, in the middle of the day. Somehow none of the usual employees around. Yet there's often employees moving to stand behind me at that same store, when I use their self-checkout. (Maybe my N95 mask is triggering some association with masked bandits, yet bearded street person with big trash bag full of product makes them think of lovable Santa? But an N95 is a good idea in a pharmacy on a college campus, where the Covid factories that are college students will go when they have symptoms.)

neilv•1h ago
Less relevant, but reminds me of my all-time favorite grocery store LP encounter, near MIT. The chain was running this big promotion with lots of tear-open prize tickets that are either coupons or game board pieces, so I had been visiting often, to buy ramen noodles (one ticket per package!) and I had a small stack of coupons in my wallet. I was checking my coupons for this visit in the middle of a center aisle, and was returning my wallet to my back pocket, when this nice middle-aged probably church-going woman store employee walked up, looked at me, and the "oh!" expression on her face said she was very surprised that I was stealing. She hurried off. When I get to the checkout, this middle-aged guy acting a bit like a drunk comes behind me and boxes me in, by sprawling across both the lane and the conveyor. The young checkout woman says to him, annoyed, "Not you again." The guy strikes up a conversation with me. "That's a nice backpack. ... If I had a backpack like that, people would think I was stealing something." It was an ordinary cheap bare-bones store-branded backpack. He's getting close to illegally detaining me, which would go extremely badly for him. To de-escalate, I do my best folksy code-switching, and pretend not to know what's going on. My hyperobservant mode also kicked in: there was abnormal maneuvers of multiple people from the other side of the checkouts. One young guy coming up with the others, my eyes dark to him, he sees I see him, and for some reason gets a look like he's noping the f right out of whatever is going down, and he spins 180 and quickly walks away. Eventually, this friendly and sensible person, who I took to be the manager on duty, comes up on the other side of the checkout, and we have a friendly conversation about the ticket promotion. I think she immediately realized that I was a good-natured MIT type, not a shoplifter. And I would guess she thought the LP guy was a clown who risks getting the store sued someday.
47282847•6m ago
I make it a point not to use self-checkout systems because I want to support human interaction even if basic, and contribute to jobs for humans. And cash (most self-checkouts here are card-only).

I understand it’s a losing battle on all fronts.